I Ask Everyone here to read this Post!

[PIONEER]

I have been a part of the supra community for a number of years. It took a lot of work from a whole bunch of members to bring us where we are today. Before we had Internet forums, we had a not so fancy mailing list that would bring us all together and we can post our thoughts or have others help us when we ran out of ideas to resolve our problems. We were a tight group of people who watched each others back. Those were the good times.

In the last handful of years, we have seen our community grow by 10 fold. A new generation of supra enthusiasts are now among us. There is a good age difference b/w the supra owners of my time vs the owner today. Some of these new owners lack not only the technical knowledge but the maturity to communicate with others at a professional level. I am not the most active member here but I am around enough to notice a decline in the quality and the quantity of material presented here lately. Some of our key members who contributed so much to make sure this place is a success are no where to be found.

What the hell is going on here? The purpose of this site was to unite the hardcore supra enthusiasts who were ready to take the MK III to the next level but were being stopped by the money making machine of MVP/Supraforums. This site allowed its users some flexibility over the other forum and became a new home for a lot of us. I don't know when it happened but somewhere down the line we turned on each other. I'm afraid if this trend is allowed to continue too much longer, there will be no place called supramania.

Mike Donahue puts a lot of time and $ into this place so we can come here and interact with each other. Some of you should be ashamed of how you return that favor back to him by the quality of crap you publish on this site. We have lost a lot of our assets on this site and each day that goes by, this site is becoming nothing but a huge liability.

Like any good corporation, this company needs a complete re-org. There are times in life when you have to question Authority and I believe that time has come. We need to have a vote in the public domain about the people in-charge of running this site and decide who we want in control of the material and flush out all the weak links who do nothing but spoil the party.

I want to pull all the moderators together and let them explain to us why they think they are cutout for the job. I mean would you want someone with a piss poor attitude run your company? Put them up, see what they are made of. Let the members bring out the best in them. Put a thread up, post all of their names, and let the members pick who they feel comfortable with.

Lets make this a place what it used to be, A place we called Home...

 

[jtamulis]

Yeah, we've had issues. I know a lot of people have left the Supramania
forums. It's sad. I know you want to add to the people to bring the quality
of the mambers back up. Every forum has its growing pains and I'm afraid this
is just what happens when it does, a lot of the old timers get fed up with new
people. I'm sure you have a bunch of new ideas, I'd love to hear them.

 

[KeithH]

I have to agree with parts of this thread.

I joined the Supras.com mailing list back in 96. Sure, we had our fair share of junk on the list but we had a lot of good happening too.

The "Tech Tips" section on Supras.com was GREAT and provided a LOT of really great information for those that were looking for it - something lacking in these new forums that we have all come to enjoy.

It seemed that the people on the list back then knew how to find information. I'll give one example here - I read a post on one of the forums about a guy who "tried to do a search on Google for information on the "Supras Invade Las Vegas" event and couldn't find anything. I am not sure what terms he was using in his search (it was probably "hot lesbian sex") but he was unable to locate any information. I'm sorry but if you know the four terms "Supras", "Invade", "Las", and "Vegas" and you put any combination of those words into any search engine the site comes up #1.

Much like these forums we have also seen the camraderie of our events slide downhill too.

Pioneer: What is happening here is we are now officially old. We should just slump off to our Supra Retirement Home and reminise about the good 'ole days.

No matter what happens you will always have some people that will join, learn a lot, and then outgrow this site and move on.

 

[outofstep]

I think the key is to check someone's threads in other forums before making them a mod. Know just who it is that's asking to fill the slot. Just because someone raises their hand, doesn't mean they are fit for the job.

What two of them did recently was a fucking disgrace...

 

[aye mate]

I think that we should delete the OT section. That would help clean up the general attitude. All Supras, All the time.

 

[rakkasan]

Pioneer: What is happening here is we are now officially old.

Throw me in that group, too. I've noticed that 95% of the SM members are either 18-22 or 32-40 years old. I was 17 when the first MKIII rolled off the assembly lines, and now there are 17 year olds trying to get one running so they can drive it to school.

 

[rakkasan]

I think that we should delete the OT section. That would help clean up the general attitude. All Supras, All the time.

Best piece of advice yet. Kill it off.

