What should we do about the war in Iraq Poll

[IJ.]

It would be my choice..

 

[Yellow 13]

Where is the choice for "give each side LOT of weapons let them sort it out then walk in and take the Oil when they're done" ?

Didnt we already try that?

 

[wingman]

Didnt we already try that?

we only gave 'em some guns...they need like, napalm and crap....couple ICBM's, you know the good stuff.

 

[SupraDerk]

Derk: I can not find the report that Saddam paid 25k for bombings on any other news site but Fox News, just so you know.

IJ.: I can add it if you want? What sides do you want to arm?

National View

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/04/03/world/main505316.shtml

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/2846365.stm


The other news channels don't seem to go back that far

 

[Joel W.]

Ok thanks, but even then, they were not targeting the USA but Israeli civilian targets... They have been fighting with each other forever..

I am not saying he was a fluffy bunny dictator...

 

[SupraDerk]

Israel is probably one of our closest allies in the world and we're certainly one of their only REAL allies

 

[Joel W.]

the US is what the media wants to show us and that is determined by the people at the news service. Depending on their agenda (and what sells news)...we see killing, protestors, and what looks like set back after set back. I know for a fact there is a lot of good being done in Iraq...schools being built, services restored...but you don't hear of the success. I question why? Politics? Money? I don't know, but I do know the whole story is not being told in the US media

- Every Islamic Fascist on the planet is flocking to Iraq to fight the "Great Satan" and unfortunately, American soldiers are taking the hits.

- Regardless of what the media says, oil is in our national interest...period.

I agree about the media. I used to watch Fox News only and I realized I was only getting one side of the story..I have to look at all sides and try to sort through what makes more sense to me. My fear is that by just being there, we are making more terrorists out of people that would normally just fight with each other. :dunno:

<runs away from oil>:runaway:

 

[outofstep]

You poll did not include "pull out and let Israel glass the entire middle east."

 

[Joel W.]

You poll did not include "pull out and let Israel glass the entire middle east."

That is an option I did not include on purpose. However, If that is what you think, you can still vote on when you want that to happen. Now or whenever. :biglaugh:

 

[87CandyBlueT]

Israel is our allie, we should be helping them right now with support but all our resources are in Iraq. I understand everyones view here. but I stand by what I said terrorism will never not be part of life. If it's not bombs etc. it's psycological warfare. Kidnapping people and video taping them executed and all that junk. How do you fight that? I do not think rebuilding Iraq is going to solve much. Like Joel said Saddam wasn't a fluffy dictator. However things are much different in the Middle East than the U.S. I'm not saying I agree with Saddam's views/actions in the least. Talking about Saddam funding terrorist. Do you honestly believe we( the U.S.) have not funded terrorism. We have supplied Saddam with plenty of arsenal in the past. Hell we have terrorist in America, Oklahoma city bombing etc. They were Americans. We have a enough problems here in the home front. I have deep feelings for the families of our soldiers. We're fighting a war that can't be won. Also as I stated before I believe we are more vunerable to an attack now than we ever have been. While all our troops and resources are in/funding Iraq, don't you think if their was a elaborate attack planned on America it would of been executed now in our time of weakness? I still don't understand how we just up and went to Iraq all of the sudden, the reasoning when it happened was in search of WMD's. I vote bring them home, no matter what it reflects of us. Honestly do you think Bush really gives a shit about the Iraqi people? We're over there for other reasons unknown, definately not because of Iraq being a big threat. We put our troops and country in danger going there. Look at the death toll and for what? You say Iraq has been successing but at what cost? and is America Successing? No we're more divided than ever and it will only get worse as this "War" is going to be long. I don't know how true or the facts of this but I know I did see a news feed a year or so ago that our government knew about 9/11. Anyone else hear this or have facts? If this is true, why would we let this happen?

 

[jdub]

I agree about the media. I used to watch Fox News only and I realized I was only getting one side of the story..I have to look at all sides and try to sort through what makes more sense to me. My fear is that by just being there, we are making more terrorists out of people that would normally just fight with each other. :dunno:

I watch all of the different news myself...even the views I don't agree with. I figure that way I'll get the "whole" story.

Concerning making more terrorists...I share your fear too Joel. The only way we will ever stop this crap in the Middle East is to for the common people involved to see it's not the US or Israel they have to fear...it's their own people that control with violence. This is power...pure and simple.

 

[Joel W.]

