Owner of a supra gets caught racing and gets car impounded.

ZoomZoomZoom

On the road again..
Dec 9, 2007
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labrat469;949031 said:
To truly understand a subject you must be able to see both sides. But you have shown us that you are incapable of that. Your question has been answered but you still refused to listen or to see both sides. You have shown us how closed minded you can be. If you actually wanted answers instead of trying to show your superiority you would have actually tried to understand but instead you shown us the inferiority of a closed minded person.

There is no longer any use in further discussion of this subject. Mods please lock or delete this thread.

Just because lilmissmk3 does not agree with your opinion (yes, OPINION), doesn't make her close-minded. By definition, a closed-minded person wouldn't even read these postings. Obviously she has read the entire thread and made some valid points. If she suddenly starts agreeing with you, would you call her "open-minded"? I'd call it being a rug..

Oh, and btw, her and I disagree on this issue. She would be appalled by my driving habits I'm sure. However, I totally respect lilmissmk3's opinion on the matter. She's right - street racing is dangerous, stupid, and illegal. And so is speeding. However, I choose to do it, and I accept ALL responsibility for the consequences.

I like that - asking the mods to lock the thread because someone doesn't agree with you. That really takes all the wind out of your argument.
 

Ma70.Ent

Supramania Contributor
Feb 26, 2006
1,871
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NJ
ZoomZoomZoom said:
asking the mods to lock the thread because someone doesn't agree with you. That really takes all the wind out of your argument.

I've been thinking of locking this thread for awhile, seeing as it's an argument that'll never be finished. The same points will get brought up over and over.
 

cuel

Supramania Contributor
Jan 8, 2007
1,536
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Baytown, Texas
SySt;937650 said:
If you can not control your car during simple acceleration in a straight line you may want to consider your abilities to drive in any other situation. Though it may be illegal, street racing is not wrong. That is like saying killing is wrong, yet we all partake in it some way or another.

There is one thing that seems to back up street racing when it comes to an arguement over it's danger. Whenever I am driving fast I am fully alert, I would generalize that is how it is for much of anyone who drives fast given their surroundings. Yet I see so many stupid moves made by drivers who are just not paying attention. Now you tell me who is most able to make good judgement out of a situation that may arise. The person who is going too fast for the situation or the person who does not even realize what the situation is?

The bottom-line everyone forgets about this arguement is simple. Some drivers are better than others. I am statistically safer doing 3 times the speed limit through curves and various other obstacles than the majority of drivers on the road. I have never been in an accident that involved an injury nor have I ever been considered at fault. Not that it makes much difference, but the three times I have collided with other vehicles I was not breaking any law and like I said was not at fault. The drivers of the other vehicles I collided with were simply being oblivious, not speeding or being otherwise "reckless".

There's the problem with street racing, to use your arguement. The people around you aren't paying attention. Your argument is a little flawed, as well. Street racing is wrong, as you are endangering other people, and their property.

Not that I haven't done it. Mostly just a quick sprint; through second, into third maybe. If they haven't passed me by then, they aren't going to. I'm a pretty aggressive driver. Normal driving(for me), I accelerate harder than most people, as I don't want to drive near most of the morons out there. Sometimes it happens that someone thinks I'm racing, when I'm just trying to put distance between myself and others. Them I let fly by. I'm not racing then, but it could be construed as such. I won't answer the phone, and change cd's in my driveway.

As far as dangerous: Dangerous is driving in someone's blind spot, or cutting off a truck that's twice as heavy(or an 18 wheeler, which is much, much heavier) as your car, and thinking it can stop as fast as you can. Dangerous is DUI, talking/texting(especially texting; morons) while driving, eating, and so much other stuff I see on a daily basis, done by people who have a huge problem with street racing, or racing in general, and actually think they're "good drivers." Changing the radio station takes your attention away from the road for a second or two. Digging through your cd collection, on the other hand, is not safe by any means. I see people all the time with their kids bouncing around loose in the back seat, or even in the front.

Most of the cases I see in the news, where people are killed by street racers, or because they were street racing, are by young people, with little driving experience, doing high speeds on tight, inner city streets. Stupid, irresponsible, and extremely dangerous. No thanks.
 

