How does this make you feel?

[lanky189]

A member and I are/were exchanging pm's concering a recent thread,
i recieved this PM from them, just thought i'd see how people here felt about what was said

Originally Posted by lanky189

in my opinnion nothing needed to be done,

and this is the real world, the same rules of society apply here as they do in your local coffees shop.

Reply by Anonymous

so it is a common rule that it is ok to call each other names in your real world/ society?!?!?!

wow, americans are kinda fucked if this is true... but whatever...

So...i guess americans are fucked cuz some of us speak our minds...


wait a minute.....isn't that whats so great about the Unite States of America/Canada?

 

[SupraMario]

A member and I are/were exchanging pm's concering a recent thread,
i recieved this PM from them, just thought i'd see how people here felt about what was said

Originally Posted by lanky189


Reply by Anonymous



So...i guess americans are fucked cuz some of us speak our minds...


wait a minute.....isn't that whats so great about the Unite States of America/Canada?

well, there are limits to things, there is rude and then there is engaging in a sencable(sp?) arguement with a stranger. speaking your mind sometimes gets you into trouble, other times its right. Its knowing when to open your mouth and when not to.
so in a sence americans need to learn how to stfu sometimes, and other times learn when its our turn to talk, but freedom of speech is what makes our society change and evolve to on coming problems.
I always thought that people from europe speak their mind not in a mean kind of way but, more often then americans do. I know my mom does, and all the other people from europe i know.

 

[northsupra]

Ok this may get flamed from all corners.

But out in the world americans seems to be the dumbest, most selfish and naive people on earth and one more thing, it seems that you think you are undefeatable. Well just face it there are alot of American people among you Americans that acually fits this description quite well. Living in they own little bubbel. just pop it an look around there are otheres here.

Alltough this does not apploy too all of you because the people out on the street are not som bad and you are quite patriotical this is a good thing but not when your national leaders are som assholes that think they can do as they please and abuse that good heart and national feeling. And dont bring canada into this theyr a superb nation, got to love em.

And speak your mind ha, well your being so danm manipulated. It makes me sick looking at your President, senate, and minsters speak, it's not the will of nobody but big money corp.'s that makes oil and weapons and all the rebuilders of the contries that you'v just mashed to pices in this war agains terror.
And what shocks me is that the man in the street repeats what the saw on tv. No mind of his own, not free will, you cant say what ever you want becasue you'll probebly be sued. Free will and spech is a good illusion. nobody has it.

i hate i hate i hate the way you are represented.

So mutch for that i would like to say that is is just a picture of america and it does not say that every american is like that. And you on this forums seems too be "quite up and running".

An outsiders view

 

[SupraMario]

Ok this may get flamed from all corners.

But out in the world americans seems to be the dumbest, most selfish and naive people on earth and one more thing, it seems that you think you are undefeatable. Well just face it there are alot of American people among you Americans that acually fits this description quite well. Living in they own little bubbel. just pop it an look around there are otheres here.

Alltough this does not apploy too all of you because the people out on the street are not som bad and you are quite patriotical this is a good thing but not when your national leaders are som assholes that think they can do as they please and abuse that good heart and national feeling. And dont bring canada into this theyr a superb nation, got to love em.

And speak your mind ha, well your being so danm manipulated. It makes me sick looking at your President, senate, and minsters speak, it's not the will of nobody but big money corp.'s that makes oil and weapons and all the rebuilders of the contries that you'v just mashed to pices in this war agains terror.
And what shocks me is that the man in the street repeats what the saw on tv. No mind of his own, not free will, you cant say what ever you want becasue you'll probebly be sued. Free will and spech is a good illusion. nobody has it.

i hate i hate i hate the way you are represented.

So mutch for that i would like to say that is is just a picture of america and it does not say that every american is like that. And you on this forums seems too be "quite up and running".

An outsiders view

very well said, I total agree with you, where i live in dickson, there are a lot of ignorant patriots. I totally agree, you would think we would have taken the romans into consideration. they are an excelent example.

 

[GrimJack]

There is a fine line in there, and it's tough to define perfectly.

In this particular instance, there is some inflammitory wording in there that shouldn't be there. This shouldn't have anything to do with where we live - there are some significant differences between North America and Europe, but nothing that should cause us serious friction. For instance, Europe is less concerned about porn, while North America is less concerned about violence - big deal, we should still be able to live together.

It's all a matter of give and take - we give where we can so that everyone here can get along. Where we can't give, for whatever reason, hopefully someone else can pick up the slack. When someone takes too much, the entire community naturally shifts, or evolves, if you will, into a form that is less tolerant towards the offender.

