Plan B

[cadman]

George Hanson: They're not scared of you. They're scared of what you represent to 'em.
Billy: Hey, man. All we represent to them, man, is somebody who needs a haircut.
George Hanson: Oh, no. What you represent to them is freedom.
Billy: What the hell is wrong with freedom? That's what it's all about.
George Hanson: Oh, yeah, that's right. That's what's it's all about, all right. But talkin' about it and bein' it, that's two different things. I mean, it's real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. Of course, don't ever tell anybody that they're not free, 'cause then they're gonna get real busy killin' and maimin' to prove to you that they are. Oh, yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom. But they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em.
Billy: Well, it don't make 'em runnin' scared.
George Hanson: No, it makes 'em dangerous.

That little exchange is probably closer to the truth than most people want to admit. What is it about freedom that scares you folks so badly that you want to take it away? If you are willing to take freedom from others, how much of yours are you willing to give up? At what point do we draw the line. The bedroom isn't safe. With hate crime legistlation, thoughts aren't safe. Your medical health is not your own. Your life isn't even your own.

Where do we draw the line? How far is too far? At what point does the governments intervention in your life become more than you can stand?

How far are you willing to go to protect your children from getting STDs and getting raped? If you had a son, or daughter, would you tell them that under-aged drinking is wrong, then turn around and say "but if you do want to drink, here's a 40oz. just in case, because I don't want to get in the way of your choices." There is a right and a wrong. Sorry to break it to ya. This isn't a government thing, you're making it one yes, but it shouldn't be. What opened the doors here?

60 years ago, what was the "Norm"? Was there this huge problem with teens getting pregnant? Nope. They did, and it happened, but it wasn't this big. That's because it seen as wrong. Now, having sex is ok, no problem, there's even a pill for anything that might go wrong. Is there a big problem with teen pregnancy? Sure as hell there is, and what changed? Schools telling teens it's ok to have sex, just be careful.

Where did Fuck come from? They tried to make it a law, and stop people from having babies, did that last long, nope! Fornication Under Consent of King. FUCK. That's what I heard anyway. Now that would be a freedome issue. The pill? no, that's not even a freedome issue.

 

[figgie]

How far are you willing to go to protect your children from getting STDs and getting raped? If you had a son, or daughter, would you tell them that under-aged drinking is wrong, then turn around and say "but if you do want to drink, here's a 40oz. just in case, because I don't want to get in the way of your choices." There is a right and a wrong. Sorry to break it to ya. This isn't a government thing, you're making it one yes, but it shouldn't be. What opened the doors here?

60 years ago, what was the "Norm"? Was there this huge problem with teens getting pregnant? Nope. They did, and it happened, but it wasn't this big. That's because it seen as wrong. Now, having sex is ok, no problem, there's even a pill for anything that might go wrong. Is there a big problem with teen pregnancy? Sure as hell there is, and what changed? Schools telling teens it's ok to have sex, just be careful.

Where did Fuck come from? They tried to make it a law, and stop people from having babies, did that last long, nope! Fornication Under Consent of King. FUCK. That's what I heard anyway. Now that would be a freedome issue. The pill? no, that's not even a freedome issue.

no such thing as to protect. To inform and educate. What they choose to do with that information is up to them (life is filled with choices). If they fuck up and get pregnant/get a woman pregnant, well now they not only have the choice of abortion. Now they can down a pill down and game over for the "parasite".

<--- waits to see how many get it.

 

[cadman]

actually A choice NOW. back 60 years ago it wasn't a choice. It was thier obligation to clean, have lunch ready etc for the man. As for your view on morality. Thanksfully it is your view (morality deals with PEOPLE and my opinion on PEOPLE is as follows; People are stupid, illogical and all suffer from the lemming suicide syndrome, monkey see monkey do. A Person is smart, articulate and thoughtful by thier own accord).

thanks for the lesson, please drive through.

Back then a wife that went off to work was considered "lazy, and un-ethical". Now days a wife that stays home is considered "Lazy". It's a view. It's the way people are led to believe. Some wives actually do still stay home and take care of the kids and fix meals, because they love doing it. Some wives go to work, because they love doing it. It is a choice, it always has been.

Well you're welcome for the Moral lesson, however it didn't even sink in, it bounced right off you. And the only thing you replied back to was the only argument you thought you could make. I'd love to hear your comments on the other topics... say... the Plan B this thread is about? How about answering the comments I made?

