CryoSlash said:
WOW, that is the best post I've seen you make! :biglaugh: I too would think that's the only really beef with the 7m for the general public.
Duane
what does it take to get 500hp out of a 7mgte
- Thread starter 88redma70
- Start date
WOW, that is the best post I've seen you make! :biglaugh: I too would think that's the only really beef with the 7m for the general public.
Duane
In all honesty I think it's kind of amusing...
ALL of the motors will take 2x the stock HP easily and reliably. Most other engines by other makers can NOT do that. If they can, the drivetrain won't handle it.
Be very happy that Toyota overbuilds most everything they make.
ALL of the motors will take 2x the stock HP easily and reliably. Most other engines by other makers can NOT do that. If they can, the drivetrain won't handle it.
Be very happy that Toyota overbuilds most everything they make.
Duane, I really do not hate the 7m. It was just every time i bash them it's for this single fact.upgradedsupra said:
Like in all honesty what the hell Toyota.
Poodles said:
/\ /\ /\
I cam agree to that.
I'm taking the 7m route, after seeing Nate and Duane's 7m take big power I think my goal of 400hp with stock bottom can be achieve.
edit: I know i said earlier i was going to do a bottom end rebuild but, right now I'm rethinking my plans
My stock rod bolts were not 20 years old. They were new. Enough said! The car was making no more then 300 HP, for it to die like that is a shame. It was great and it wasn't bad but the JZ's are better.
I have built many engines over my many years with Supras and I still build 7M's for my die hard 7M customers, but I always share the options with them and let them make an educated guess on all the experience I have.
This is the way I approach engine building; when building an engine, you start with the most efficient power plant.
Edit: before Duane says it or any one else. The above statement applies to toyota in line six engines! :icon_razz
I have built many engines over my many years with Supras and I still build 7M's for my die hard 7M customers, but I always share the options with them and let them make an educated guess on all the experience I have.
This is the way I approach engine building; when building an engine, you start with the most efficient power plant.
Edit: before Duane says it or any one else. The above statement applies to toyota in line six engines! :icon_razz
soapra said:
I will say this. You say your car had 300 hp and that you built it and it broke? My suggestion is to not build another 7M. They make that power with ease with bolt on parts
They don't break that easy.Duane
2
2jzmk3
Guest
upgradedsupra said:I will say this. You say your car had 300 hp and that you built it and it broke? My suggestion is to not build another 7M. They make that power with ease with bolt on parts
Duane
+1
if you cant make 300 with bolt on's then you need to either have someone who knows about the car work on it, or just stop right now..
This was my stock rebuilt that most on this forum have read they can do, because they get miss guided that stock 7M parts can take a good amount of abuse. Under the conditions that my 7M died under, I guess stock was not best. Not everything is best stock. That engine had about 70,000 miles on it. After that engine I have built many other 7M's with great success. I've been doing this for many years, and just because I can admit to an engine failure, you both come after me like I can't build engines. Every other 7M that I have built, it's still on the road till this day. My 7M had 70,000 miles in one year! Yes I can drive that much in a year! I can go to streets of willow and kill three full tanks of gas in one day! Change tires three times and also change brake pads that same day. That is abuse! I can't wait to see what you guys are going to say about this.
I remember back in the SOGI days, when people used to use stock headgaskets on 7M builds only to blow them again. Also that lapping the block in the car was the best way to use a metal head gasket. Now people no better about lapping blocks. You find most of them taking the block out and apart to have a machine shop deck and resurface the block. I'm sure with out all of this trial and error, most of us would still think that the old ways of doing head gaskets was the right way.
Using eagle rods is a cheap and good way to insure a successful build. Sticking with stock rods is just a matter of time till you have to pull it all apart again to fix problems. It doesn't cost anything extra to add a simple mod like aftermarket rods. Only cost incured is the cost of the rods.
When it comes to the oil system, upgrading the pump in some kind of way it would help. changing the stock oil cooler for a better one is always a plus. Making a better pan or a replica group A pan would help the 7M alot. I'm sure there is a reason for IJ to do such upgrades on his 7M. If the oil system on the 7M is so great why would anyone try to make it better?
Edit: Only reason why I keep adding comments to this thread, is because I think that Duane and Sean can have a healthy conversation about something so obvious, but the way this is going, I guess not.
I remember back in the SOGI days, when people used to use stock headgaskets on 7M builds only to blow them again. Also that lapping the block in the car was the best way to use a metal head gasket. Now people no better about lapping blocks. You find most of them taking the block out and apart to have a machine shop deck and resurface the block. I'm sure with out all of this trial and error, most of us would still think that the old ways of doing head gaskets was the right way.
Using eagle rods is a cheap and good way to insure a successful build. Sticking with stock rods is just a matter of time till you have to pull it all apart again to fix problems. It doesn't cost anything extra to add a simple mod like aftermarket rods. Only cost incured is the cost of the rods.
