I probably should have mentioned the BOV is used. It's off my parts car. If you need anything off the car let me know.
2 Questions - Exhaust System and Spark plugs
- Thread starter Grandavi
- Start date
Grandavi;1147475 said:
yes and no... they donate to ROTM and stuff, which is really cool. but if you buy a water pump from driftmotion.com it doesnt really benefit the site directly...
its nice to see that your learning, and that your planning this out. hope all goes well with the car.
That shiney cover for the spark plug galley won't seal as well as the stock unit. It's considered a gasket and as such it wears out an needs to be replaced (don't overtorque, follow TSRM specs).
Poodles;1147512 said:
LIPP has one.. that I thought would be okay.
I want to buy this stuff right away.. to stop the valve cover leak....
New screws (why would someone put philips screws on a valve cover??
http://www.suprasport.com/Valve-Cover-Cap-Screw-Kit_p_0-295.html#
I heard that if you put NAPA gaskets Part # 704-1076 on the 4 large allen wrench plugs in the galley it will stop another possible leakage area.
Gonna clean up the covers while I have them off, would like to polish em up a bit and repaint the red. (may as well do this while they are off... I like a pretty motor.
The Lipp one I was looking at (3rd cover or spark plug gallery cover) I thought would be good is this one:
http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/partdetails/LIPP/Engine/Spark_Plug_Covers//9762
Just cause it looked cool. I dont think it will make much difference really will it? The OEM one is a one piece cover I believe with the gasket attached and as long as I dont have leaky valve covers, the plugs and wires will stay dry. The new screws should go a bit of a ways to keeping the oil out of there... as I think the OEM ones come loose.
Worrying about the 3rd cover sealing correctly, isn't that only important if your going to have a leaky valve cover or somehow have water get up top? I didnt think it mattered as much if the valve covers are tightly sealed.
The center cover is there to keep water/oil/crap out of the spark plug wells...the stainless ones will work, but not as well as OEM. New cam cover gaskets should stop the leak...make sure you apply RTV at the location shown in the top pic here:
http://www.cygnusx1.net/supra/Library/TSRM/MK3/manual.aspx?Section=EM&P=56
The cam covers are secured with screws for a reason...the torque spec is 22 in/lbs (not ft/lbs). It's hard to over torque a philips head screw
I used stainless hex cap bolts...they look good, just don't over torque them. That will ruin your whole day. You can get them at a good hardware store...M6x1.0 27mm length, like these:
http://www.boltdepot.com/product.aspx?cc=25&cs=82&cm=19&cd=1317
At $0.64 each for the 30mm length, a bit better price
You'll need to get internal star washers and place between the bolt head and the stock grommet...they won't come loose again.
http://www.cygnusx1.net/supra/Library/TSRM/MK3/manual.aspx?Section=EM&P=56
The cam covers are secured with screws for a reason...the torque spec is 22 in/lbs (not ft/lbs). It's hard to over torque a philips head screw
I used stainless hex cap bolts...they look good, just don't over torque them. That will ruin your whole day. You can get them at a good hardware store...M6x1.0 27mm length, like these:
http://www.boltdepot.com/product.aspx?cc=25&cs=82&cm=19&cd=1317
At $0.64 each for the 30mm length, a bit better price
You'll need to get internal star washers and place between the bolt head and the stock grommet...they won't come loose again.
Grandavi;1146145 said:
An exhaust shop can probably do this for you if you're friends with someone who works there. Most of the exhaust shops don't want to touch a car that doesn't have a cat, that's why I'm saying it like this.
Otherwise, BIC (a vendor on here) should sell a testpipe, you may also find cheaper ones on ebay as well. I haven't been on 935's website lately, but he may now have a testpipe. There not hard to find on here once you start looking. Browse all of our vendor's websites and you'll run across at least one guaranteed
http://www.bicperformance.com/products.htm
Check out that link and look at the bottom of the page for two different types of test pipes. If I had to do it over again, I would have opted for the race test pipe, that would have been interesting
I wouldn't upgrade the BOV until you do the intercooler hard pipes because there's no need to do things twice.
