Loki said:
But every time you hit full boost you were probably all nervous :biglaugh:
And rightfully so :biglaugh:
tunning @ 16 psi am I crazy???????????
- Thread starter supra8903
- Start date
But every time you hit full boost you were probably all nervous :biglaugh:
And rightfully so :biglaugh:
20psi. (CT26 60-trim) 3 years... no BHG.
Now, 15psi. (T-66 P-trim) 6 months... no BHG.
I'm workin on it though.
I'll let you know when it lets loose.
Now, 15psi. (T-66 P-trim) 6 months... no BHG.
I'm workin on it though.
I'll let you know when it lets loose.
2 years on 12 psi. Stock HG, fuel pump, injectors. Heck even the stock paper filter. Only other mod was a 3" turboback. Now i'm at .9 bar. Still no BHG. I'm waiting on it patiently, so i can go ahead and put in my other motor.
this thread's crackin me up... seems the general attitude is, "hey it'll happen, BUT i have a spare motor"
now just think about how funny that sounds
now just think about how funny that sounds
Since nobody really seems to know what will happen at certain boost levels for the 7m motors, it's better to have a backup just in case. If everybody would just be more agressive i think we would find out how much a stock motor would really handle and therefor illiminating the need for backup motors.
supra_driven said:
We need someone to slap on a gt42 and boost and tune and boost and tune until the stock motor blows up. Then everyone would know the limit...... :bigthumb:
It's like high stakes gambling, and the house is a 7m with a stock hg. The odds are against you.
as long as the car doesn't ping and detonate, most likely it will be ok.
the stock fuel system is just fine for a stock ct26 at 1bar.
a good tune, keeping the afr in the low 11's, will not cause the hg to blow.
there are alwasy situations where a hg could blow, even a mhg could go if say an injector goes out. but with the car in good order, all parts ok, he will be fine.
the stock fuel system is just fine for a stock ct26 at 1bar.
a good tune, keeping the afr in the low 11's, will not cause the hg to blow.
there are alwasy situations where a hg could blow, even a mhg could go if say an injector goes out. but with the car in good order, all parts ok, he will be fine.
Detonation kills the gasket. Stock CT26 + elevated boost levels WILL increase your intake temps, and when you increase those temps far enough, you will start to detonate slightly... Will your old, worn out knock sensors pick it up?
Sure hope so.
I'm going to run 12psi on a stock turbo/gasket, and then go AEM to tune it - the intake temps and exhaust temps will tell the story
Sure hope so.
I'm going to run 12psi on a stock turbo/gasket, and then go AEM to tune it - the intake temps and exhaust temps will tell the story
Doward said:Detonation kills the gasket. Stock CT26 + elevated boost levels WILL increase your intake temps, and when you increase those temps far enough, you will start to detonate slightly... Will your old, worn out knock sensors pick it up?
Sure hope so.
he has an intercooler upgrade already, and if there is enough fuel, it's not going to detonate
Adjuster
Supramania Contributor
Well, my experiance, with a upgraded FMIC, and retourqed stock gasket was that it did not go untill I ran over 21psi, and had a slight detonation event... then it was toast.
Of course, every car is different, and your experiance might vary, but I think running 15psi or less on pump 91 or better, and with the right tune so your running richer than 12:1 AF's at WOT, you should be ok as long as the turbo does not have any tendancy to boost spike. (Mine would spike when I nailed the throttle in 4th or 5th, and did not down shift, just opened up the throttle, and let the turbo roll on.)
Eventually your going to want a MHG anyway if your trying to get more power, so keep an eye on the coolant tank, and watch your temp gauge for sudden changes and you should be fine. If you get the dreaded BHG, then we can say we told you so... LOL
Of course, every car is different, and your experiance might vary, but I think running 15psi or less on pump 91 or better, and with the right tune so your running richer than 12:1 AF's at WOT, you should be ok as long as the turbo does not have any tendancy to boost spike. (Mine would spike when I nailed the throttle in 4th or 5th, and did not down shift, just opened up the throttle, and let the turbo roll on.)
Eventually your going to want a MHG anyway if your trying to get more power, so keep an eye on the coolant tank, and watch your temp gauge for sudden changes and you should be fine. If you get the dreaded BHG, then we can say we told you so... LOL
You can't know that unless you actually measure the incoming air temps @ the plenum.