 

[Ckanderson]

every person here was elected to become a mod.. due to thier expertise. myself... since i know a good amout of tech.. and have the time. I also watch the FAQ... mainly deleting random posts that have nothing to do with the FAQ... not the hardest job ever..

 

[KeithH]

I agree. If I need to get my PR0N fix... I know where to go. If I want to kill off a few brain cells I can go over to the OT section of TrollForums - or go have a nice stiff drink. I'd rather have a nice stiff drink. Death to OT and make strict rules about posting crap in the useful sections.

One thing we've been missing since the conversion to these forums is the Tech Tips section. We end up burrying data so far down it is pathetic and impossible to weed through the crap. I've often said that once a topic has run its course it should be boiled down to a nice tech tip and a sep page should be built for it - outside of the forum. If there is new debate about the tip it should happen in the forum and then have the tip updated if changes are necessary.

And... I'm not a mod.

 

[Loki]

One thing we've been missing since the conversion to these forums is the Tech Tips section. We end up burrying data so far down it is pathetic and impossible to weed through the crap. I've often said that once a topic has run its course it should be boiled down to a nice tech tip and a sep page should be built for it - outside of the forum. If there is new debate about the tip it should happen in the forum and then have the tip updated if changes are necessary.

I think that is a really good idea.

 

[GrimJack]

Don't despair yet, folks. There are some changes coming soon - they'd be closer, but my lovely wife decided to infect me with some evil disease that's knocked me out on my back for the last few days.

As for the OT section, deleting it really isn't a good idea - if we don't give members somewhere to vent, they will vent in our technical or Supra related sections, and that causes a whole new batch of issues to deal with.

Cliffs: I have some good ideas, and if you can give me a few days to recover, I should have them presentable and out there for everyone to comment on.

 

[GrimJack]

I've often said that once a topic has run its course it should be boiled down to a nice tech tip and a sep page should be built for it - outside of the forum. If there is new debate about the tip it should happen in the forum and then have the tip updated if changes are necessary.

That's a damn fine idea, and one I've been toying with for a while. One of the great features of vBulleting that we haven't used yet is the customizable FAQ section. I need to get this up and running, and then find some victi...err, I mean, volunteers to maintain it.

And... I'm not a mod.

So? You have just as much say as one - as does everyone here, IMO. Actually, given your history in the community, I'd be tempted to say you have even more influence than most of our mods or admins.

 

[aye mate]

As for the OT section, deleting it really isn't a good idea - if we don't give members somewhere to vent, they will vent in our technical or Supra related sections, and that causes a whole new batch of issues to deal with.

I'm not trying to start a fight or anything, but I think most of us have lives outside of SM and can vent elsewhere. If you must vent on the internet go to an OT forum. I can see how deleting OT would cause an infiltration into the other forums though. Just how I feel. And ditto on the Tech Tips, I personnally have been seeing alot of Tech questions that have been answered in threads whose titles might not be relevent.

 

[Boosthpy]

I am a newbie and ever since I saw my first supra I have tried to learn everything I could about it. I have looked through all of the pages in the information forum. This site has helped me understand a lot about the mk3 supra and the 7mgte engine. I guess I have no rants right now but I haven't been here long enought to know a difference.

 

[wingman]

coming from the 16 year old newbie...forum "idiots" i guess you could call them, will never go away, period. Deleting a section won't kill them off, because they will find somewhere else to vent on the site because they think they are familiar with this forum's members, thus giving them a reason. I don't frequent this site's OT section enough to know, but on many other forums it is a way for members to socialize with each other on a topic other than cars, guns, etc...

point being, there will always be idiots...even when the information is right there in front of them they will not bother to read it, or just think they deserve thier own "special" thread about it. You just have to learn to either skip right on by the topic, or put up with thier ignorance...or you can leave. Just because more and more dolts join a site doesn't automatically mean that the site needs a rebuild...they will eventually go away after they either give up on thier quest or learn enough to find out for themselves

What's important is that the information is there for those who want to know...and if it's not there, hopefully there is one smart, good willed person willing to help.

sorry for the rant...but I must say that in comparison to many other forums I frequent, this is quite possibly THE most professional and well behaved forum I know of...the general atmosphere is very mature and everything is well structured. It shocks me that people are complaining of a few idiots that seem to ruin the party for everybody

 

[PIONEER]

You've only been here 3 months...

