Rod knock?

[Epy]

Yea but, the thing is, while I have everything out and gutted, I want to start the REBUILD.

I do have a daily, and good reliability and transportation, but I only have about 3,000(and more the longer this goes on.. that's what I could spend today)

THanks for your post, that's much better info.

So I'm getting the compression lowered, end of story. To atleast 9 or lower
I've heard more people say DO that than not, so that's what I'll be doing. turbo pistons.

 

[wiseco7mgt]

Once you find out what pistons you want to use and the machinist has shaved the head and the block to a mirror finish(no raised edges) look for a suitable size metal headgasket to achieve you final compression target. Purchase some arp's while your at it, (either head studs or head bolts)
$3000. is a very tight budget and you may(will) need to look for second hand parts here on this forum to achieve your build.

 

[scubajtw]

I've already said, well maybe I haven't...

I made my build thread on sf.

I'm shooting for 10 psi, 20 or more on track

500-600 hp.
THat would be sufficient enough for me.

So god damnit everyone, can I ask the big question.

Should I lower the C/R and to what rate? or will stock hold this?
I've bene told 8.4:1

truckman, it's not that I don't know what I'm doing, but I've gotten a differen response out of every single person of let's say over 20... and then when I get a few in line(saying to lower c.r and go boost) a day or two later, some come out and say omg why would you do that, it's like, wtf people.

My plan for what I ME would like is 500 hp or more through boost built up motor and eventually nos.

CAN someone please tell me what this nos stuff is. sounds like a brand to me. do you have any training in automotive repair? and if all you have to spend is 3000 on a supra I am thinking you should maybe sell it and by a civic or something that doesnt cost as much.

 

[wiseco7mgt]

CAN someone please tell me what this nos stuff is. sounds like a brand to me. do you have any training in automotive repair? and if all you have to spend is 3000 on a supra I am thinking you should maybe sell it and by a civic or something that doesnt cost as much.

NOS is a mythical gas that's supposed to turn the standard ma70 into a mark 4 so were all scared to use it.

 

[Supracentral]

NOS is a mythical gas that[strike]'s supposed to turn the standard ma70 into a mark 4[/strike] when used by an idiot turns the standard MA70 into a hand grenade so were all scared to use it.

Fixed that for ya...

Nitrous Oxide (not NOS) can be used safely with the right tune and an engine in tip top condition. Because of the way Nitrous makes power, it puts far more stress on the internals than boost induced power.

By the way, at my local dyno shop, Nitrous Oxide refils are $3.50 a pound. If you ask for "NOS" it's $5 a pound. Call it an idiot tax...

 

[scubajtw]

Fixed that for ya...

Nitrous Oxide (not NOS) can be used safely with the right tune and an engine in tip top condition. Because of the way Nitrous makes power, it puts far more stress on the internals than boost induced power.

By the way, at my local dyno shop, Nitrous Oxide refils are $3.50 a pound. If you ask for "NOS" it's $5 a pound. Call it an idiot tax...

Thank you for the info. at least someone on this thread knows what they are talking about. I know what nitrous is how it works and how to use it. I was just wondering if the creator of the tread does

 

[Supracentral]

Yea, I caught the sarcasm.

For the uninformed, here's what nitrous oxide does:

The air we breathe is only about 21% oxygen. N20 (nitrous oxide) is about 33% oxygen. That's a 57.1% increase in available oxygen. That's a lot.

So nitrous puts more air in the cylinder allowing you to add more fuel to the cylinder generating more power. It does the same thing a turbo does. A turbo compresses air to get more oxygen in the same place, nitrous replaces air with a more oxygen rich blend.

As you can see above, what makes nitrous dangerous is that if you don't add the corresponding amount of fuel, you're going to run lean and blow the motor.

Why nitrous is more dangerous than a turbo is that nitrous is injected under pressure. The bottle pressure and size of jet is going to determine how much N20 goes into the motor. The nitrous system does not know how much fuel you are putting in. If your fuel pump fails, if an injector hangs, if any number of things go wrong, the nitrous is just going to keep on spraying.

Nitrous lowers the margin of error. Also since it's a very "oxygen rich" mix, it tends to burn a little faster and hotter, putting more stress on engine components.

Tread very lightly when using N20 with a turbo car. You've got two power adders running at the same time, which exponentially decreases your margin for error. If you think going lean on a nitrous injected N/A is bad, just wait until you do it on a car running 20 psi.

You can wind up with a piston that looks like this:

2JZ-GTE piston run lean under full boost during an extended run at over 160mph. Leaking EGR caused this.

 

[wiseco7mgt]

Fixed that for ya...

Nitrous Oxide (not NOS) can be used safely with the right tune and an engine in tip top condition. Because of the way Nitrous makes power, it puts far more stress on the internals than boost induced power.

By the way, at my local dyno shop, Nitrous Oxide refils are $3.50 a pound. If you ask for "NOS" it's $5 a pound. Call it an idiot tax...

lol whenever i hear NOS it reminds me of that movie.

 

[grimreaper]

Yea, I caught the sarcasm.

For the uninformed, here's what nitrous oxide does:

The air we breathe is only about 21% oxygen. N20 (nitrous oxide) is about 33% oxygen. That's a 57.1% increase in available oxygen. That's a lot.

So nitrous puts more air in the cylinder allowing you to add more fuel to the cylinder generating more power. It does the same thing a turbo does. A turbo compresses air to get more oxygen in the same place, nitrous replaces air with a more oxygen rich blend.

As you can see above, what makes nitrous dangerous is that if you don't add the corresponding amount of fuel, you're going to run lean and blow the motor.

