What should we do about the war in Iraq Poll

[Adjuster]

I belive when the terrorists use a nuke on the USA, we will nuke their home base(s) as a response.

Count on it. Weapons were never built to be kept in storage. Simple truth of war. Eventually they are used, and abused in some cases. (Hindsight is always 20/20, but in the heat of battle, the gloves come off.)

You bring up a point I've made here. What will it take to get the USA fully involved in the war on terrorism? As you point out, we supported England from the sidelines for years before getting officially involved.

Appears the majority of American people are slow to anger, but as the Japanese found out, when we are pissed off, we will use nukes to end the conflict.

 

[wingman]

since the dawn of time war has been survival of the fittest, kill the enemy and any supporters on sight with no remorse. Slaughtering a village, women and children alike was not uncommon and certainly not grounds for punishment...civilians loyal to the opposing force are just as much an enemy as the armed man in front of you.

Enter the USA, which will someday field notaries on the front lines to sign "permission to return fire" applications. Vietnam was great in the fact that america plastered napalm on every living thing down there....women, children, animals, etc...we still didn't walk away victorious but I'm sure we'd have run away worse than what we did had it been handled similary to iraq.


but please, before you say islam is evil etc...etc...etc...think about this. If you were born in the middle east and raised to believe that western civilization is evil and must be destroyed you can bet your ass you'd be out there with an AK hanging out of a car window screaming war cries. I don't know about you, but they hate us because they don't know better, they were raised to hate us...and we hate them because they don't know better, because they carry out what they believe they were born to do.

in the end it's just a chess player arguing with a checkers player about the other's games being all wrong. I can accept the fact we'll never get along peacefully without glassing one or the other, but that's just it. To get the middle east to stop hating western civilization we're going to have to kill every last one of them. Hell we can try dropping gold coins from the sky and saying "america loves you", which would probably work better than what we are doing, but it still wouldn't get us very far.

i think our biggest problem doesn't lie in iraq but back here at home. People are not used to seeing the graphic nature of all out war. There used to sitting in thier office chair crying because a train tipped over and killed 3 people. When they see people getting turned into hamburger on live TV and realize that thier son/brother/friend/etc... is over there doing the exact same thing they freak! It's the way americans have been cultured, everybody has been brainwashed into pathetic PC junkies afraid to kill a damn mouse let alone another human being. Terrorism has been so hyped up by BOTH liberal and conservative media that when 2 people die by a suicide bomber were thrown into an instant state of fear that it'll happen to us next unless the "knight in shining armor" government steps in to protect us.

I'm fairly convinced that if I walk down the street, there's a higher probability that a drunk driver is going to jump the curb and plow me over than there is of me dying in a terrorist attack...yet for some reason when anybody else walks down the street there more afraid of a muslim jumping out of the bushes and blowing himself up. I'm not afraid somebody is going to mix two chemicals on a plane and blow the thing up, hell my teacher told us about that idea in 7th grade and it's just now becoming a big deal? I'm ashamed to say I live in a country that is slowly taking freedoms we once enjoyed away from us in the interest of security. I'm a firm believer that someday privacy will be a privelage, that someday you will be recorded in the shower to find out if your discussing terror plots against the government while your wash your hair, and that we will be ruled by a government controlling the people by very suttle, yet effective methods of fear through things like...the media!



....i need to stop staying up late at night wired on caffeine :nono:

 

[Joel W.]

So, here is a thought.

What to do about the war in Iraq?

Let's get countries like Kai's involved to help keep the peace, train Iraq's new army, and government and foster peacefull Islam while they are at it..

That is what I said if you were paying attention. :icon_razz
Other countries = UN (United Nations) = Not just the USA

BTW, mother nature has a way with dealing with over populated areas.. (disease and starvation)

 

[Kai]

I'm going to bed, but y'all can argue while i'm asleep, i'll be back later

 

[Adjuster]

Problem is the UN is a lousy group of crooked people.

They have proven they are for sale to the highest bidder. (Saddam had the UN oil for food program selling him weapons and other stuff he was not supposed to have like cash..)

Our allies at the UN, the Germans, French and Russians all were caught red handed, but for some reason, GWB has not pressed the issue. (We have so much evidence that nails all three countries stone cold, but are not using it.)

I've seen photos of Mig fighters with French and German weapons/avionics, and the latest Russian avionics systems, all of them banned to be sold to Iraq, yet they ended up there.. Saddam removed the wings, covered them with tarps, and then covered them with sand hoping they would not be found... Yet his own people, as they have realized Saddam is not coming back into power, have turned over these sites. Same for WMD, they have found so much in secret locations in the dirt and sand, yet the Bush Admin. does not release any of it to the media? I'm not sure why, but I really think he does not care anymore. He's been berated, called a liar and many other names, and I belive he's just tired of dealing with the media, and the whole issue. He was never a war president, this job was pushed on him after 911. (And really if you think about it, Carter was our start to the festivities in the Middle East, so every president since then has either avoided the issue, or like Reagan, delt with it in their own way. Clinton ran away from Africa, while Reagan just bombed them when they blew up a 747 over Scotland.) I like Reagan better. I wonder how he would have delt with this current problem?

In any case, our enemy is not Iraq, or Iran, or the good people of the world anywhere, but it is clearly militant Islam, and my point to all Muslems everywhere is your either clearly not supporting and speaking out against it, and turning in and helping us catch the bad guys, or your part of the problem. Either your with us, or against, us, and if you can't see that, I suppose we can send you to Allah and let him explain it to you.