 

[figgie]

Back then a wife that went off to work was considered "lazy, and un-ethical". Now days a wife that stays home is considered "Lazy". It's a view. It's the way people are led to believe. Some wives actually do still stay home and take care of the kids and fix meals, because they love doing it. Some wives go to work, because they love doing it. It is a choice, it always has been.

Well you're welcome for the Moral lesson, however it didn't even sink in, it bounced right off you. And the only thing you replied back to was the only argument you thought you could make. I'd love to hear your comments on the other topics... say... the Plan B this thread is about? How about answering the comments I made?

no sense in replying to your views

i deal with facts

Plan B is OTC. Making it a choice for the poeple that choose to use it. If the people that have objection of using it don't want to... HEY look at that, thier choice Whether you like it or not. That is how things are

 

[cadman]

no such thing as to protect. To inform and educate. What they choose to do with that information is up to them (life is filled with choices). If they fuck up and get pregnant/get a woman pregnant, well now they not only have the choice of abortion. Now they can down a pill down and game over for the "parasite".

<--- waits to see how many get it.

No such thing as to protect? Really? Then why don't we just learn to drive really well and forget about seat belts and air bags?

Why aren't you getting all upset about the law requiring people to wear seat belts? That's a choice, or should be, right?

Protecting our youth is to tell them that sex is to create babies. It should be up to the parents to tell the kids when and where to use it. Not the schools. And protecting your kids is to tell them that if they deside to have sex outside of marrage, they are responsible for what might happen.

Since when has protection been only about edjucation. If it were, our kids should be angels, never having sex once until it was right. Because in your statement, that would have meant that back 60 years ago, kids would have been having sex like rabbits because there was no Sex Ed. Something tells me you're a bit off on that one.

 

[cadman]

no sense in replying to your views

i deal with facts

Plan B is OTC. Making it a choice for the poeple that choose to use it. If the people that have objection of using it don't want to... HEY look at that, thier choice Whether you like it or not. That is how things are

You haven't spoke of one fact yet, just your oppinion.

Fact: Teen pregnancies are higher now than they were 60 years ago.

Fact: The Pill will greatly reduce an un-wanted pregnancy.

Fact: Since Sex Ed was made available in public schools, teen sex has risen.

Oppinion: The pill is wrong.
Oppinion: I believe the pill is causing kids to think "well hey, now I can have sex with anyone and I don't have to worry about a baby. That's a load off my mind, where's a girl?"

Your idea, with a spin: Make wearing helmets and seat belts a choice. Those that want to wear them can. Those that don't, Hey look at that, it's their choice.

And look what happens. People die when they get into an accident, instead of living.

Make the pill just a choice, and look what happens. Kids now have sex with wild abandon because there is no worrying about a baby. STDs spread like wild fire. Health care goes through the roof because now some kids that wouldn't have sex because they might get pregnant, now are having sex.

Is it wrong for a teen to have sex out of marrage with someone they just met? Well it doesn't sound like it to me. But hey lets all just have fun and not worry about anyone else. ok? That will make the world a better place right? (insert Sarcasm here)

 

[figgie]

No such thing as to protect? Really? Then why don't we just learn to drive really well and forget about seat belts and air bags?

Why aren't you getting all upset about the law requiring people to wear seat belts? That's a choice, or should be, right?

Protecting our youth is to tell them that sex is to create babies. It should be up to the parents to tell the kids when and where to use it. Not the schools. And protecting your kids is to tell them that if they deside to have sex outside of marrage, they are responsible for what might happen.

Since when has protection been only about edjucation. If it were, our kids should be angels, never having sex once until it was right. Because in your statement, that would have meant that back 60 years ago, kids would have been having sex like rabbits because there was no Sex Ed. Something tells me you're a bit off on that one.

Hmm last I checked it MIGHT be a law but I still have to get into the car and click the seat belt on which at that point becomes a CHOICE. Just like picking up a gun and pulling the trigger is a choice that no matter what law is said in the end it is still a choice.


You and all the other parents don't protect you children. WHat you do is educate them and attempt to "protect" them. It is an illusion as if the "kid" thinks you are right they will more than likely follow your lead. If they don't they will make thier own decisions.

You think you are protecting them by locking in thier room or however else you wish to "protect" them but in the end it will always be thier decision (be in when they turn 18 and take off on you or rebel at 15 and get pregnant). Again it is not protection it is education and information. What they choose to do with such knowledge unfortunatly is up to them.