I bought driftmotions 2.5" hardpipe kit with couplers, t-bolt clamps, along with two 90 degree couplers, a 2.25"-2.5" reduction coupler, and a 2.5"-2.75" reduction coupler. I also bought at the same time the larger spearco replica version intercooler.
If you're doing it all yourself, you have a few different options with how you can route the piping. I went under the passenger headlight to eliminate a few feet of piping for that little bit of extra power. You'll have to dremel out the hole larger to keep the pipe from rubing.
With my 2.5" hardpipes, bigger intercooler, synapse synchronic BOV, and 3" turbo back exhaust, I'm making around 9-10 psi without using a boost controller, and no traction through first or second if I'm hard on it
Check out that link and look at the bottom of the page for two different types of test pipes. If I had to do it over again, I would have opted for the race test pipe, that would have been interesting
I wouldn't upgrade the BOV until you do the intercooler hard pipes because there's no need to do things twice.
I bought driftmotions 2.5" hardpipe kit with couplers, t-bolt clamps, along with two 90 degree couplers, a 2.25"-2.5" reduction coupler, and a 2.5"-2.75" reduction coupler. I also bought at the same time the larger spearco replica version intercooler.
If you're doing it all yourself, you have a few different options with how you can route the piping. I went under the passenger headlight to eliminate a few feet of piping for that little bit of extra power. You'll have to dremel out the hole larger to keep the pipe from rubing.
With my 2.5" hardpipes, bigger intercooler, synapse synchronic BOV, and 3" turbo back exhaust, I'm making around 9-10 psi without using a boost controller, and no traction through first or second if I'm hard on it
Grandavi;1146853 said:
You are a quick learner and that is good.
You are correct. There is no such thing as "best" regardless of part (turbo, intercoolers etc) As you have come to find out, unfortunatly find out. The parts are they good for the application at hand or are they not. Iridiums. For the cost over platinums, debateable if they are worth it. Toyota used stock Plats on our car....
http://www.cygnusx1.net/Supra/Library/TSRM/MK3/manual.aspx?S=IG&P=8
and there change interval is
http://www.cygnusx1.net/Supra/Library/TSRM/MK3/manual.aspx?S=IG&P=7
a whopping 60k miles.
That is on a OEM tune though. That goes out the door the minute you increase power output. The ONLY time I would concider iridiums an option is when running a Capacitive Discharge Igntion. And then only for street driving. For racing, coppers all the way as they need to be inspected after each run anyway
Grandavi;1146853 said:
Magnecore KV85 are good. Keep in mind that most aftermarket do not do anything special to the center conductor (usually a carbon wrapped filament for noise supression). What they do (take the magnecore) is that they make the jacket out of silicone or some other exotic heat withstanding material. Makes it possible for the wires to not get brittle and break or take more heat than OEM, but besides solid wire ignition wires (which on an EFI car you do NOT want) none of them will "gain" you anything over the OEM wires.
Okay, again.. decision made. (was going to go with the coppers, but I found the platinums for a good price and the TSRM lists em so I will go there) I am going to skip over the Magnacore because I think OEM will be more suited (although perhaps not as pretty... I like the red.. lol) to my overall application at the moment. Because I am not a true mechanic, I keep a pretty strong list of upgrades/changes in case I get stuck and have to actually go to a mechanic. I think the "medical chart" helps them diagnose issues a helluva lot cheaper. Going OEM just seems smart at this point.
For the Spark plug galley... Im torn. On the one hand, I am looking at the OEM cover and the gasket is built into it. It looks okay and I guess its not really highly visible, so I think I will stick with stock there as well. I really liked the "mirrored finish" idea though..
(just a note... I have the entire TSRM in PDF format that is linked (so far I just did the Table of Contents) and downsized to 57 MB if anyone wants it. I can provide a link here if you need, but am wary of doing so immediately because I dont understand who actually owns it... lol. So I will wait to see if anyone says... DONT!!! before I do. I did an offline PDF because I am not anywhere near a computer when I work on the car. Also.. I may actually print off all 1000+ pages just to have it as a handy reference guide. So, if you want it, either a moderator can PM me to say, its okay to link it, and you guys can grab it at will or just pm me..)