Dirgle

Conjurer of Boost
Mar 30, 2005
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Pauma Valley, CA
Wow... how did I miss this thread? This looks fun.


(Oh my government must protect me from everything; all my freedoms are worth it.)*-with a dash of heavy sarcasm.

Far and away, I do not agree with every law the government makes to protect me. Sometimes it's just asinine. Just because it's a law doesn't make it 'right', it only means I must abide by it. Or choose to face predefined penalties. Bitching about those penalties after I experience them is point less. I knew the consequence, and now I MUST deal with them, regardless.

I believe there is a time, place, and situation where street racing can be preformed safely and constructively. However, due to the inability of a large percentage of individuals to make an intelligent choice or decision in the matter, laws must be passed to deal with them. And prevent these idiots from killing other people. Because of the vast number of factors that affect something as unregulated as a street race, it is easier to simply ban all instances of it. As such street racing is illegal, deal with the consequences.

Also, I have zero sympathy for the so called 'innocent bystanders' that get hurt at street racing events. How intelligent do you have to be to stand next to a car driven by that stoned kid that was flipping your burgers earlier that day. He couldn’t even understand "no pickles please", just what were you expecting to happen when he got behind the wheel of this over powered 1/2 ton machine? I find it offensive that we have to make laws to protect you or him from yourselves.

The true innocent bystanders, the kind you see taken out on the side of the road at 3 a.m by some idiot who thought he had the 'right' to drive drunk, those are the ones I really feel bad for.

And yes driving is nothing more than a glorified privilege. I know from first had experience, I’ve had my license taken away for a long time due to multiple speeding infractions in my youth, (funny thing is I've never gotten a speeding ticket in the MKIII). Though I never really street raced. I would just get busted on the highway going to work. Rights are something people, governments, whatever are not allowed to take away from you. They damn well took my license. It is a privilege people, period. That little dog and pony show they have you do at the DMV is only the begging of the test, it continues until you stop driving because you’re too old. If you do too much stupid shit, you fail the test and lose your privilege that they granted you to operate a motor vehicle on their paved roads.

Also there was a time when I would have raised a BS flag on LilMissMkIII. I believed everyone street raced just once, even just stoplight to speed limit, just to see what it was like. But then I met one of my friends, and he is just like that. Has never street raced, has never put the accelerator to the floor, and only occasionally aggressively accelerates to merge on to the interstate. He doesn’t really care for cars, but owns a 2001 Mustang simply because that was the best deal when he went looking for a car. Sometimes I really have a hard time understanding his complete apathy toward the whole car culture. For him, he gets no thrill out of speeding, racing, working on his car, ect. He's completely dead to it, He wouldn't even drive if he didn't have to. Yet he dives, snowboards, sky dives, and does all manner of other adrenaline junky stuff. It baffles me, it does. But it proved to me that people like that truly do exist. So I believe LilMissMkIII can cast the first stone if she says she can.

However 3 hours of travel time one way is a stupid long way. For me something that far would be a weekend hobby only and only one weekend a month. But would I do it? Yes, to legally race I would.

Also one of the things that really bothers me is the fact that here in Washington, as in many states, any modification to a vehicle is illegal. I understand that it is a law and we have to abide by it or deal with the consequences, usually I deal with the consequences, but I have a hard time not bitching about it. I don't like making assumptions about people but LilMissMkIII acts like we have no right to modify our cars because it's illegal, fair enough it is. But the fact that we can't doesn’t seem to bother her. It seriously bothers me. Having the ability to change or alter my car is very important to me. I don't like having somebody say I'm a bad person because of it. Working on a car is really my zen moment, my meditation time. Seeing what I can do, what I can tweak with my car, is my from of constructive stress relief, I can't tell you how important it is in my life, and then to be able to take my car on a long drive, and feel the results of my creation, something that is less the factories and more mine. That is important. And it seriously disturbs me to have to deal with people that tell me I'm wrong, and create and back legislation just because my position is foreign to them, and they want to control a few idiots who can't modify their cars in a safe manner. It makes me angry. Excuse me while I go to work on my car.