Here are a few things I am thinking.

Get rid of All the mods.. ALL Of them, Super, baby, or whatever they are... What is the purpose of a mod? it is not to provide technical knowledge, but to be fair in their judgment and not take sides. Once you become a mod, you have to look at the situation from both sides b/c your purpose is to bring civil order in a UN-calm situation. You can not be treated as just another member. You have a bigger responsibility which is to make sure everyone plays fair and no conflicts break out. When a conflict does brake out, handle the situation professionally and don't come across as a hardass. Sure some situations will swift judgment, and that must be exercised to let the offenders know we are not here to put-up with anyone's garbage. I could care less if you are a super mod, You are worthless if you can't control the situation and instead of resolving the matter, you allow the siege to escalate.

Go through the active list of members who have some age on them. Maturity comes with age. Pick some old timers who would want to be mods. Where is Dr jones, or Adjuster, or Jeff Lange, Bishop, IJ (you could be on night shift since you are in a different time zone). Jeff Tamulis how about you stick your head up and contribute more to this site.

Get rid of off topics. Some how our members think off topics means everything if off limits. You want to vent, go vent somewhere else. If you are frustrated about the car, post on the general section. If you are frustrated at life, Seek professional help. This is a forum dedicated to the Supra. We are not here to baby-sit grownups and find a cure to their personal problems.

 

[Charlie97L]

I've been a Moderator on a few Celica forums in the past, (and i'm in that nebulous late 20s age group that no one else seems to be in) and I'm not a huge fan of the OT section either, but it's an effective buffer against the kind of random stuff everyone seems to have a problem with. Having moderated a site that had no OT for a while, I agree with GrimJack, it's definitely necessary. You guys can't imagine the crap that will get posted in general discussion if it's not there.

Basically, the two sites I used to mod, the unspoken thing with OT was "if you don't want to get your cage rattled/get offended, don't go in that section." We even had a disclaimer page on one of them each time before you could view the area. You have to take everything in there with a grain of salt. There is a lot of offensive stuff on the internet. What do you do if you are offended by porn? You don't go to porn sites. Easy enough. No one is missing anything by not visiting OT.

I've definitely noticed that people really don't get that idea here. It's not a criticism, just an observation. Everyone has to realize, and this is a tough thing, that there are people on SM in OT who's main reason for being on the site is to get people worked up. It happens in every forum. And they might hide that by trying to make legitmate posts elsewhere, but it's a fact, I've had to deal with it in everyone online community I've been a member of. They get off on the reaction. That's why OT is so important, to keep that stuff buffered from the rest of the community.

I think this is headed in the right direction, and despite being a newb here, if you guys need any help with the grunt work, let me know. I have loads of time at work right now, my job is in a major slump, waiting on a court decision regarding a contract dispute.

 

[drjonez]

I think the key is to check someone's threads in other forums before making them a mod. Know just who it is that's asking to fill the slot. Just because someone raises their hand, doesn't mean they are fit for the job.

What two of them did recently was a fucking disgrace...

exactly.

every person here was elected to become a mod.. due to thier expertise. myself... since i know a good amout of tech.. and have the time. I also watch the FAQ... mainly deleting random posts that have nothing to do with the FAQ... not the hardest job ever..

elected? who cares what the popular vote is- take a look @ the number of morons that make it into politics. expertise rarely has anything to do w/whom is elected.

…Go through the active list of members who have some age on them. Maturity comes with age. Pick some old timers who would want to be mods. Where is Dr jones, or Adjuster, or Jeff Lange, Bishop, IJ (you could be on night shift since you are in a different time zone). Jeff Tamulis how about you stick your head up and contribute more to this site...

Interesting….the problem is the old timers are fed up with everyone else…

…Get rid of off topics. Some how our members think off topics means everything if off limits. You want to vent, go vent somewhere else. If you are frustrated about the car, post on the general section. If you are frustrated at life, Seek professional help. This is a forum dedicated to the Supra. We are not here to baby-sit grownups and find a cure to their personal problems.