The benefit to online communities, and ours especially, is that the rules we abide by are created, agreed to, and enforced by our community. Remind you of anything? The American forefathers did the same type of thing. Now if they had figured out a system to keep those same rules applicable and simple to understand down through the years... but I digress.

 

[TopSecret]

ok, let me tell you what europeans think about americans. northsupra got it pretty much covered.

while the majority of people does NOT have a problem with the american people themselves, most of them still do think that america and americans are fucked. i am talking about the US of A... not canada. canada is a quiet country, lol.

now why is that?
basically it was already said: it is the way you are represented and believe me your president sucks ass at representing your country.
yes, we (european people) do think americans are stupid, intolerant and arrogant and i've talked to alot of americans and realised that yes, there are people with exactly those attitudes. however, this does not apply to all of them. there are quite a few americans out there that are "normal" (normal as to what europeans think is normal).

now how come so many people still do not like americans?
cos lots of europeans do not like the president and also have never met americans... that's it basically, seriously.
the overall opinion is: bush is a retard that is trying to achieve the goals, daddy wasn't able to... bush the warpresident.
and unfortunately bush is the american president representing america, therefore americans are war maniacs too.

europeans on the other hand have been thru enough war shit and are sure as hell not supportive of other wars such as the whole iraq thing, the war in afghanistan etc blabla. this causes trouble again cos americans usually do not understand why we do not support the war against terrorism.
actually we do but since we do avoid taking part in the actual war act, since we try to live in peace and keep that peace, we suck (in bushs opinion).
except britain cos britain has that tony blair idiot that is stuck somewhere up bushs ass (again that is the overall european opinion) ...

now to that freedom of speech thing:
there is nothing wrong with freedom of speech, i'm glad we have it BUT... name calling, insulting, offending is not the real idea behind freedom of speech, nothing to be proud of and shouldn't be that tolerated. not in real life and not on the internet and especially not in a forum where it could be prevented so easily. at least that is my opinion.
it has nothing to do with "speak our minds"... you dont go out in the streets and see someone with an awful dress and walk up to her and say "girl, your dress sucks, you look like one ugly piece of shit in it"... or do you?
i don't think so, i think you'll keep your mouth shut and move on and maybe later tell your friends about it. but that's it... and imo forum members here and in all other forums should keep their mouths shut more often...
"if you don't have anything nice to say. don't say anything at all"

also how much freedom of speech is still left in america? come on guys, seriously.
like northsupra said: "No mind of his own, no free will, you cant say what ever you want because you'll probably be sued. Free will and spech is a good illusion. nobody has it."

this is an european opinion, you can flame as much as you want, it won't change a thing... it will just prove the europeans right.

 

[ToyoHabu]

I have found it true, that what people would not say in person they will say on the telephone, email, or IM. I call this phenomenon the "telephone tiger". When we become detached from the emotional effects of our words the inhibitors to being ugly get disconnected and mayhem ensues. In every way that I think that matters, I will judge the character and worth of someone by what they say and do because it all that I have to go on. So I always try to be careful in how talk to others mindful that I am always being evaluated. Those who say that you don’t care what others say or care about you, in my experiences are the ones who care the most.

To those who would judge USA on the basis of who are president is and his foreign policy. We simply decided that our and your safety and liberty was more important than how we make you feel. For those who make the simple minded and incorrect assumption that Iraq was about oil, a cursory look at what the fist gulf war cost would reveal that decades of cheap Iraq Oil would not pay for it. And understand that when the price of OIL increases hundreds of thousands of NON-Americans will suffer and thousands will die of starvation because they cannot afford the fertilizers made from OIL. The poor are the first to suffer around the world when OIL becomes expensive. So when and if America does actually move to prevent oil price increases perhaps you should applaud the move or do you actually want to see people starve?

Arrogance is a vise indeed but so is envy, how much of the resentment in this world is truly a result of our arrogance or more accurately placed on envy. Europeans and most other nations have the benefit of living in a situation where most of your populations are exposed to different cultures and languages all your life. There are large portions of Americans who do not get this kind of exposure. Thus you are more aware that what may be acceptable behavior at home is not acceptable in Rome.

Failure to face current problems because of past tragedy is a poor excuse. Heading of problems is a lesson that Europeans should have learned by now, would as many people died as a result of WWII had France and Britain been less afraid of that w word? I agree with what I would consider sane people and say I hate the very thought of war. BUT I will support its use and would volunteer myself to engage in that disgusting enterprise in order to secure true liberty which is the state of living without fear for my children.