And for those that didn’t catch it, I’m against street racing, It’s illegal. I don’t do it, I don’t really have the desire to these days, I’ve mellowed a great deal. But I do still remember the feeling, The fun, the excitement, the whole problem with authority moments, that youth tends to bring with it. So I understand it, but I do not agree with it.
 
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LilMissMkIII

That Aussie Chick
Aug 18, 2006
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Nice post mate :)

Just to clarify, I didn't mean that we shouldn't have a right to modify our cars. I just think that when we do, we should do so within the confines of the law. For example, for any modification I may make in the future, I will need to get engineered. This will cost me about $1000. However once I have that engineer's certificate, I can safely say that my car is certified as safe, not a danger to anyone, and the cops can't touch me.
 

Dirgle

Conjurer of Boost
Mar 30, 2005
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Gottcha ;)

Thanks for the clarification, the only thing we have that is similar to that over here is CARB certification. Unfortunately the hoops you have to jump through to obtain such a certification usually limits it to large company's, and most company's don't do that because it cuts heavily into their profits. Even a $1000 engineer's certificate would be nice.
 

Kangae

Buzzin' Half Dozen
Sep 13, 2007
249
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Utica, New York
Yeah I'm not sure that there is a provision for anything in my state, though I'm not exactly sure. The only time I've heard anything about it is from the police (i didnt get pulled over, I juat saw one standing around one day and asked him, seriously), and they say the only way a modification to your car is legal, is if the company that made the car approves the modification, and that CARB certs dont matter here.

I'm not sure where to look up this stuff for sure, but if anyone knows that might be cool if you told me.

Anyway though, I'm not trying to argue and specific point with this post, I'm just adding my little bit here.
 

labrat469

Member
Aug 1, 2007
174
2
18
Alabama
People want to act like street racing is such a crime that the perpetrator should strung up by their genitals and beaten like a piñata. Street racing is such a small percentage of the accidents compared to DUI and inattentive driving. I remember when road rage was the hot topic and was made out to be the worse thing to ever happen. (Oh shit someone going to blow their top and kill everyone on the road). The media blew it out of proportion big time. Somebody giving you the finger because you cut them off was considered road rage. The concern parent groups rallied and pressed the politician and the cops to do something about the latest menace. They enacted laws to stop it. Hmm sounds familiar... If we believed half the bullshit that the media hypes up we would not even leave our homes. Until they hyped up the dangerous in our own homes. But wait!! What about radon gas, carbon monoxide, and mold? Remember that hype. Everybody got scared of their own homes. Everybody was going to die from that stuff. We as a society has such a short attention span that if it's not blown to extremes we don't even pay it any attention. You all see my point. Don't believe the hype.

Unfortunetly when you hear about somebody dying because of street racing it's because someone did not use their common sense. They exercise their right to piss-poor judgement and now have to pay the cost. Loss of car and lincense, fines and jail time. Street racing is only as dangerous as the dumbest person involved. You don't know how many times I had a car revved up at me that I could beat with ease in broad daylight, heavy traffic, and a cop sitting behind me. I let the little ricer peel on out of there and get out of the way of the cop. I've had cops look over at me and smile as they lit up thier lights and went after the other driver. The ricer gets the tickets for excessive speed, exhibition of speed, reckless endangerment, reckless driving, and whatever else the cop can think of.

If you are going to race then use some common sense.
 

Supra7MG

Supramania Contributor
Oct 13, 2005
150
0
0
Duncansville, PA.
Dirgle;950494 said:
Wow... how did I miss this thread? This looks fun.


(Oh my government must protect me from everything; all my freedoms are worth it.)*-with a dash of heavy sarcasm.

Far and away, I do not agree with every law the government makes to protect me. Sometimes it's just asinine. Just because it's a law doesn't make it 'right', it only means I must abide by it. Or choose to face predefined penalties. Bitching about those penalties after I experience them is point less. I knew the consequence, and now I MUST deal with them, regardless.

I believe there is a time, place, and situation where street racing can be preformed safely and constructively. However, due to the inability of a large percentage of individuals to make an intelligent choice or decision in the matter, laws must be passed to deal with them. And prevent these idiots from killing other people. Because of the vast number of factors that affect something as unregulated as a street race, it is easier to simply ban all instances of it. As such street racing is illegal, deal with the consequences.