Dead on. This is a supra site, not Iwanttopostsweetpornpix.com or ineedhelpcausemymommywontfixmysupra.com

on w/the topic-
as some may know, i left this site quite some time ago ('cept for the FS postings, etc.). my motivation for leaving was simple- the mod staff is inadequate, incompetent or not caring. morons are allowed to run free and mis-info is rampant. after a few altercations, i felt there was no reason for me to continue to waste time here when NOTHING was being done by the mod staff to control those that were out of line. this was part of my drive to create mkiiitech.com- a place of learning/info w/little to no chatter.

yes, the number of active MKIII owners has increased- that's mostly due to the LOW price of entry and the allure of mad-JDM-tyyyteness. this brings in new owners with little to no knowledge that are concerned only with "modding" and neglecting the necessary things (maintenance, etc.). IMO, the only way to properly deal w/this is control and constant moderating. the younger generation is used to instant gratification and having things handed to them- this will do nothing for them in the quest to maintain or even mod a 20 yr old car, learning is KEY. There are TONS if resources out there- from SOGI to the FAQ here and on SF to MKIIITech.com….but does anyone really use them? Heck no. so much easier to just post “how do I ____________?” than to spend 5 min READING.

Can anything be done? Honestly I don’t think so….i do applaud the attempt here to rectify the downward spiral that is SM.

 

[SupraMario]

I've got to agree with Keith and wing and a lot others here, wing is right about this site being a very professional status in my book, what I truely think should be implemented is the thread names for problems people have, i really avoid a lot of post that are headed "help" or "whats wrong with my car", i think you all catch what i'm saying, like keith said the amount of clutter in some of the sections of the forums is a bit much.
as for the OT section, yes there will be trolls and post that make others mad, but i really think that if it is used correctly as a place to get to know other members better then it shouldnt create to many problems.
the tech section sounds great, but labling again needs to be implemented.
as for the older guys "leaving", thats normall we all will eventually move on, to either another car or just slowly forget about SM, ive been here now for close to 5 years, not near the time keith or others like pioneer have been, but long enough to see alot of very smart members that know more about the MKIII that toyota does, leave.
regardless of who is visiting this site be it 16-23y-o or 32-40y-o, you 32-40y-o guys need to at least respect the younger members, i know a lot of you do, and can totally understand if some ricer wanna-be supra enthusist comes to this site, thowin stuff around like they are the almighty, yes by all means put that little bastard in his place, but try not to nose off the us younger members because we are younger, you too where once our age and had a dream to own some hot ass car, well srry that i was born later than you but i love my car more than anything even if i do drive it back and forth to school,

i love my car so damn much that i went and invested my hard earned money from working a crappy job 60+ hours a week in the summer to buy this bucket of bolts and make it what it is, just because i cant rebuild my engine in under 2 hours doesnt mean i have less love for this car than you do.
its my dream car and will always be. i'll never sell my supra, its mine and its going to stay that way.
just my $0.02

 

[SupraMario]

on w/the topic-
as some may know, i left this site quite some time ago ('cept for the FS postings, etc.). my motivation for leaving was simple- the mod staff is inadequate, incompetent or not caring. morons are allowed to run free and mis-info is rampant. after a few altercations, i felt there was no reason for me to continue to waste time here when NOTHING was being done by the mod staff to control those that were out of line. this was part of my drive to create mkiiitech.com- a place of learning/info w/little to no chatter.

you posted faster than me but im total in with this.

yes, the number of active MKIII owners has increased- that's mostly due to the LOW price of entry and the allure of mad-JDM-tyyyteness. this brings in new owners with little to no knowledge that are concerned only with "modding" and neglecting the necessary things (maintenance, etc.). IMO, the only way to properly deal w/this is control and constant moderating. the younger generation is used to instant gratification and having things handed to them- this will do nothing for them in the quest to maintain or even mod a 20 yr old car, learning is KEY. There are TONS if resources out there- from SOGI to the FAQ here and on SF to MKIIITech.com….but does anyone really use them? Heck no. so much easier to just post “how do I ____________?” than to spend 5 min READING.

Can anything be done? Honestly I don’t think so….i do applaud the attempt here to rectify the downward spiral that is SM.

one reason i dont post to much on the general or 7m tech, I read when i have a problem, i have a book on my car and know where to get the info, prolly why the reason my car has yet to see a week worth of down time because of a mechanical or electrical problem.
Dr. J we do miss your very informative post, well a lot of us who know you miss them.