I am with you man. They have been at war long before we got there and they will be at war long after were gone.

Wars and Battles of the Middle East
War Date(s)

Egyptian Invasion of Asia 1479 bc
Persia Empire Wars 546 - 539 bc
Persian-Greek Wars 499 - 401 bc
Alexander & Macedonian Conquests 338 - 322 bc
Hellenistic Monarchies, Wars of the 318 - 170 bc
Third Macedonian War 168 bc
First Triumvirate, Wars of the 53 - 45 bc
Second Triumvirate, Wars of the 43 - 31 bc
Byzantine Empire Wars 395 - 1453
Muslim Conquests 624 - 982
Crusades 1096 - 1254
Arab-Israeli War 1948 - 1949
Suez War 1956
Wars in Lebanon 1958 - 1983
Six-Day War 1967
October War 1973
Iran-Iraq War 1980 - 1988
Persian Gulf War 1991
Terrorism, War on 2001

That is why government and religion should be kept seperate imo.

 

[87CandyBlueT]

It's insanity, (Doing the same thing and expecting a different result). especially in this case as we've been to Iraq before.

 

[Joel W.]

I don't know how true or the facts of this but I know I did see a news feed a year or so ago that our government knew about 9/11. Anyone else hear this or have facts? If this is true, why would we let this happen?

Read the 9/11 commision report..It's online. There was a warning, but I don't believe we took it seriously. That does not mean we allowed it to happen intentionally, We just got caught snoozing...

 

[SP 7M]

New Orleans was almost completely destroyed and it took over 3 days for help/rescue, government services to get there.

You've been lied to. And no offense to you, but you bit the carrot that most Americans did, as well.

I'm not going to get into this debate about the war because it's not my job to say what we should do. Aside from that, to answer the original question with a timeframe alone is far too vague.

No offense to you, either, Joel.

 

[jdub]

It's insanity, (Doing the same thing and expecting a different result). especially in this case as we've been to Iraq before.

No argument here...it is insane. But what you have to realize is the culture in the Middle East does not have the same values as the West. Not even close...their value on life is minimum and the rise of a fascist belief based on religion is making the situation much worse. I've spent some time over there...Egypt and Saudi...been to Iraq, but didn't stop That is what I am basing my view on. I could tell you some stories that would curl your hair. The sooner we all realize the people in the Middle East do not think like we do...the better we will all understand and see what's happening.

Joel - you're very well read Since you have looked at the history, consider this: The 3rd Crusade involved Salidem and Richard the Lion Hearted...basically it ended in a draw. Neither side "won" and a truce was called between the Christians and Islamic forces. Ever since that time, Islam morphed from a religion of tolerance to one of intolerance...this is when the term Jihad changed. Jihad means "struggle" and has two meanings in Islam...Greater Jihad is a person's inner struggle to be a good person and live according to the Prophet's teachings; Lesser Jihad is a physical struggle like protecting your family (or Islam) from aggression.

Before the 3rd Crusade, Islam always emphasized Greater Jihad...if you think about it, most religions have similar concepts. After the 3rd Crusade, due to neither side winning, Lesser Jihad became emphasized by the Iams...the struggle never ended and continues to this day. The thing I'm seeing is a further change toward Fascism...very similar to the Nazis, but with a major difference. It's backed by one of the largest religions in the world.

 

[Joel W.]

SP7M: No problem here man.. I mean no offense either... I am really not against the military in any way. They are all under orders and you guys do your job without question always. I thank you for that.

Do you know what the goals are right now for us to finish the job there? Not even the democrats can decide on a date to leave or what has to be done before we can leave..

This makes me wonder why we are there..

 

[OneJoeZee]

GTFO

 

[SP 7M]

I don't know anything more than you do, Joel.

To add to what jdub said, many middle easterners don't want to be free. Sure, plenty do as they are far less ignorant than Muslim fascists, but our situation there is an extremely difficult one.

Lets face it, there are two major factors (not the only ones) that drive people of foreign nations to hate us.

1. They're simply jealous.

2. They're so ignorant that they have no clue as to why they hate us, it just seems like the thing to do.

To all Americans that are anti-everything, ie: the far Left, you're spoiled blind by what apparently is an excess of freedom that you've been born into. You disgust me.

 

[Joel W.]

I agree, I think any extreme, left or right, can be bad.

I know this is a very sensitive subject and I thank you all for keeping your cool here..