Also, I have zero sympathy for the so called 'innocent bystanders' that get hurt at street racing events. How intelligent do you have to be to stand next to a car driven by that stoned kid that was flipping your burgers earlier that day. He couldn’t even understand "no pickles please", just what were you expecting to happen when he got behind the wheel of this over powered 1/2 ton machine? I find it offensive that we have to make laws to protect you or him from yourselves.

The true innocent bystanders, the kind you see taken out on the side of the road at 3 a.m by some idiot who thought he had the 'right' to drive drunk, those are the ones I really feel bad for.

And yes driving is nothing more than a glorified privilege. I know from first had experience, I’ve had my license taken away for a long time due to multiple speeding infractions in my youth, (funny thing is I've never gotten a speeding ticket in the MKIII). Though I never really street raced. I would just get busted on the highway going to work. Rights are something people, governments, whatever are not allowed to take away from you. They damn well took my license. It is a privilege people, period. That little dog and pony show they have you do at the DMV is only the begging of the test, it continues until you stop driving because you’re too old. If you do too much stupid shit, you fail the test and lose your privilege that they granted you to operate a motor vehicle on their paved roads.

Also there was a time when I would have raised a BS flag on LilMissMkIII. I believed everyone street raced just once, even just stoplight to speed limit, just to see what it was like. But then I met one of my friends, and he is just like that. Has never street raced, has never put the accelerator to the floor, and only occasionally aggressively accelerates to merge on to the interstate. He doesn’t really care for cars, but owns a 2001 Mustang simply because that was the best deal when he went looking for a car. Sometimes I really have a hard time understanding his complete apathy toward the whole car culture. For him, he gets no thrill out of speeding, racing, working on his car, ect. He's completely dead to it, He wouldn't even drive if he didn't have to. Yet he dives, snowboards, sky dives, and does all manner of other adrenaline junky stuff. It baffles me, it does. But it proved to me that people like that truly do exist. So I believe LilMissMkIII can cast the first stone if she says she can.

However 3 hours of travel time one way is a stupid long way. For me something that far would be a weekend hobby only and only one weekend a month. But would I do it? Yes, to legally race I would.

Also one of the things that really bothers me is the fact that here in Washington, as in many states, any modification to a vehicle is illegal. I understand that it is a law and we have to abide by it or deal with the consequences, usually I deal with the consequences, but I have a hard time not bitching about it. I don't like making assumptions about people but LilMissMkIII acts like we have no right to modify our cars because it's illegal, fair enough it is. But the fact that we can't doesn’t seem to bother her. It seriously bothers me. Having the ability to change or alter my car is very important to me. I don't like having somebody say I'm a bad person because of it. Working on a car is really my zen moment, my meditation time. Seeing what I can do, what I can tweak with my car, is my from of constructive stress relief, I can't tell you how important it is in my life, and then to be able to take my car on a long drive, and feel the results of my creation, something that is less the factories and more mine. That is important. And it seriously disturbs me to have to deal with people that tell me I'm wrong, and create and back legislation just because my position is foreign to them, and they want to control a few idiots who can't modify their cars in a safe manner. It makes me angry. Excuse me while I go to work on my car.

And for those that didn’t catch it, I’m against street racing, It’s illegal. I don’t do it, I don’t really have the desire to these days, I’ve mellowed a great deal. But I do still remember the feeling, The fun, the excitement, the whole problem with authority moments, that youth tends to bring with it. So I understand it, but I do not agree with it.

Very well said. I believe that a lot of people that got involved with this thread had no idea of the depth that would be achieved. This is a very hot topic.
 

Supra7MG

Supramania Contributor
Oct 13, 2005
150
0
0
Duncansville, PA.
As far as modifying my car is concerned, it is my vehicle. I paid for it with no help from the government. Therefore, I see no right on their part to have a say in my aspirations.
And by the way, I am a government employee.
 

labrat469

Member
Aug 1, 2007
174
2
18
Alabama
ZoomZoomZoom;950324 said:
Just because lilmissmk3 does not agree with your opinion (yes, OPINION), doesn't make her close-minded. By definition, a closed-minded person wouldn't even read these postings. Obviously she has read the entire thread and made some valid points. If she suddenly starts agreeing with you, would you call her "open-minded"? I'd call it being a rug..

