Quote i got from machinist
- Thread starter loki2043
- Start date
figgie said:
So lets call names dude.... no need to flame. There is nothing ignorant about what I posted. I do not work for a company on cars. I got my ASE cert on my own accord and do automotive work as a HOBBY.
The first engine I built cost WAY WAY WAY too much for machine work - Im trying to help a brotha out. IMO you guys are the ones screwing him because you arent giving him any advice on how to save any money. If he would just familiarize himself a little more on the terminology and go into the machine shop knowing exactly what he wants and needs he could save a few hundred bucks. I think he should get a second opinion.
Sure, Duane and others have a "properly" built 7M. But for 700 bucks to the door you can have a 2jzge shipped. This motor will already be capable of 600+hp with a thicker head gasket. www.clubna-t.com Check out what DaveH is doing.
p5150 said:
Bud,
listen up
having that cert in your field DOES get you discounts.
as for the 2jz. Sorry man, used is used no matter how you cut it or how much you pay for it. Especially jDm tyteness y0 with unknown mileage, upkeep etc!!.
Price does not signify anything as you build it wrong, or do not do upkeep and it WILL still pop. Seen it more than numerous times on "bulletproof" engines.
Bullet Proof, YES!
Stupid Proof, big fat NOPE!
as for DaveH, congrats to him. But he is far from the first to invest that little money. Incase you are wondering Hot Rod Magazine did a junk yard build up. Paid a little over $300 for thier 350. In the end the entire project was less than $1000 and the motor was pumping out a nice 600 hp.
p5150 said:
If the shop actually has the right equipment to surface the deck with the RA required, they will not charge less then $75. I know I place I can get a head surfaced for $25, and it looks like crap because it's done on a big belt sander.
I pay $100 to surface a deck and $100 to surface a head, and I pay with a big smile on my face because I know how good it will be.
People will show off all their aftermarket stuff and how clean and nice it is, but how many show off how clean their engine looks on the inside?
If the difference between getting your engine done at a half ass machine shop and a great machine shop is $250, I'll pay the $250 for piece of mind if nothing else.
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JustAnotherVictim
Supramania Contributor
Bud,
My cert is irrelivant. I got it after I started doing business with them. Its all about how you conduct yourself and the machine shop you work with. Some other shops do worse work and charge more. I shopped around. I got a good company. Nuff said.
Its not JDM, its USDM, the cross hatch is still on the cylinder wall, and every component in the engine measures perfectly in spec.
Why do you keep implying that I "built it wrong"? WTF do you know? And you said it: "Price does not signify" So why do you keep insisting that just because I get a good rate that I am getting shoddy work?
I dont care if daveH was the first to do it - thats besides the point. The point is that HE IS USING A 2JZ AND IT IS CHEAP CHEAP CHEAP.
Thank you for helping me prove my point.
Ok, but your special shop rates because of your certification and because you know people at the shop does not apply to those are not mechanics or machinists by trade.
p5150 said:
well not cheap enough apparently as the 350 was $300 which is CHEAPER CHEAPER CHEAPER!! And since it is carb, no need for piggy backs, standalones, or any of that pricey (yes even used) nonesense
Sounds to me like you have a 2jz hardon.
bigaaron said:
I AM NOT AN AUTOMOBILE MECHANIC BY TRADE.
I DO NOT GET THE RATE BECAUSE I "KNOW PEOPLE"
For example, when asking for a valve job, I bring the head in disassembled and tell them EXACTLY what I want instead of bringing in an assembled head and saying. "Could you guys fix this" or some other vague statement like "Can I get a rebuild."
That applies to everything. Know what clearances you want. Dont go in and say "I need this crank ground and polished", say "I need this crank cut and polished and rods/mains resized. I need a .0015 clearance." Know the subject. Act like you have shopped around. You will get better prices and respect from the person working the counter.
figgie said:well not cheap enough apparently as the 350 was $300 which is CHEAPER CHEAPER CHEAPER!! And since it is carb, no need for piggy backs, standalones, or any of that pricey (yes even used) nonesense
Sounds to me like you have a 2jz hardon.