One other small think regarding the cam covers (head covers) :icon_bigg, Its a simple.. clean and apply... no compounds used except where mentioned in the RTV (stupid question.. RTV stands for ____?) at the spots shown in the TSRM. I am guessing the compound is meant to help prevent leaks from flex there?
Do I need to do anything in the spark plug galley other than clean it up prior to finishing all of the top end leak fix? Looks pretty straight forward to me.
Just thought I would attach a pic of the engine compartment... just cause its nice to see what someone is talking about.. and I just talked a lot about it.. lol
The test pipe idea is good... I like the one with that race plate... I think I may go that route just cause it would be there in case I ever got into the situation I could do a time trial
Oh yeah... 1st stupid thing I bought for the car is the brace that goes over the top of the engine attached to the top of both struts. I have it sitting in my office with me (it's purdy) but I am thinking that is a goofy thing to put on it.. as I dont think it will actually do anything...
For the Spark plug galley... Im torn. On the one hand, I am looking at the OEM cover and the gasket is built into it. It looks okay and I guess its not really highly visible, so I think I will stick with stock there as well. I really liked the "mirrored finish" idea though..
(just a note... I have the entire TSRM in PDF format that is linked (so far I just did the Table of Contents) and downsized to 57 MB if anyone wants it. I can provide a link here if you need, but am wary of doing so immediately because I dont understand who actually owns it... lol. So I will wait to see if anyone says... DONT!!! before I do. I did an offline PDF because I am not anywhere near a computer when I work on the car. Also.. I may actually print off all 1000+ pages just to have it as a handy reference guide. So, if you want it, either a moderator can PM me to say, its okay to link it, and you guys can grab it at will or just pm me..)
One other small think regarding the cam covers (head covers) :icon_bigg, Its a simple.. clean and apply... no compounds used except where mentioned in the RTV (stupid question.. RTV stands for ____?) at the spots shown in the TSRM. I am guessing the compound is meant to help prevent leaks from flex there?
Do I need to do anything in the spark plug galley other than clean it up prior to finishing all of the top end leak fix? Looks pretty straight forward to me.
Just thought I would attach a pic of the engine compartment... just cause its nice to see what someone is talking about.. and I just talked a lot about it.. lol
The test pipe idea is good... I like the one with that race plate... I think I may go that route just cause it would be there in case I ever got into the situation I could do a time trial
Oh yeah... 1st stupid thing I bought for the car is the brace that goes over the top of the engine attached to the top of both struts. I have it sitting in my office with me (it's purdy) but I am thinking that is a goofy thing to put on it.. as I dont think it will actually do anything...
Grandavi;1147877 said:
I am curious as to why you think that? (You are actually correct btw. If you do the load points, the strut towers have minimal deflection from a side to side motiona s the load is carried by both A arms. It does nothing in the MKIII supra. BUT, Looks are always part of the game
)
on the note of downloading the TSRM in PDF... if you google the TSRM you can find it in several locations, and theres a site that already has it for download.
and FWIW - i run no center cover and have not had an issue at all... i can actually change my spark plugs without removing anything except for the coil pack (duh) and thats it... all you need is a swivel socket to get in the tight spots.
and FWIW - i run no center cover and have not had an issue at all... i can actually change my spark plugs without removing anything except for the coil pack (duh) and thats it... all you need is a swivel socket to get in the tight spots.
Rennat;1147906 said:
I dl'd the TSRM PDF but it was in several pieces and altogether was 124 mb... so I joined them all and compressed it to 56 mb.. which is why I offered... (just in case anyone wanted.. no need to do it twice), plus I linked the TOC to the various areas for ease of use.
Never considered the galley cover being left off. Will look closely at that, because maintenance-wise, it does make sense. Plus.. its one less part. AND... I would have seen the oil building up in there when I bought the car!! lol...