Oh, and btw, her and I disagree on this issue. She would be appalled by my driving habits I'm sure. However, I totally respect lilmissmk3's opinion on the matter. She's right - street racing is dangerous, stupid, and illegal. And so is speeding. However, I choose to do it, and I accept ALL responsibility for the consequences.

I like that - asking the mods to lock the thread because someone doesn't agree with you. That really takes all the wind out of your argument.

As for asking the thread to be locked. I said that because like the mod said it was going nowhere and I felt that the thread had the potential of getting really ugly because insults started to be posted. If you ever seen forum members turn on each other it gets really ugly and the forum shuts down. I did not want this forum with all the valuable information get wiped out because the mods and owner got tired of the bullshit and the members constant fighting. Sometimes a Mod will want to lock and delete a thread but are reluctant because they don't want to upset some of the friends they made here. All they need is one person say hey lock it up before it gets out of hand to justify a thread lock. Personally I would have locked this thread over 20 pages ago once the posts started to carry insults instead of information.

Once one poster got rude with her she stopped being open minded. She started to insult other posters with sarcastic remarks and tried to condescend to them. Instead of understanding that some of us don't have the money for a truck, a trailer for the car, and gas for each vehicle she called them... what was it .... cheap and tight-arses. For a track truck and trailer you're looking at around $4000 USD and that's a cheap truck and trailer. That's not including the gas and the upkeep. Just for the first year you're looking at over $6000 USD. That include gas, upkeep, track fees, insurance on both vehicles and trailer. I don't have that type of money. Track racing is expensive without any sponsors to offset the cost. Most sponsors won't touch a street legal car over 12 secs in the 1/4. Other posters tried to explain the cost to her and she just replied in a insulting and condescending posts. She choose not to see any other point but her own and insulted other posters who's views were not hers. And you all call that open-minded. She never once said "I can see why you street race but I still disagree." once someone got rude with her. If she said that I can respect that, but starting to insult others because they don't agree with you is close-minded. I don't care if she agrees or disagrees with me but at least try to see the other side to better understand. Her posts made her sound like she did not want to understand or see the other side.

I have to call the BS flag on her too saying she never street raced. I'm sorry I can not believe she never once tried out her car once she got it running right. Never had to out accelerate someone on the freeway or prove the Supra's superiority over some riced out 4-banger. Or never late at night pushed her car a little more than the laws allowed.

I've could have gotten rude and called some of you a bunch of brain-washed idiots with their heads up the media's ass waiting for the next hot topic to be shit out but instead I tried to show you how the media manipulates the public with the latest hot topic. Some of you seen my point. F&F did more damage to street racing once the media got a hold of it. Before F&F street racing accidents barely made the news and afterward it makes front page news. Mean while more important news gets pushed to the back pages because it's not the latest hot topic.

I'm starting to feel like Lewis Black here so I'm ending this post.
 

LilMissMkIII

That Aussie Chick
Aug 18, 2006
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Labrat469 - I have already said everything I wish to say on this topic. If you wish to continue your assumptions and negative posts about me personally, you are more than welcome to do so via PM :)
 

labrat469

Member
Aug 1, 2007
174
2
18
Alabama
LilMissMkIII;951617 said:
Labrat469 - I have already said everything I wish to say on this topic. If you wish to continue your assumptions and negative posts about me personally, you are more than welcome to do so via PM :)

I have no ill will toward you, never had. I just had a problem with the way you were trying to be insulting and condescending toward people who did not share your views. Remember I'm not the only one who noticed how you were coming across in you replies. I did not want you to suddenly agree with me. What type of debate would that be. Once you got a rude reply you went into a defensive mode. That's a natural response.

Street racing is illegal but it's not going to stop people from racing. It should be illegal because people have stopped using their common sense when it comes to street racing. But it's not going to stop them from racing. Actually I've agreed with you from the start. But I stated that it's not going to stop people from racing.

