A/C upgrades (R134) - Operation Chill
- Thread starter Satan
- Start date
The design as a heat exchanger is more efficient. Period. Doesn't matter what the fluid is. Whether that efficiency is needed in a properly designed R12 system is debatable. My experience says it isn't. Something can be "inefficient" and still work pretty well you know. Look at tube and fin oil coolers versus stacked plate for example. However if you're asking what I would buy if the stock serpentine in my R12 system blew up tomorrow I'd say Satan would be hearing from me. Not because I need it (my system on low fan speed blows in the high 30s) but because efficiency is nice to have in any process. Doesn't mean it's needed for the process to work though.
Retrofits are another story. You guys make it sound as if this is something new and untested. It's well known PF can improve the performance of 134 in a refitted R12 system. As pointed out people in the MVAC biz know it and I've mentioned it on several occasions. And while it's true the TXV controls superheat there are other things that can effect evap and vent temperature. That said, since a 10 degree drop across an evap is typical, anything less than 42 is gravy.
And fwiw my 87 came new with the pusher fan. I was under the impression all turbo models had it while N/A's didn't...
Retrofits are another story. You guys make it sound as if this is something new and untested. It's well known PF can improve the performance of 134 in a refitted R12 system. As pointed out people in the MVAC biz know it and I've mentioned it on several occasions. And while it's true the TXV controls superheat there are other things that can effect evap and vent temperature. That said, since a 10 degree drop across an evap is typical, anything less than 42 is gravy.
And fwiw my 87 came new with the pusher fan. I was under the impression all turbo models had it while N/A's didn't...
Thanks JJ, that's what i figured. 
As for the front fan.
My Dads 87 Turbo had it as well, as all Turbos. (But my Early 87 turbo with a door stamp of August 1986 didn't have it or any of the associated sensors.)
I think all 89+ N/A's have the front fan.
As for the front fan.
My Dads 87 Turbo had it as well, as all Turbos. (But my Early 87 turbo with a door stamp of August 1986 didn't have it or any of the associated sensors.)
I think all 89+ N/A's have the front fan.
Fair nuff. I'm not totally up on the fan thing, just that the N/As I've seen didn't have one. Now that you mention it they were all early years though.
Btw run-of-the-mill PAG sucks. Scarily hygroscopic. Use double end capped PAG or ester. I use TSI Supercool but there are others...
Btw run-of-the-mill PAG sucks. Scarily hygroscopic. Use double end capped PAG or ester. I use TSI Supercool but there are others...
The pusher fans are inconsistant on what they're installed on. SOme hot climates got them, autos got them, ect...
My 89 doesn't have one.
My 89 doesn't have one.
Can anyone explain why the pusher fan control circuit includes the headlight switch? It looks like the fan does not run if the headlights are on. Very strange.
http://www.cygnusx1.net/Supra/Library/TEWD/MK3/manual.aspx?S=Main&P=144
http://www.cygnusx1.net/Supra/Library/TEWD/MK3/manual.aspx?S=Main&P=144
Satan. Only thing changed in my car was the refrigarant, oil, and dryer canister. Nothing else. I have a robinair vacuum pump 6cfm rating that helped in evacuating the system.
Good luck with this though. I will be watching intently!
Good luck with this though. I will be watching intently!
On the front pusher fan....
I have owner my car since 1994. it is an 87. It never had the fan back then. Unless the previous owner took it off... but when I bought the car with 42k miles on it........ Doubt that the owner did anything save drive it gingerly.......
I have owner my car since 1994. it is an 87. It never had the fan back then. Unless the previous owner took it off... but when I bought the car with 42k miles on it........ Doubt that the owner did anything save drive it gingerly.......
Which oil lubricant did you use, PAG or ester? Viscosity?
Did you pull the compressor to completely drain all the reserved R12 lubricant, or did you just simply evacuated the system?
Thanks for the info
Did you pull the compressor to completely drain all the reserved R12 lubricant, or did you just simply evacuated the system?
Thanks for the info
figgie;1308879 said:Satan. Only thing changed in my car was the refrigarant, oil, and dryer canister. Nothing else. I have a robinair vacuum pump 6cfm rating that helped in evacuating the system.
Good luck with this though. I will be watching intently!
BlackDevilSupra;1309004 said:
bah
you had to ask.. lol :cry:
That was so long ago that I don't remember that type of specifics (after all I did it once!).
Now the other part, new dryer, put the oil in it, Took the connections off the compressor after the flush and dry, and added oil there. Buttoned up everything and proceeded to evacuate the system. At that point I had access to a, umm , now I don't remember the name.. it measure microns pulled.... I think. Grr bad memory today.
41.8 degrees (F) !!!!!
Took about 3 days to get things installed and recharged. I also installed the 2JZ N/A fan and an aluminum radiator (some oil line fittings and a few other things). After about 15-20 minutes of driving, temp reached 41.8F.
I am very happy with the results. I used 2.15 12oz cans and even forgot to close the low-side, when switching the 1st can. Outside temps are about 75 degrees right now, we'll have to see at 85 tomorrow, etc.
Condensor install notes & pics...
Very straightforward install. A couple of extra brackets that I did not use and some minor modifications...
#1 - There are a couple of rubber dampners on either side which look fubar, but still seem to hold the condensor securely.
#2 - There is a nut already welded on the stock bracket. I had to squeeze the fittings together and use a nut on the end of the bolt. I also put some rubber line stuff on the inside of the bracket to make sure that there's no metal-on-metal rubbing going on.
Fits well, but has a little extra room at the bottom...
Had to put some rubber line around this piece of the hardline, to avoid contact with a metal bracket
Good lateral fitment!
Some space left over, which I would have liked to be able to use...
I have the Auto-A/C pusher fan and had to bend this bracket, to fit it back on.
Took about 3 days to get things installed and recharged. I also installed the 2JZ N/A fan and an aluminum radiator (some oil line fittings and a few other things). After about 15-20 minutes of driving, temp reached 41.8F.
I am very happy with the results. I used 2.15 12oz cans and even forgot to close the low-side, when switching the 1st can. Outside temps are about 75 degrees right now, we'll have to see at 85 tomorrow, etc.
Condensor install notes & pics...
Very straightforward install. A couple of extra brackets that I did not use and some minor modifications...
#1 - There are a couple of rubber dampners on either side which look fubar, but still seem to hold the condensor securely.
#2 - There is a nut already welded on the stock bracket. I had to squeeze the fittings together and use a nut on the end of the bolt. I also put some rubber line stuff on the inside of the bracket to make sure that there's no metal-on-metal rubbing going on.
Fits well, but has a little extra room at the bottom...
Had to put some rubber line around this piece of the hardline, to avoid contact with a metal bracket
Good lateral fitment!
Some space left over, which I would have liked to be able to use...
I have the Auto-A/C pusher fan and had to bend this bracket, to fit it back on.
Nice information man , you rock the house. Do you mind putting up a list of all the parts you used and where to purchase and maybe prices.. This is something I will most definately do when I do my JZ swap in a couple of months.
Great INFO!!!
Great INFO!!!
Nice. Where did you get the unit? Pm me if you want. I need to get a new condenser for my celica and interested in getting a R134 designed unit vs a stocker.
I put the A/C back into my 2JZ 91T with all stock components other than the Aristo compressor and a new reciever/drier unit. It blew REAL cold with R134a. I'll be doing the same thing with my new car and my new 2JZ and the same compressor.
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