 

[cadman]

Idea; to make sex wrong until marrage.
Product; people don't have sex outside of marrage as much because it's considered wrong. It still happens, but it always will. Less "unwanted" babies. No need for pill

Idea; Make sex ok before marrage, and even supply condoms.
Product; kids still get pregnant because now it's supposed to be ok, and they even give out condomes. Now the pill is needed.

For every reaction there is an equal and opposite reaction. Some time down the road right and wrong choices catch up with you.

Wrong: having sex outside of marrage, or commitment. Not many STDs, hardly any unwanted babies, no need for the pill, less care needed for STD victoms, even though some times it happens.

Right: having sex before marrage or commitment. People have sex with more than one partner. STDs spread in that way. More care, more unwanted babies. Now you need a pill. It stops that. Now you have more STDs, more teens having sex, more health care for AIDs and Herpies. (sp?)

 

[figgie]

You haven't spoke of one fact yet, just your oppinion.

Fact: Teen pregnancies are higher now than they were 60 years ago.

Fact: The Pill will greatly reduce an un-wanted pregnancy.

Fact: Since Sex Ed was made available in public schools, teen sex has risen.

where to take apart this steaming pile of dog shit of a post...

boy if you can even find one sentence in this post that is not fact. I would be more than happy to hear it.

and just for sake of your reading comprehension (since it seems non-exsistant)

no sense in replying to your views

i deal with facts

Plan B is OTC. Making it a choice for the poeple that choose to use it. If the people that have objection of using it don't want to... HEY look at that, thier choice Whether you like it or not. That is how things are

now where are they not facts in my post thier slick?

Oppinion: The pill is wrong.
Oppinion: I believe the pill is causing kids to think "well hey, now I can have sex with anyone and I don't have to worry about a baby. That's a load off my mind, where's a girl?"

Your idea, with a spin: Make wearing helmets and seat belts a choice. Those that want to wear them can. Those that don't, Hey look at that, it's their choice.

umm you can not be that stupid? last i checked in this state i actually do not have to wear a helmet when riding a motorcycle As for seat belt. I chose not to guess what. My choice regardless if it is on paper or not.

And look what happens. People die when they get into an accident, instead of living.

Make the pill just a choice, and look what happens. Kids now have sex with wild abandon because there is no worrying about a baby. STDs spread like wild fire. Health care goes through the roof because now some kids that wouldn't have sex because they might get pregnant, now are having sex.

Is it wrong for a teen to have sex out of marrage with someone they just met? Well it doesn't sound like it to me. But hey lets all just have fun and not worry about anyone else. ok? That will make the world a better place right? (insert Sarcasm here)

in the end I could put a bullet in anyone I desire or not. My choice. Law will not ever change that. Now there is consequences with those choices but perhaps I am willing to live with those consequences

if a teen wants to fuck. I don't matter what you tell them, what you tell them the consequences will be. They will do it!

 

[cadman]

Hmm last I checked it MIGHT be a law but I still have to get into the car and click the seat belt on which at that point becomes a CHOICE. Just like picking up a gun and pulling the trigger is a choice that no matter what law is said in the end it is still a choice. Right on man, you got it. It is still a choice. Right and wrong is a choice. Is it right, or wrong to drive without a safety belt?


You and all the other parents don't protect you children. WHat you do is educate them and attempt to "protect" them. It is an illusion as if the "kid" thinks you are right they will more than likely follow your lead. If they don't they will make thier own decisions.

What I'm getting is we should just feed our kids, give them a place to stay, and not give them any rules or any type of laws. That why they can make their own choices?

You think you are protecting them by locking in thier room or however else you wish to "protect" them but in the end it will always be thier decision (be in when they turn 18 and take off on you or rebel at 15 and get pregnant). Again it is not protection it is education and information. What they choose to do with such knowledge unfortunatly is up to them.

I never said I was protecting them by locking them in their room, man you have a twisted view of parenting. You right now have a choice to go out and kill someone or not. Why don't you? Because it's wrong. Who taught you that? Why is it wrong? Would you know that if you were never taught that? Stealing is wrong, at least to me it is. Where you taught that? Who did you learn that from? Do you think it's wrong to steal?

Yes, actual parents do try and protect their kids by teaching them stuff. They also protect them by not letting them go out to parties. If you tell your kid "Hey, don't go out in the road." And he does anyway, and there's a car coming, would you just stand back and say "Well that was his choice" and let him get hit? I wouldn't, I would "Protect" him/her by hauling him/her off the road even though he/she doesn't want to be moved at that time.