 

[rakkasan]

Ohhh dont even start the World War 2 crap - you joined WW2 in more than 2 years AFTER war had been declared, AFTER the battle of britain in which we fought off the germans with what little resources we had in terms of both manpower and aircraft.

The US sat on the sidelines, refusing to get involved until Pearl Harbour and only then when you realised that after Hitler had conquered Europe, he'd be coming after YOU next. Even WITH the support of the US in 1944, with the advent of the Normandy Beach Landings, it wouldn't have made any difference had Hitler not been so greedy and decided to go for Russia as well, stretching his forces thin on the ground. Also, it's not all as it's been portrayed in the Movies with regards to the normandy beach landings. Germany was defeated with more than just American assistance. We had Canada and Australia on our side too AND the French Resistance, without whom we wouldn't have had much in the way of intelligence.

We we're the first nation to set foot inside occupied France, with our Airborne boys capturing the Pegasus Bridge a few hours before the main landings took place. Also, by the end of the day we had offloaded more men and vehicles than you.

:nono:

 

[Joel W.]

Problem is the UN is a lousy group of crooked people.

They have proven they are for sale to the highest bidder. (Saddam had the UN oil for food program selling him weapons and other stuff he was not supposed to have like cash..)

I completely agree here.. Kofi is as corrupt as they get.. He and his buddies need to be locked up..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kofi_Annan

Our allies at the UN, the Germans, French and Russians all were caught red handed, but for some reason, GWB has not pressed the issue. (We have so much evidence that nails all three countries stone cold, but are not using it.)

Yes, They need to be removed from the UN or severly punished for their actions..

In any case, our enemy is not Iraq, or Iran, or the good people of the world anywhere, but it is clearly militant Islam, and my point to all Muslems everywhere is your either clearly not supporting and speaking out against it, and turning in and helping us catch the bad guys, or your part of the problem. Either your with us, or against, us, and if you can't see that, I suppose we can send you to Allah and let him explain it to you.

Right on.. I agree again. Most of the tips we seem to be getting are coming from some of those friendly Muslims that are in contact with the "extremists", They are turning them in.. I am relieved to see you type that because in all reality there may only be a few 100 to a few 1000 (this number is growing rapidly) "extremists" bent on causing us harm...

The rest may not like us much, but they are not fanatical enough to attack us for no reason. Most are smart enough to know that the hatered beliefs that they were raise with may not be true after all.. I see this with kids all the time.. If they don't know they are "supposed" to hate something, then they do not mind it so much...

 

[TurboWarrior]

Yep, Joel I noted awhile back that China has a serious female problem.

IE: They have about 125,000,000 men more than women... Ooops, seems the social planning did not work, too many of the little girls were terminated, and now China has too few women.

A huge problem when you consider that most of us really work hard, and act nice because of our families... (Seriously, why would you work so hard if not for your kids?) There will be 125million men in China with no kids, no families and no responsibility in the next 20 years. What do you think China is going to do with all of them? It will be interesting for sure.

I think in china poorer families sometimes end up killing any females that are born because they know that its another mouth to feed that won't be a good worker. They keep the males because they will work supporting the family. So thats catching up to them now i guess.

 

[Adjuster]

Yep, turbowarrior, your right, but the problem still exists. There are going to be some serious problems in China before it is resolved too.

Back on the Iraq question, I don't think I agree with the 100 or 1000 number of those "militant" Islamic's..

Unless your talking about out of 100 or 1000 there are a few moderate thinking Muslems that don't hate us. (Now, I'm talking in Iran, Gaza for example... there might be more outside of the Islamic population centers, but I belive as a whole they not only don't like us, most of them hate us.

The current state of affairs around the globe supports this position too. (There are a few, too few moderate and peaceful muslims who have spoken out against terrorism.) Some have even lost their lives to the "brothers" who want to use the religion as a forum for hate.

Look at England and the terror cell they just uncovered. When they interviewed the Mullah where these guys prayed 5 times a day, he was not supprised at all. He was not cooperative, and those around him were proud to say they don't turn the other cheek, and think that opposing occupying armies is fine... DUDE! Their buddies just were all taken down planning on blowing up planes full of non combatants, and they don't give a shit about that because those planes were not full of muslems, but would be full of anyone else.

People bitch and complain about hate crimes, and being singled out, but then they go and do dumbass shit like that, and then are supprised when the rest of the local population comes around after the media and police stop watching 24-7 and firebomb the mosque, or houses of the guys saying what these terrorists have done was fine.

The other thing that worries me is the fact they feel they are Islamic first, then English second. (These are second and third generation people too, not ones who just moved to England..)

Maybe that's the problem. They have had it good in the West, and are fed a diet of propaganda in the Mosques, and they don't understand how good they have it.. Freedom of religion is wonderful, but when a religion is so actively inciting it's members to world wide violence, and so many of the main stream leaders of that religion remain silent when asked about terrorism, I have little hope in most of them.

They see us as the infidel, and untill they stop teaching we are the infidel, we will have terrorism.

The interesting part is going to be when some Islamic dude nukes the USA. The gloves will come off, concentration camps and holding sites will be setup, the Islamic people in this country will be penned up like was done in 1941, and the USA will get down to setting the world straight again.

If we just sit back and negotiate, it will be only a matter of time before this country is thought of as a footnote in history. A history book written in arabic I might add.

 

[Joel W.]

I disagree a bit guys, It is the women that give birth to new babies, not the men..Their birth control system is working a bit.. It does make for a lot of frustrated angry men...

Back to the terrorists, maybe someday scientists can isolate the "hate gene" and replace it with the "tolerant to others gene"...

Yeah, I was just guessing on the numbers of "extremists". Most seem to be the suicidal type, so that keeps the numbers low... lol