How many run without EGR?

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jdub

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rawmk3;1143850 said:
And 3.75 a gal isnt really bad since its more here. And when your running high octane and or race fuel the prices go up from there. If you cant afford to pay for the fuel, then dont build the hell out of your car. Keep it mild, and fuel economy will be better.



Its a proven fact that in balance the hotter exhaust temps help a turbo motor. Just like little to NO back pressure. You may want to do the research on that. Cause the heat in the exhaust side of the turbo is what causes the turbine to spin, thus causing boost. Most turbo's get a "diaper" on the exhaust side to keep that heat in, as the same reason most headers get wrapped as well. You keep that heat in the pipes where its needed, and out of you engine compartment where it isnt needed. If your turbo gets to cool, it gets what is referred to as turbo chill. And effects boost.



Please dont be so narrow minded. Jdub, 90% of what I have seen from you comes down to, the toyota gods that designed this platform of vehicle were revolutionary, and infaluable. Yet there are a few things that have shown untrue to that line of yours of what is there is there for a reason.

First off most of the wiring is to thin of a ga for a reliable connection for a long time. Example is the starter, knock sensor, fuel pump. Then the EGR concept. Yes its there for the reasons you state, but it does not have to be there for the vehicle to work correctly. In certain instances yes you could detonate and cause a ton of problems, but that is mainly under certain parameters ONLY.

I dont see you flaming people who are putting FFIM's on the cars saying the stocker was there for a reason, and toyota knows better than the first guy to do that, I dont see you flaming people running stand alones saying toyota's ECU is way better either. There is ALWAYS room for improvement, and it takes peoples drive to change things and fail to make something that is successful. So you saying that something isnt a good idea or anything like that is kinda a moot point. You can say im rationalizing pulling my EGR, but frankly im not going to need it.

Fuel prices arent really a major concern for me in my supra, since its not a daily driver and im building it for power not fuel economy. So if those statements mean I have been eating shrooms, I guess you must be right. But after my car is built and I post up everything on my build you can then tell me everything I have done wrong, and that i should have left the car alone to toyota's spec. The concept of to each their own is great, and you giving reasons as to what is good and bad about pulling something like an EGR should be only that. State the facts, and let the person make their own choice. Stop flaming people for saying they dont want the extra 2-5mpg, or lower exhaust gas temps. If someone grenades a motor because of an EGR not being there, then point it out, and say an EGR would have helped stop that, but other wise, I have yet see a documented event where an EGR would have prevented a blown motor under normal driving conditions.




First of all...how about using paragraphs. That was hard as hell to read. (Nice ninja edit BTW)

From what I can gather you're saying, higher EGT is better because you want the heat through the turbo. That is just plain wrong...you're asking to blow your motor if you increase EGT for the reasons you stated. I never said that keeping heat in the exhaust system was bad.

Where in this thread have I talked about wiring?

I have stated there are alternatives to running the EGR...I've flamed no one. I clearly stated one of those alternatives was a stand alone EMS...I have no idea of what you're getting at. On a stock TCCS car, Toyota did put the various parts there for a reason...remove at your own risk.

As far as me posting incorrect info...show me. I know I've corrected you more than once and I have the tech documents to prove what I say/post.
Facts rule...opinions don't mean crap.

I'm not sure why you posted this rant (it makes very little sense), but I do know you have only a superficial knowledge of how the TCCS in this car works. If you think that I'm "flaming" for pointing that out (and other incorrect info) in this and other tech threads, why don't you PM SupraCentral and see how he feels about it.

Me narrow minded? Sure you're not looking in the mirror?
 

grimreaper

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This is the fact section raw, in six months guys like you and me are going to search for help and pull this or a few other threads up looking for FACT to help solve their problem and they will be stuck with crap you have written.
 

92TealSupra

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jdub;1143883 said:
First of all...how about using paragraphs. That was hard as hell to read.

From what I can gather you're saying, higher EGT is better because you want the heat through the turbo. That is just plain wrong...you're asking to blow your motor if you increase EGT for the reasons you stated. I never said that keeping heat in the exhaust system was bad.

Where in this thread have I talked about wiring?

I have stated there are alternatives to running the EGR...I've flamed no one. I clearly stated one of those alternatives was a stand alone EMS...I have no idea of what you're getting at. On a stock TCCS car, Toyota did put the various parts there for a reason...remove at your own risk.

As far as me posting incorrect info...show me. I know I've corrected you more than once and I have the tech documents to prove what I say/post.
Facts rule...opinions don't mean crap.

I'm not sure why you posted this rant (it makes very little sense), but I do know you have only a superficial knowledge of how the TCCS in this car works. If you think that I'm "flaming" for pointing that out (and other incorrect info) in this and other tech threads, why don't you PM SupraCentral and see how he feels about it.

Me narrow minded? Sure you're not looking in the mirror?

JduB, did his little hissy fit here show his understanding of anything? Also what point was he getting across, I think he confused himself in his own little world, lets hope he stays there. :nono:
 

williamb82

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92TealSupra;1143832 said:
Another case of blocking..