The real threat on the road are not rogue killer mutant street racers. It's all of us who don't see nothing wrong with talking on our phones while driving because in most states and countries it is not illegal, but it causes more injuries. I've taken the ditch more than a few times because some bimbo in her daddy's Benz was too damn busy talking on her phone and not paying attention to the road. I have to do some body work to the supra because of some sorority bimbo. Nothing major just have to replace a fender. I've never had an accident racing it's always been day to day driving that gets me.
 

ZoomZoomZoom

On the road again..
Dec 9, 2007
443
0
0
KY
labrat469;951294 said:
As for asking the thread to be locked. I said that because like the mod said it was going nowhere and I felt that the thread had the potential of getting really ugly because insults started to be posted. If you ever seen forum members turn on each other it gets really ugly and the forum shuts down. I did not want this forum with all the valuable information get wiped out because the mods and owner got tired of the bullshit and the members constant fighting. Sometimes a Mod will want to lock and delete a thread but are reluctant because they don't want to upset some of the friends they made here. All they need is one person say hey lock it up before it gets out of hand to justify a thread lock. Personally I would have locked this thread over 20 pages ago once the posts started to carry insults instead of information.

Spare me the lesson on netiquette. I'm an old-school USENET reader, which didn't have moderators (babysitters?) shutting down threads when users misbehaved. Oh, and that was before Al Gore invented the internet and you had to put WWW in front of everything ;)

I disagree with lilmissmk3, but I didn't feel insulted by her comments in the least. "Tight-arse" hardly qualifies as an insult. Must be because I've been called worse ;)

Obviously the mods disagree with your OPINION on the status of the thread because they didn't close it 20 pages ago. Its a worthy topic as it relates to being a responsible sports car owner. Sometimes we need a reminder that a 3500lb car can do alot of damage.
 

labrat469

Member
Aug 1, 2007
174
2
18
Alabama
ZoomZoomZoom;952136 said:
Spare me the lesson on netiquette. I'm an old-school USENET reader, which didn't have moderators (babysitters?) shutting down threads when users misbehaved. Oh, and that was before Al Gore invented the internet and you had to put WWW in front of everything ;)

I disagree with lilmissmk3, but I didn't feel insulted by her comments in the least. "Tight-arse" hardly qualifies as an insult. Must be because I've been called worse ;)

Obviously the mods disagree with your OPINION on the status of the thread because they didn't close it 20 pages ago. Its a worthy topic as it relates to being a responsible sports car owner. Sometimes we need a reminder that a 3500lb car can do alot of damage.

No I did not put www in front of everything. I just started the pay porn sites. Al did not invent the net, DARPA did in that 60's. Yes I'm a old schooler too. Been around computers since the Timex-Sinclair with a big 1K of RAM and had to program in machine language and all we had were BBS's running on a tape drive or a 8 in floppy and the modems were 300 BAUD and you had to put the reciever on top of the modem. In school we had the latest bleeding edge TRS-80's with monochrome screens and cassette drive and I ended up teaching the class because I knew more about programming in BASIC than the teacher that got suckered into teaching the class. I still have my Macintosh Classic and play PT-109 every now and then. I've been around alot longer than you assumed.

It doesn't take much today to start an internet argument that can get out of hand. You should know that as well as I do.

I agree with you about the damage a 3500 pound car. I'm more worried about the person not paying attention to the road. Street racers I can tolerate. They are not a problem. The smart ones race outside of town and the cops take care of the stupid ones. What pisses me off are the idiot parents that give their children a big ass SUV and a cell phone and think that their child is safe. Aw hell no! They just turned their child into a 4000+ pound idiot-guided missile. I've been rear-end at stop signs, my driver side door backed into at a stop sign, and ran off the road by people too busy talking and not paying attention. It's no fun looking out your driver side window and seeing the word "SILVERADO" on back of a truck coming at your head. Do you know how hard it is to try to climb into the passenger seat while you have your seatbelt on? Damn near impossible!

Street racers are not a major threat to me, it's the everyday driver that's a threat. It's a tragedy what happen to those kids but it happened because someone got stupid. He should have known better than to race in the area he was in. Those kids will never experience the things we've experienced and taken for granted. Stupidity doesn't deserve the death penalty but he should be in jail getting ass-raped by Bubba "The Booty Bandit" for the rest of his life.