When it comes to the oil system, upgrading the pump in some kind of way it would help. changing the stock oil cooler for a better one is always a plus. Making a better pan or a replica group A pan would help the 7M alot. I'm sure there is a reason for IJ to do such upgrades on his 7M. If the oil system on the 7M is so great why would anyone try to make it better?
Edit: Only reason why I keep adding comments to this thread, is because I think that Duane and Sean can have a healthy conversation about something so obvious, but the way this is going, I guess not.
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Jose: I've built a LOT of motors and have broken my fair share it's nothing to be ashamed of it happens, I never shy away from it and try and learn and move forwards.
A lot of the big dogs are in the same boat but they keep their failures secret where mine are public knowledge, then there are other that criticise but have never actually achieved even enough to have a failure
A lot of the big dogs are in the same boat but they keep their failures secret where mine are public knowledge, then there are other that criticise but have never actually achieved even enough to have a failure
IJ. said:Jose: I've built a LOT of motors and have broken my fair share it's nothing to be ashamed of it happens, I never shy away from it and try and learn and move forwards.
A lot of the big dogs are in the same boat but they keep their failures secret where mine are public knowledge, then there are other that criticise but have never actually achieved even enough to have a failure
Good morning Mate!
You hit the nail right on the head!
soapra said:
What are you talking about? :3d_frown: You speak of the engine having faults and you said you built it and it only had 300hp. The only obvious thing I see is that you probably shouldn't build one if you can't make it work with such little hp is all. I am just stating my opinion. Yes we do learn by mistakes but in this case, you seem to blame the engine and it's clearly not it's fault.
2
2jzmk3
Guest
I wanna say things to some specific people but I'll leave it alone.
How about 7M guys quit making dumb torque cracks and 1J guys will quit making dumb BHG/RK cracks. Deal? Unfortunately, some of us that know each other on more personal and friendly level can make statements in jest to each other but others reading get butt hurt really easy. 1J guys talking shit about 7Ms and BHG get on my nerves, as if it's not a problem easily dealt with, as much as 7M guys talking shit about torque get on my nerves, considering a stock 1J actually makes more torque than a 7M. And even in modded forms, it's not like a 1J is incapable of moving the car around. My car doesn't make the greatest low end torque but for putting around town, it's fine. If I want to do some WOT accelerating, the power is just a downshift away. It's f*cking simple. I don't expect the car to be a rocketship worth of thrust under 3500. It doesn't bother me.
And let's be real. Making a car fast or fun involves a lot more than "torque" or "revability." It's a total package of everything not just your hp/tq figure. Torque doesn't mean shit if you can't put it to the ground and revving high doesn't mean shit if you aren't making much more power up there. The most common offenders of dumb cracks from both sides drive bolt on 7Ms or bolt on 1Js. A typical CT26 7M makes some nice torque down low and falls on it's face up top and by redline. A stock 1J with stock twins and stock cams doesn't really utilize the engines rev range all that great. It's nice to shoot it up to 8k but it runs out of breath on stock cams. Performance characteristics of both engines can easily change to improve their weak points with upgraded turbos, cams, tuning, head work, whatever.
I don't give a shit where your A70 Supra makes power as long as it does it and puts a hurtin' on other cars. If you have a 7M that has a considerable amount of low end grunt and you win races, thumbs up to you. If you have a 1J and blow past people screaming at 8k, thumbs up to you. If you have a 1G but still punk a ton of cars on the road, thumbs up to you. That's what it's about.
It would be nice if this community at some time could finally stop segregating into 2 camps whenever this comes up. Some of us that know each other can talk on an easy level and discuss but unfortunately all the followers don't see that and start picking sides and slinging mud everywhere.
If people on either side need to state their negative opinion about the other engine to make them feel good for themselves and their car, congratulations. Instead of spending so much time telling me what MY engine CAN'T do, spend more time telling me what YOUR engine CAN do. And I'll do the same.
Supra owners can keep identifying with either engine camp if they wish but I won't. I'm in my own camp. The camp where I don't give a shit about what others really think of my car. If you think my engine is undersized and doesn't make enough torque for my heavy car, congratulations, I don't care. I love it. If you think my turbos are too big and laggy, congratulations, I love them. If you think my 3.73 diff is too long and 4.3 is better, congratulations. My car has really long legs at higher speed and I find it very enjoyable. If you think my car looks gay without a spoiler, congratulations, I think it's the most fantastic Supra I've ever seen in my life and couldn't be happier. Nobody's comments about how f*cking gay the color of my blue Supra was ever influenced me. I kept doing what I wanted to do with my car and you know what? In the end tons of people that never gave a shit about light blue Supras loved it.
Outside of the serious business interentz, in the real world, I get tons of compliments and admirers no matter if I had a gay blue Supra, a 7M, or a 1J.
In short, some of you guys care too damn much what others think of your car. I'm more opinionated than most but I don't expect anybody to change their likes and interests about their Supra because of my opinion or swap to a 1J because I like them. I don't have to look at the car everyday. If you want to put mustang taillights on your Supra, go ahead. I'll probably say it looks ugly but you're the one that has to look at it everyday so it's your choice. (But if you do it to a black 92, I might have to kill you.)