I could go on, maybe later.

 

[lagged]

well here is a generalization for you generalizing europeans! many many times i have seen europeans making GENERALIZATIONS about americans, and to me, that makes YOU look very stupid.

in this world it is a harsh reality that intelligent people are in the MINORITY. when i see european people making statements such as those made by northsupra i say to my self, "what a tool."

its very "in" now a days to bash on americans. so keep following the heard if that is what makes you feel superior.

and for the record, i am an american (as if you havent already gathered that) and if you think for one second that, because i am an american that i agree with everything my government is doing, you are even MORE incompetant.

it may bother you to know that i am pretty powerless to do anything about my governments actions. when it comes down to it, they are the ones with the money (backed by guns, backed by money).

it is beyond me why you, northsupra, would make your statements. you think even the ignorant, moronic americans would say, oh superior norwegian you are so right. actually, dead did exactly that.

so as with many posts i see on here i shake my head and say, "why bother"

oh and one more thing, from an AMERICAN: NORSK HEDENSK.

EDIT:

have got to add my thoughts on this statement made by topsecret: "and unfortunately bush is the american president representing america, therefore americans are war maniacs too. "

there must be a word for this, but my dumb american ass dosnt have a large enough vocabulary to fish it out of, so let me try to explain:

your statement is a direct reflection of your overall intelligence. what do i mean by that? you make a deduction that, since bush is our president, we must all be like him. if it is not blatently obvious to others that your logic is flawed, i guess then i have yet again OVER ESTIMATED others' general intelligence.

 

[Ckanderson]

and one more thing, it seems that you think you are undefeatable.

thats cause we are. now canada..... haha... :biglaugh:

 

[SupraMario]

just for info sake, its not just Europeans that think americans are to pride worthly.

 

[GrimJack]

thats cause we are. now canada..... haha... :biglaugh:

Err.. I should point out that we are the only country to ever go to war against the USA and win. :biglaugh:

 

[Ckanderson]

Err.. I should point out that we are the only country to ever go to war against the USA and win. :biglaugh:

unless i slept durring history class.... you guys have never gone to war with us...... do you guys even have an army?

 

[Loki]

unless i slept durring history class.... you guys have never gone to war with us...... do you guys even have an army?

We burnt down the White House.

 

[ToyoHabu]

unless i slept durring history class.... you guys have never gone to war with us...... do you guys even have an army?

In the American revolution, america invaded canada on two occasions first in 1775 and again in 1776 we where defeated in both attempts, though America lost theses battles against Britian, it won the war with the eventual help of France.

 

[GrimJack]

heheh... the chances of this ever showing up in an American history class are slim to none. The USA didn't win every battle in the war of 1812... and Canada was part of Britain at the time.

In 1813, american troops marched on York in Canada, and occupied what was then one of the capitals of Canada. In 1814, we turned the tables, marched on Washington. Very little resistance was met, Washington was occupied and much of it was torched - the only reason the British left was because they were under orders not to hold, but to cause damage to property and morale. The only reason Washington survived was rain that prevented the fires from completely destroying the city.

It wasn't too long after this that the treaty of Ghent officially recognized the USA as a nation.

 

[GrimJack]

In the American revolution, america invaded canada on two occasions first in 1775 and again in 1776 we where defeated in both attempts, though America lost theses battles against Britian, it won the war with the eventual help of France.

Another little tidbit - both countries claim to have 'won' this war. When a war stops via a treaty, I think it's officially a win for both sides... a victory, on the other hand, is pretty much only an option after you have completely crushed the resistance on the opposing side.

 

[SupraMario]

it is beyond me why you, northsupra, would make your statements. you think even the ignorant, moronic americans would say, oh superior norwegian you are so right. actually, dead did exactly that.

LOL, nice, superior norwegian, man u dont get it do u? this is exactly what they are talking about. you call the ones who actually have a clue as to what is happening IDIOTs because they want to change, you do not, you stand proud, hold that flag above your glorious head. die like a brave soldier. because it was for the better of your country am i right?

not one person that supports the war can give me one god damn reason y we are over there.
NOT one person that supports the war can give me a reason y we havent found weapons of mass destruction.
NOT one person that supports the war can give me a reason y it wasnt for oil.
no one can, the answers i get are all unclear. you DONT KNOW, you are blind folded you let the government show u wat u want to see. give me a freakin break. the world is against us, they know our fate better than we do and even our own people are starting to see how self rightcheous(sp?) pride hogs we are. We take no advice from other nations, we take no help from no one, we are the mighty USA. BULLSHIT, im tired of it, america needs to fucking wake up, if you loved your country you would wake the fuck up and start acting like you did. OPEN YOUR MINDS.