You have some issues :biglaugh:

 

[figgie]

Idea; to make sex wrong until marrage.
Product; people don't have sex outside of marrage as much because it's considered wrong. It still happens, but it always will. Less "unwanted" babies. No need for pill

Idea; Make sex ok before marrage, and even supply condoms.
Product; kids still get pregnant because now it's supposed to be ok, and they even give out condomes. Now the pill is needed.

For every reaction there is an equal and opposite reaction. Some time down the road right and wrong choices catch up with you.

Wrong: having sex outside of marrage, or commitment. Not many STDs, hardly any unwanted babies, no need for the pill, less care needed for STD victoms, even though some times it happens.

Right: having sex before marrage or commitment. People have sex with more than one partner. STDs spread in that way. More care, more unwanted babies. Now you need a pill. It stops that. Now you have more STDs, more teens having sex, more health care for AIDs and Herpies. (sp?)

...and I could win the lottery. This is pure speculation on your part (incase you didn't get the I could win the lottery part) and nothing else. You have zero clue what this will lead to but as all doom and gloomers before you, it has never manifested itself into reality.

 

[figgie]

I never said I was protecting them by locking them in their room, man you have a twisted view of parenting. You right now have a choice to go out and kill someone or not. Why don't you? Because it's wrong. Who taught you that? Why is it wrong? Would you know that if you were never taught that? Stealing is wrong, at least to me it is. Where you taught that? Who did you learn that from? Do you think it's wrong to steal?

Yes, actual parents do try and protect their kids by teaching them stuff. They also protect them by not letting them go out to parties. If you tell your kid "Hey, don't go out in the road." And he does anyway, and there's a car coming, would you just stand back and say "Well that was his choice" and let him get hit? I wouldn't, I would "Protect" him/her by hauling him/her off the road even though he/she doesn't want to be moved at that time.

You have some issues :biglaugh:

because it is wrong??? HAHAHAH

ooh no has ZERO to do with right or wrong. Has everything to do with a choice I choose NOT to kill someone because it is a waste of my time (notice the I in there, yes I always think about me, me, me). My time is money and alot of it.

only to an uneducated peon as yourself would i have issues. I live my life very nicely and comforatbly, why? because I never listed to morons such as yourself. I made my own conclusions for what was best for me and came out ahead. I sure as hell did not need the goverment or people like you telling my what to do

 

[cadman]

Answer these questions Figgie:

What makes us not want to do wrong things?

What makes it wrong to begin with?

Why would anyone want to do wrong things?

Would these wrong things hurt anyone else?

Why do we punish people who do wrong things?

Is doing wrong a choice? If so, what makes it a wrong choice.

Now, I'll put my answers right here:
Answer these questions Figgie,

What makes us not want to do wrong things? We get in trouble.

What makes it wrong to begin with? It hurts other people.

Why would anyone want to do wrong things? For personal gain, or selfish reasons.

Would these wrong things hurt anyone else? yes, some would

Why do we punish people who do wrong things? Because we want them to make the right choice.

Is doing wrong a choice? Yes. If so, what makes it a wrong choice. It hurts other people.

Conclusion, to first understand why I think the pill is wrong, you have to agree that the reason for having the pill is because someone did something wrong.

If you think having sex with anyone at any time without any commitment or moral obligation is right, there is no way for me to make you believe that the pill is wrong. END

 

[cadman]

In no way did I ever call you names, or make you out to be a moron or lower than me. In your last post, you tried to make me feel like I am nothing. I laughed at that. I own my own milti-million dollar company, and in no way do I hurt for anything. I did this by doing what was right, listening to my elders, and treating people with respect. Looks like we both got what we wanted.

What way seems better? Edit: in your view, there is no right way, or wrong way from what I get out of what you said. I would not want to do business with you. You don't sound trustworthy. You don't sound edjucated in what you have said. Most people that got where they are now, will tell you it's because of what they were taught, and how they delt with other people. I don't see that in you.

 

[figgie]

If you think having sex with anyone at any time without any commitment or moral obligation is right, there is no way for me to make you believe that the pill is wrong. END

I knew we were going to get to the root of this problem

Thankfully this is YOUR problem.

I have had numerous one night stands where I don't even know her name or she knows mine. Guess what? We both loved it and actually see each other to FUCK and NOTHING, I repeat nothing else.

No drinks, no food, no movies. Just call, meet, FUCK and go our own way afterwards until the time arises again. I have no problem with that and niether does she as she was the one that came up with this idea. How about you? Does it offend you to think that I am doing that?? Honestly I could give two rats asses what society thinks about that as in the end it is my choice

 

[cadman]

I knew we were going to get to the root of this problem

Thankfully this is YOUR problem.