I DO have a 2jz hardon. Its kind of like when you are a teenager and you discover women...... I discovered the 2jz and perhaps someday you will too.
yes i could get it cheaper elsewhere and more expensive elsewhere.. but these guys have done tons of 7m's and are familier with them. i posted here and at sf in NW section and 90% recommended this guy. and there are a few people around the city here with 600hp 7m's that went to him.
im going to go with the whole 1000 dollar job, he said it was if it needed everything but i told him to just do it. i want it done right the first time.
i might not be pumping out any crazy numbers for power but i want a rock solid 7M.
and if it blows up, then ill prolly cry for 2 weeks, and save for my other dream car, a 94 MR2.
im going to go with the whole 1000 dollar job, he said it was if it needed everything but i told him to just do it. i want it done right the first time.
i might not be pumping out any crazy numbers for power but i want a rock solid 7M.
and if it blows up, then ill prolly cry for 2 weeks, and save for my other dream car, a 94 MR2.
Its good that you come on hear and get some of the more experienced opinions. I would and have done the same thing. As far as the cost. My machine work on block and head are the same as yours. about a grand. If it feels right to you and this guy comes highly recommended like you said, then do it. I think you got some good opinions on here to help you make your decision.
p5150 said:
just a piece of inefficent metal as all internal combustion engines are.
loki
I forgot to address your post in my retort
the price is extremly reasonable espeically if they have experience with the 7m. Make sure that if they are going to hone and overbore the cylinders. Talk to Ron Ramirez (jt2ma71) as I think he is one of two people in the US that has the torque plate for the 7m and also for the 2jz.
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I got quotes all over and paid $1700cdn for machine work head and block, cams etc.. I couldn't get it cheaper. And one place that was didn't strike me as a good place. So maybe its your area or you found a miracle spot I don't know. But it doesn't match up with the reality over here.
And if you like the 2jz so much get a mkiv. It was developed in that car. The 7m is very capable and I like having the original motor because its a bit more unknown to people yet quite powerful. After a rebuild the 7m is fine and lasts for ages modded or not so I don't see a point.
And if you like the 2jz so much get a mkiv. It was developed in that car. The 7m is very capable and I like having the original motor because its a bit more unknown to people yet quite powerful. After a rebuild the 7m is fine and lasts for ages modded or not so I don't see a point.
loki2043 said:
Well thats good that you are going with a shop that is familiar with your motor and has a good rep. I would pay a bit more for that if I wasnt very experienced.
However, I still think its a better idea to go 2jz. We'll just say that ive been reborn.
TurboWarrior said:
I dont want a MKIV because I already have a MKIII. THE JZ SERIES OF MOTORS WAS DEVELOPED IN THE MKIII. The 1J and 2J are essentially identical.
Exactly.... AFTER A REBUILD.
7m performance rebuild w/forged pistons, upgraded rods, etc = AT LEAST $2K USD
2JZGE(T) + 250 for a thicker HG and 300 for a 1jz bell housing = $1050
It doesnt make sense to rebuild a 7m unless you plan to stay completely stock or not to modify it past 450hp. Go ahead, lets talk engine specifics. Point out component superiority in the 7m.
http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33721
p5150 said:
My you make lots of assumptions......
220,000 miles on mine. Owned since 94. Never cracked the engine open. was living on a td06 for quite a while.
no BHG, car went from South Dakota to Miami, Florida (yes that means the 7m saw snow time). Miami, Florida to Minnesota, yes that also means MORE snow time until 2001 when I picked up my DD. Always reliable.
JustAnotherVictim
Supramania Contributor
p5150 said:
True the 1j was in the mkiii. when I said rebuild I wasnt refering to the block really. The stock 7m blocks are good I didn't even need to rebuild mine it was still strong. But its piece of mind going mhg. Over 450hp yes i didn't know what level we were all talking about but thats a lot of horses. Most people aren't crossing that line. If your pushing numbers beyond that realm I can see you deciding to go jz because the stock block can handle more so i do agree with you there.
Can you get a 2j with everything you need though for $1050 though? you might be spending the same in the end anyway
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figgie said:My you make lots of assumptions......
220,000 miles on mine. Owned since 94. Never cracked the engine open. was living on a td06 for quite a while.
no BHG, car went from South Dakota to Miami, Florida (yes that means the 7m saw snow time). Miami, Florida to Minnesota, yes that also means MORE snow time until 2001 when I picked up my DD. Always reliable.
Im not assuming that the stock 7m cant take any abuse, but I sure as hell dont see you putting down 500 hp with that TD06. Maybe around 400 hp? Great. Its certainly not the 600+ hp that the 2j STOCK shortblock is capable of.
My 7m was reliable too - I got 200k trouble free miles out of it. But I wasnt putting down 600 hp. If you are going to make big power just save yourself some coin and get a 2j