Why nitrous is more dangerous than a turbo is that nitrous is injected under pressure. The bottle pressure and size of jet is going to determine how much N20 goes into the motor. The nitrous system does not know how much fuel you are putting in. If your fuel pump fails, if an injector hangs, if any number of things go wrong, the nitrous is just going to keep on spraying.

Nitrous lowers the margin of error. Also since it's a very "oxygen rich" mix, it tends to burn a little faster and hotter, putting more stress on engine components.

Tread very lightly when using N20 with a turbo car. You've got two power adders running at the same time, which exponentially decreases your margin for error. If you think going lean on a nitrous injected N/A is bad, just wait until you do it on a car running 20 psi.

You can wind up with a piston that looks like this:

[thumb]http://www.supracentral.com/articleimages22/will.meltdown.1.jpg[/thumb]
2JZ-GTE piston run lean under full boost during an extended run at over 160mph. Leaking EGR caused this.

outstanding info!

was it exhaust leaking back into the intake ? when i think egr leak i think exhaust leak out side of the cylinders leading to a false reading on an o2 sensor. You mind explaining a bit? Possibly a false, lower, reading on the egt's leading to a leaner fuel map?

 

[Epy]

Dude, don't come into my [strike]fucking[/strike] thread trying to bash me.

it's much easier to just write nos instead of nitrous oxide, i know exactly what it is and what it does, I said eventually, didn't I?
It's not unheard of to do it...

If I'm not going to get help, I'd rather you just not respond.
[strike]Fucking dick.(scuba)[/strike]
My view of the forum is decreasing at a rapid rate. anyways I should have the head off on thursday and crank out and everything out. ive been busy this week. the girlfriends bitching to hang. then I'll go from there on what exactly I'm going to do...

 

[grimreaper]

i foresee a LOT of hanging with the girlfriend :wavey: no need to get butt hurt :3d_frown:

A little bit of research on everything you have asked would have brought you your own answers. There are tons of books on these subjects as well. Your engine builder should have been able to answer most of your questions and explained why one is better over the other. I would find another shop if they couldnt/wouldnt.

 

[Supracentral]

Folks, lets tone it down a notch here.

No need to insult people, or call them names.

The goal here is to educate, not humiliate.

Back on topic please.

(Good post Grim)

 

[Epy]

i foresee a LOT of hanging with the girlfriend :wavey: no need to get butt hurt :3d_frown:

A little bit of research on everything you have asked would have brought you your own answers. There are tons of books on these subjects as well. Your engine builder should have been able to answer most of your questions and explained why one is better over the other. I would find another shop if they couldnt/wouldnt.

im confused as to your point for the first part...

I don't have an engine builder yet that's the thing... I'm trying to find one.
I want to make sure it's going to get done right so I'm still lurking.
I'm leaning towards one already that two local people have told me of. Of course, I have the bryan maloof racing supra recommended but I gotta make the decision of sending it out or not.

This is the local one that two honda guys have referred me to for their cb7's.
http://www.yellowpages.com/info-BS104703724/Revmaster-Machine-And-Parts/maps

 

[grimreaper]

i would send it out. If the shop isnt knowledgeable in the 7m, it can cost you. Make a list of tips Adjuster (mod on here) and quite a few others have posted on here that need to be done (tq plate, oil clearances, block decking, smoothness, cam cap lapping and line boring etc..) and call a few local guys. No tq plate should be your first indicator that they dont do 7m's frequently and to move on.

your going to get banned with the name calling. Most people wont continue to help you later on if you do that as well... a loose loose situation.

 

[Epy]

I kinda understood what you said.

How'd you know they didn't have a tq plate? (sorry if thats noobish again)

Yea i know its over.. move on...

 

[JDMMA70]

Just ask them if they bore using tq plates or not.

 

[Epy]

http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5631&highlight=Engine+builder

talkin' 'bout this one?

 

[grimreaper]

correct

 

[Sside]

Find the Machine Shop you want to go with. Talk to the guy in charge about your goals, budget, time and the opinions and advice given to you here on what to do with the block. See if its a happening or Just something you can not afford at the time for the RIGHT build for you. I was in the same situation a time ago and was expecting to pay about that much... 3,000 would be heaven right now.... I am at about 1,500 in just parts for the build minus the 1,800 bill from the shop and I still need a Metal Head Gasket... I also still need to buy alot of "little things" that will add up to a big $$ Number. To make story short, I am closing in on 5000 for my build.... You also need to think about the Head… Is it in good shape? Because if its not you are looking to spend at least 450$. I got a great deal of help from members in this forum giving me great deals on parts needed and the number still jumped a great amount. You cant just spit out 400 hp right from the get-go.... You need to start with light mods and build up to 400 hp.... Look at it like this, Plant a seed and take care of it. Make sure you follow directions closely. Water it when needed and baby it.... Then you can watch it grow into the fast 400 hp+ car that you want. Money wise, for just the light mods like a full 3 inch exhaust expect to pay 600 to 700 $$... Make a Plan… Choose the brands you want to go with, Stock internals can handle up to 400 hp…. Most importantly, be patient if you are planning to keep this car. Figure out real numbers and real parts you have to change and then come over here to get opinions on what you need… Good Luck With the Build… Hopefully everything turns out good for ya…

 

[Epy]

Ok so I am now going on 45 minutes and have gotten nowhere... I can't even get the first bolt loose. I've tried different ratchets, longer one, different size drives, loosen bolts oil, wd-40. what's next. I want to put like a pipe on the end of the handle to make ti like 2 feet long but I don't have one.

(taking the head off)

what's the trick?