I just read most of tookwik4u89's build posts and OMG... I so would love that engine setup. Sad part is, I'm not feeling spry enough to put that much work into it myself and would rather pay someone to do it! lol.. He did an amazing job!
figgie;1147899 said:I am curious as to why you think that? (You are actually correct btw. If you do the load points, the strut towers have minimal deflection from a side to side motiona s the load is carried by both A arms. It does nothing in the MKIII supra. BUT, Looks are always part of the game
I looked at the strut tops, did the trigonometry in my head really quick and was thinking about force vectors (I went to school to be a Civil Tech and those factored large in our training...). I couldn't see how it would do any good at all other than looks or if I got hit on the side (which would cause a nice frame twist...) So.. I just assumed it was a stupid purchase... I wanted to get rid of the targa wobble, but I think the bar that goes across in front of the rear seats is what I actually want to do. Was leaving that question for later on... after I fix all the drivetrain issues and finish those upgrades.
If you leave the center cover off or use one of the stainless types, you'll need to put teflon thread sealant on each of the big hex plugs that screw in the top of the head.
From the earlier question - RTV = Permatex silicone sealant...the black is fine...you can get a tube at any parts store.
From the earlier question - RTV = Permatex silicone sealant...the black is fine...you can get a tube at any parts store.
Grandavi;1147947 said:
wow,
Then you are up already on most everyone here
Correct, the force vector for the strut mounts is up and down and not side to side
figgie;1147953 said:wow,
Then you are up already on most everyone here
Correct, the force vector for the strut mounts is up and down and not side to side
:cry:My reason for buying them though was the big shake I got at 150 kph with the targa off... the day after i bought it... talk about shocking.. lol
Too bad it wont work.. didnt cost much
Thank you for the response regarding Permatex silicone sealant, And regardless of if I leave the spark plug galley on or off... those 4 hex screws are getting gaskets actually (NAPA gaskets Part # 704-1076) as I read that this will stop the problem (14mm hex key needed I think too).
Holy stock supra batman!
As you have the TSRM, look in the maintenence section and it tells you to retorque the subframes. Mine where VERY lose, and it make targa wobble MUCH worse if they're loose...
As you have the TSRM, look in the maintenence section and it tells you to retorque the subframes. Mine where VERY lose, and it make targa wobble MUCH worse if they're loose...
Poodles;1148232 said:
Ahh.. damn it! Thats right! I read that and forgot all about it. (one of those mental notes that I put on my mental fridge and forgot to mentally look at it... DOH!
Now.. there's a good "this weekend" thing to do! Will let you know results on that.
And here's where I saw it... lol
http://www.cygnusx1.net/Supra/Library/TSRM/MK3/manual.aspx?S=MA&P=12
(just a not to myself to remind me where.. and for anyone else interested.. there is also a post in the forums regarding it...
http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69896&highlight=torque+subframe
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while the Strut bar/shock bar does not help with the loading the shock towers see due to suspension compression, or bump situations, A shock tower cross bar does help with chassis ridgidity. It allows the loads going through the chassis monocoque to be distributed to the other side of the vehicle.
Even on a strut vehicle which inherently has more loading through the strut towers, the vast majority of the load still acts in the direction the damper travels in and the strut bar is there to help distribute the load across the chassis and to stiffen the chassis up.
Most of the load going through the suspensions a-arms goes through the lower control arm (the laden wheel has compression going thorough the lower arm and tension in its upper arm).
Do I think it is worth it for a tower bar? That really depends on the car and your plans for it. If I was road racing I would have one. If I was just worried about the targa off "shake" I would not do the mod.
We are lucky Toyota did it right though, we have proper A-arm suspension unlike many other cars in the supras class(mk3 & mk4). M3's, 911's, Evos, Sti's, all have struts, and in terms of tire control, how the tires contact patch is controlled to the road surface, A-arms are superior in everyway.
Even on a strut vehicle which inherently has more loading through the strut towers, the vast majority of the load still acts in the direction the damper travels in and the strut bar is there to help distribute the load across the chassis and to stiffen the chassis up.
Most of the load going through the suspensions a-arms goes through the lower control arm (the laden wheel has compression going thorough the lower arm and tension in its upper arm).
Do I think it is worth it for a tower bar? That really depends on the car and your plans for it. If I was road racing I would have one. If I was just worried about the targa off "shake" I would not do the mod.
We are lucky Toyota did it right though, we have proper A-arm suspension unlike many other cars in the supras class(mk3 & mk4). M3's, 911's, Evos, Sti's, all have struts, and in terms of tire control, how the tires contact patch is controlled to the road surface, A-arms are superior in everyway.