Let's say your turbo is pushing air temps of around 285 degrees out of it (I'm guessing a stocker around 15-16psi is heating it this much - anyone have actual data for this??) Stock IC does let's say... 150 degree drop (assuming 85 degrees out, that's around an 75% efficient IC) so now you have 135 degree incoming air. That's still pretty damn hot... Ok, so let's say you have an IC upgrade, and that IC efficiency is boosted up to 90% - Now you have a 180 degree drop, and 105 degree temps. Still pretty warm, but not as bad....
Yes, you can use the fuel to help cool the cylinders as well, to prevent detonation, but it's pretty freaking obvious how inefficient this is.
For reference, my ebay T70 on my 3.1L Camaro registers 80 degree temps 6" in front of the throttle body, on 68 degree days (the only real datarun I have where I actually logged the IAT's readings) - That's at 12psi, with a big custom downflow FMIC. If you get out of the car and grab the IC, it actually feels cold to the touch, from airflow through it.
I'll also state that this doesn't even account for the extra heating of our intake air, as it runs through the bends of the stock setup, and over the hot ass exhaust BEFORE going into the plenum.
Let's say your turbo is pushing air temps of around 285 degrees out of it (I'm guessing a stocker around 15-16psi is heating it this much - anyone have actual data for this??) Stock IC does let's say... 150 degree drop (assuming 85 degrees out, that's around an 75% efficient IC) so now you have 135 degree incoming air. That's still pretty damn hot... Ok, so let's say you have an IC upgrade, and that IC efficiency is boosted up to 90% - Now you have a 180 degree drop, and 105 degree temps. Still pretty warm, but not as bad....
Yes, you can use the fuel to help cool the cylinders as well, to prevent detonation, but it's pretty freaking obvious how inefficient this is.
For reference, my ebay T70 on my 3.1L Camaro registers 80 degree temps 6" in front of the throttle body, on 68 degree days (the only real datarun I have where I actually logged the IAT's readings) - That's at 12psi, with a big custom downflow FMIC. If you get out of the car and grab the IC, it actually feels cold to the touch, from airflow through it.
I'll also state that this doesn't even account for the extra heating of our intake air, as it runs through the bends of the stock setup, and over the hot ass exhaust BEFORE going into the plenum.
Heaven forbid we let any actual science into this thread !
Too many variables involved with this subject for anyone to say yes or no.
You roll the dice and take what happens.
! Too many variables involved with this subject for anyone to say yes or no.
You roll the dice and take what happens.
I'll put it this way - I wouldn't run 16psi on a stock CT-26, upgraded IC or no, unless I could pull some of the timing out.
bigaaron said:
There is just as much real world experience out there that says that there are no rules when it comes to this period. I get a kick out of people that come on here and say you can't do this and you can't do that and try to put limitations on what these engines can or cannot do. I have one 7m in my shop that ran 170,000 miles boosted to 16 psi on a stock as well as an upgraded CT26 for a 100,000 miles with no problems. What is even better is it is Dave's(dbsupra90) old engine. I think that would give him a pretty good idea on what he is talking about don't you? I also tuned Willie's car, which has been running 16 psi on low boost and 20.5 psi on high boost for over a year also daily driven with his PT67 as well as 2 years prior on a TD06-20G at 16 psi. These cars were and are on stock headgaskets with nothing more than a retorque to 72 ft/lbs and I have dynoed Willie's car more than 20 times making 450 rw on low boost and 510 on high boost. On the TD06 it did 380 rw at 16 psi through the stock auto ( oh wait that can't happen either) for those 2 years also. This is leaving out the years before this of running on an upgraded CT. Of course what the hell do I know, my car has really never spent much time under 16 psi anyways and has also made over 640 rwhp on a stock engine and has 4 years of daily driving,dyno tuning, and track runs on it, but wait that isn't supposed to happen either is it!
Doward said:16psi on a stock turbo = stupid high intake temps = prone to detonation.
detonation + stock head gasket = no.
16psi on stock turbo = no.
The transitive property is awesome!
X-man said:
Its your money, do what you want. More power to you. Go for 700hp. The man is always trying to hold us down. F--k conventional thinking.
X-man said:
did u know that the stock fuel system is not enough for 15psi on a stock ct either?
gotta have at least 550's, right trent? :icon_bigg <-- not sure if he's still here, but i'm sure someone still remembers the numbers he was putting down with the 440's back in the day