I have had numerous one night stands where I don't even know her name or she knows mine. Guess what? We both loved it and actually see each other to FUCK and NOTHING, I repeat nothing else.

No drinks, no food, no movies. Just call, meet, FUCK and go our own way afterwards until the time arises again. I have no problem with that and niether does she as she was the one that came up with this idea. How about you? Does it offend you to think that I am doing that?? Honestly I could give two rats asses what society thinks about that as in the end it is my choice

Actually, I'm not offended at all, and at least you admit full out what you believe. Just as I do.

Would you be pissed if she had another one night stand with some other guy, who had AIDs, then before she knew she had it, she came and slept with you, and gave it to you? Or would you just admit that you were in it for the fun, and that shit happens?

 

[figgie]

In no way did I ever call you names, or make you out to be a moron or lower than me. In your last post, you tried to make me feel like I am nothing. I laughed at that. I own my own milti-million dollar company, and in no way do I hurt for anything. I did this by doing what was right, listening to my elders, and treating people with respect. Looks like we both got what we wanted.

What way seems better? Edit: in your view, there is no right way, or wrong way from what I get out of what you said. I would not want to do business with you. You don't sound trustworthy. You don't sound edjucated in what you have said. Most people that got where they are now, will tell you it's because of what they were taught, and how they delt with other people. I don't see that in you.

haha

luckily for me , the check comes from this company and no one else. so giving the apperance of being trustworthy or not is irrelevant to me. See I learned early on there are only a couple of people that I care about what they think about me.

My mom, dad and bro. Everyone else, i could care less. BTW since I know you are going to bring it up. My mom gave me choices as did my dad. Never once did they say, that was wrong, You have to do it this way or that way. No you CAN NOT do that (later in the miliraty I learned there is no such thing as CAN NOT/CAN'T)! and I am glad they let me make my own decisions. perhaps they knew I was mature enough to make my own decisions.

 

[figgie]

Actually, I'm not offended at all, and at least you admit full out what you believe. Just as I do.

Would you be pissed if she had another one night stand with some other guy, who had AIDs, then before she knew she had it, she came and slept with you, and gave it to you? Or would you just admit that you were in it for the fun, and that shit happens?

umm she does have other fuck partners. See we tend to test ourselves regularly and anyone coming into this picture has to get checked so thier are no "suprises" for all involved. We are not stupid.

 

[cadman]

umm she does have other fuck partners. See we tend to test ourselves regularly and anyone coming into this picture has to get checked so thier are no "suprises" for all involved. We are not stupid.

Then, as you are not stupid, you do know that AIDs can be transmitted even before it shows up on a test. Also, you are aware that people have choices, and those choices could be that they not being tested, but go ahead and sleeping with them. I didn't ask what you did, or how you thought you were "preventing" it. I asked how you would feel, if the girl you were having sex with, gave you AIDs.

You are putting a lot of faith into someone who doesn't even care for you enough to commit to you. You are putting a lot of trust in someone who just wants to have sex. You are putting your life on the line for someone who might not even like who you are, they are just using you for sex.

Who is stupid? I remember you saying people are only smart in their own minds.

 

[figgie]

Then, as you are not stupid, you do know that AIDs can be transmitted even before it shows up on a test. Also, you are aware that people have choices, and those choices could be that they not being tested, but go ahead and sleeping with them. I didn't ask what you did, or how you thought you were "preventing" it. I asked how you would feel, if the girl you were having sex with, gave you AIDs.

You are putting a lot of faith into someone who doesn't even care for you enough to commit to you. You are putting a lot of trust in someone who just wants to have sex. You are putting your life on the line for someone who might not even like who you are, they are just using you for sex.

Who is stupid? I remember you saying people are only smart in their own minds.

that like asking a medical worker what would they think if they get aids from a patient. Goes with the territory.

But at the same time there are NUMEROUS ways to reduce risk whether you choose to take them or not it is your responsibility.

Faith? no such thing only to a person that is religous.
using me for sex? No. Using each other for hot, passionate, lustful animal sex, yes.

and tisk tisk..

reading 101.

A person is smart, articulate thoughtful. PEOPLE on the other hand are ignorant, thoughtless and all suffer from the lemming suicide influece. Monkey see, monkey do.

I find it funny that the lot of you are aruing against this when literally the decision was made already

<--- Goes to buy Plan B OTC because I can and spite the lot of you zealots.