Anyway, it's lunch time. I'm gonna go drive my torqueless ugly wingless Supra and get something to eat. Sorry for rambling.
How about 7M guys quit making dumb torque cracks and 1J guys will quit making dumb BHG/RK cracks. Deal? Unfortunately, some of us that know each other on more personal and friendly level can make statements in jest to each other but others reading get butt hurt really easy. 1J guys talking shit about 7Ms and BHG get on my nerves, as if it's not a problem easily dealt with, as much as 7M guys talking shit about torque get on my nerves, considering a stock 1J actually makes more torque than a 7M. And even in modded forms, it's not like a 1J is incapable of moving the car around. My car doesn't make the greatest low end torque but for putting around town, it's fine. If I want to do some WOT accelerating, the power is just a downshift away. It's f*cking simple. I don't expect the car to be a rocketship worth of thrust under 3500. It doesn't bother me.
And let's be real. Making a car fast or fun involves a lot more than "torque" or "revability." It's a total package of everything not just your hp/tq figure. Torque doesn't mean shit if you can't put it to the ground and revving high doesn't mean shit if you aren't making much more power up there. The most common offenders of dumb cracks from both sides drive bolt on 7Ms or bolt on 1Js. A typical CT26 7M makes some nice torque down low and falls on it's face up top and by redline. A stock 1J with stock twins and stock cams doesn't really utilize the engines rev range all that great. It's nice to shoot it up to 8k but it runs out of breath on stock cams. Performance characteristics of both engines can easily change to improve their weak points with upgraded turbos, cams, tuning, head work, whatever.
I don't give a shit where your A70 Supra makes power as long as it does it and puts a hurtin' on other cars. If you have a 7M that has a considerable amount of low end grunt and you win races, thumbs up to you. If you have a 1J and blow past people screaming at 8k, thumbs up to you. If you have a 1G but still punk a ton of cars on the road, thumbs up to you. That's what it's about.
It would be nice if this community at some time could finally stop segregating into 2 camps whenever this comes up. Some of us that know each other can talk on an easy level and discuss but unfortunately all the followers don't see that and start picking sides and slinging mud everywhere.
If people on either side need to state their negative opinion about the other engine to make them feel good for themselves and their car, congratulations. Instead of spending so much time telling me what MY engine CAN'T do, spend more time telling me what YOUR engine CAN do. And I'll do the same.
Supra owners can keep identifying with either engine camp if they wish but I won't. I'm in my own camp. The camp where I don't give a shit about what others really think of my car. If you think my engine is undersized and doesn't make enough torque for my heavy car, congratulations, I don't care. I love it. If you think my turbos are too big and laggy, congratulations, I love them. If you think my 3.73 diff is too long and 4.3 is better, congratulations. My car has really long legs at higher speed and I find it very enjoyable. If you think my car looks gay without a spoiler, congratulations, I think it's the most fantastic Supra I've ever seen in my life and couldn't be happier. Nobody's comments about how f*cking gay the color of my blue Supra was ever influenced me. I kept doing what I wanted to do with my car and you know what? In the end tons of people that never gave a shit about light blue Supras loved it.
Outside of the serious business interentz, in the real world, I get tons of compliments and admirers no matter if I had a gay blue Supra, a 7M, or a 1J.
In short, some of you guys care too damn much what others think of your car. I'm more opinionated than most but I don't expect anybody to change their likes and interests about their Supra because of my opinion or swap to a 1J because I like them. I don't have to look at the car everyday. If you want to put mustang taillights on your Supra, go ahead. I'll probably say it looks ugly but you're the one that has to look at it everyday so it's your choice. (But if you do it to a black 92, I might have to kill you.
)Anyway, it's lunch time. I'm gonna go drive my torqueless ugly wingless Supra and get something to eat. Sorry for rambling.
Very well said Mr. Zee, but I'd like to add a couple of things if I may.
1:
2:
How much would you sell me your torqueless ugly wingless supra for...........:evil2:
1:
We both know deep down inside, you love my car just a little bit more...........:biglaugh:OneJoeZee said:
2:
OneJoeZee said:
How much would you sell me your torqueless ugly wingless supra for...........:evil2:
My imaginary friend Bob said he'd give me 30k for it right now.
Beat that offer and it's your's. He's a serious buyer too. Get it while it's available!
Beat that offer and it's your's.
He's a serious buyer too. Get it while it's available!OneJoeZee said:My imaginary friend Bob said he'd give me 30k for it right now.
Beat that offer and it's your's.
Too bad it's not white :sarcasm:
OneJoeZee said:Doesn't it snow up there in Canada? If you leave it outside, it will be white in the morning.
I live in lower mainland so it doesn't snow much here. We have rain all winter. :cry: It is better than snow though. If we get snow here for a day, it's gone by the next by rain! All we need here is an umbrella and a good wiper blade :icon_bigg
Duane