Remember those guys called the romans, well their society started of just like ours.
all GREAT societies colapse without change, this one is doomed to if we will not change. the romans did what we are doing now, pride lustful people, this is good but to such an extent that the romans drove it, is to cause the system to fall, 400 years after, they were no more.
the united states is like a Teenager being rebelious to its elders. we are a very very very young super power, and if this society doesnt wake up to what the government and media is feeding them, then our fate is sealed.

lets face it, we ignore the plea for help from our poor, yet we spend billions on war and road work. We completely shut out other political parties, why because they want to adapt, we spit on those who start to think that our government might need to change, we ignore the imigration problem, but bitch about it, we put in place a "no child left behind act" yet we still have one of the largest dropout rates for a country, better yet, students are graduating and CANT EVEN READ, we freak out about nudity shown on TV, "o my god kids are in trama because of it", but its ok for them to go watch movies with violence and language, then blame it on the companies when 3 cops get shot, it was the movies fault or the video games, bullshit where were ur parenting skills, we get pissed cause the word god is in our pledge of allegence, we bitch about losing jobs to other countries, why someone here could tell me, its not cause they do it cheaper, its cause big corporations can tell the government fuck off we own u. if something doesnt happen soon I warn us now, just like i did with the Iraq becoming the next vietnam and there not being weapons of mass destruction, our society will fall or become a 3rd world country and this will happen soon if we dont wake up and change.

 

[Dirgle]

I greatly enjoy this forum because there seems to be a certain level of maturity and civility, unlike certain other forums *coughSFcough*. This makes browsing and posting more enjoyable. If someone calls me a name, am I going to go crying to mommy, no. But I have no intention of engaging in a completely useless conversation with someone. Freedom of speech is one thing but a wast of bandwidth is another. If someone is acting like an eighth grader they have no business posting on a car forum. Most of us are adults here and should act like it. Like GrimJack said, it's a fine line. And maintaining that line is important for the enjoyment of the forum. Deciding upon and maintaining that line it the job of the moderators, if you don't like that then pass the job on to someone else. Now deciding on that line can be tricky. If someone is just whining then obviously they need to get a tougher skin as this is the internet and shouldn't be taken so damn personal. However if the offending person is being a complete moron then as a moderator you need to put that person in check. How to deal with it is completely up to you and the other moderators. In this instance lanky it seems you dealt with it just right. You looked at the situation (which is more than some moderators elsewhere do) and made a decision. Then this person got pissed because you didn't give him what he wanted. Then rather than show maturity he threw a little fit, and proceeded to prove his own statement, and going back to his kindergarten chair to pout for not getting his way.

 

[SupraMario]

I greatly enjoy this forum because there seems to be a certain level of maturity and civility, unlike certain other forums *coughSFcough*. This makes browsing and posting more enjoyable. If someone calls me a name, am I going to go crying to mommy, no. But I have no intention of engaging in a completely useless conversation with someone. Freedom of speech is one thing but a wast of bandwidth is another. If someone is acting like an eighth grader they have no business posting on a car forum. Most of us are adults here and should act like it. Like GrimJack said, it's a fine line. And maintaining that line is important for the enjoyment of the forum. Deciding upon and maintaining that line it the job of the moderators, if you don't like that then pass the job on to someone else. Now deciding on that line can be tricky. If someone is just whining then obviously they need to get a tougher skin as this is the internet and shouldn't be taken so damn personal. However if the offending person is being a complete moron then as a moderator you need to put that person in check. How to deal with it is completely up to you and the other moderators. In this instance lanky it seems you dealt with it just right. You looked at the situation (which is more than some moderators elsewhere do) and made a decision. Then this person got pissed because you didn't give him what he wanted. Then rather than show maturity he threw a little fit, and proceeded to prove his own statement, and going back to his kindergarten chair to pout for not getting his way.

bravo, well said.

 

[ToyoHabu]

In case you did not pay attention during history, the fall of rome was a largely ecconomic collapse caused by the lack of new slaves and a host of problems relating to people moving to cities and lack of farmers. The barbarian kindoms that eventually sacked rome even attempted to join the roman empire. side note I think the Roman empire still largly exists today. It fell into very hard times, but most of what is the western culture today is Inherited from Rome and Greece. Most of our beliefes and attitudes are Roman. So has the Roman empire truly fallen ?