When will people learn! Sticky, this someone.. it needs to be seriously addressed. That engine by the way is hell a dirty in that thread he has, why not clean it? that will reduce engine temps.

i had just gotten the engine from the pick and pull. you only have 30 days to bring it back if its bad. i was more concerned with getting it in the car to insure it didnt knock then cleaning it. also, that isnt the permanent engine anyway. im building another one with forged internals and tons of headwork, which also wont have an egr(check my cardomain for my 84). also i have read that the egt's remain lower with the egr. i still wont run it. im not worried about it. ive never had any issues without it and had it blocked on several motors. i just took the opurtunity to make it look cleaner with this engine and posted a how to. simple as that. funny maybe two years ago tops every one and their brother wanted egr block off plates. now that its been recorded to have lower egt's with it hooked up at cruise you all want it back. my egt's were never high unless pulling hard at full boost. highest i think ive seen was ~1500deg f. if i get that high cruising, there is something far worse wrong then the egr. my ms2 will be on in about 2 weeks or so so ill have full control over everything anyway.
 

92TealSupra

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williamb82;1144008 said:
i had just gotten the engine from the pick and pull. you only have 30 days to bring it back if its bad. i was more concerned with getting it in the car to insure it didnt knock then cleaning it. also, that isnt the permanent engine anyway. im building another one with forged internals and tons of headwork, which also wont have an egr(check my cardomain for my 84). also i have read that the egt's remain lower with the egr. i still wont run it. im not worried about it. ive never had any issues without it and had it blocked on several motors. i just took the opurtunity to make it look cleaner with this engine and posted a how to. simple as that. funny maybe two years ago tops every one and their brother wanted egr block off plates. now that its been recorded to have lower egt's with it hooked up at cruise you all want it back. my egt's were never high unless pulling hard at full boost. highest i think ive seen was ~1500deg f. if i get that high cruising, there is something far worse wrong then the egr. my ms2 will be on in about 2 weeks or so so ill have full control over everything anyway.


Come combustion chamber can see 1600 ~ degree's, and removing that may bring it up slightly, you will also reduce risk of detonation too if you keep* it there.
 

figgie

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rawmk3;1143882 said:
So if I am misinformed in any way, feel free to say something. I love learning new things.

Well then. I will take that invite....



rawmk3;1143850 said:
Just like little to NO back pressure.........

Hell NO!

***takes out my highly spit polished curb stomping boots***

First of all. Only the morons and the regurgitators of what they hear even use that infernal word. "Back" pressure. There is no such thing!
What exactly is back pressure? Once you define that. What is pressure? Double negative much?

Nothing gets me more rialed up than that cursed word! A term coined by some "tuner" somewhere that has taken off with zero basis in facts (and specifically fluid mechanics).

You see under my ID what I put?

BackPSI is my bat signal! I am making it a point to curb stomp idiots that insist on using that infernal word.

By you even using that word makes you argument moot as it shows ZERO understanding of even a basic fluid mechanics design and you are attempting to take a jab at jdub.

Please! Move along. When ever you actually understand what the difference between pressure and the non-exitant "back-pressure" word is. Than come and attempt to form a debate. Until then. Nothing more than the same ole shit being regurgitated by another poster.
 

williamb82

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92TealSupra;1144048 said:
Come combustion chamber can see 1600 ~ degree's, and removing that may bring it up slightly, you will also reduce risk of detonation too if you keep* it there.


maybe if i stay with stock electronics. im going ms2, and also plan to install a direct port water injection later. detonation will not be an issue.
 

Poodles

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In that case you're fine.

Running the stock ECU + no EGR = issues. Going standalone gets rid of the stock ECU so it's not needed...
 

Blksupra1jzed

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Neal;1142874 said:
Jdub: what colour is the plugs on your loom grey(ECU end)...

BLKsupra: Its kinda funny when your racing nissan GTR's and other JAP imports, you both scream to 180kph and stay there next to each other just chilling not accelerating.


No kidding! Oh well...doesn't really bother me too much. I have only taken the Supra to the track twice in 6 years. Definitely don't care to do over 120 or really even near it on the street.
 

jdub

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Neal;1142874 said:
Jdub: what colour is the plugs on your loom grey(ECU end)...

BLKsupra: Its kinda funny when your racing nissan GTR's and other JAP imports, you both scream to 180kph and stay there next to each other just chilling not accelerating.


Neal - Just read the e-mail from my bud on his JDM ECU. It has been modified to remove the speed limiter. I have no idea (neither does he) exactly how, but it does not behave the same as you described. It looks like you are correct for the JDM ECUs.
 

Nick M

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Supra87T;1133238 said:
I have no EGR on my JDM 7M-GTE and I just bought one to put on it if that tells you anything....

Jdub has already pointed out some good reasons for you to keep it.

And this has never been covered on this forum or other Supra forums before either.

87targa;1133431 said:
i could be wrong about this but it looks like only one cylinder (number6) is feeding the egr. is that correct? if so, how rich can that gas be in fuel?

So a front facing intake manifold only delivers air to one cylinder?

ChrisC;1133622 said:
$5.00 a gallon is cheap man.. Ive been paying $5.56 a gallon for the past 2 months :aigo:

78 cents a gallon in Kuwait.

jdub;1134778 said:
JJ - Gotcha...the pressure differential is primarly between E and exhaust until R is uncovered. Makes sense...it's only when exhaust pressure is low the EGR shuts off when E only is active. I don't dig into the NA stuff that often...good to know ;)

Godspeed - I agree, probably OT in this thread.

Maybe if you weren't flying around with your friends all the time and working on Toyotas, you would have known that ported vacuum was the weapon of choice for Toyota for a long time. :biglaugh:
 

jdub

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Basically, TRD says the EGR lowers throttle response and bottom end power...in the case of the 7M, that's idle to ~4000 RPM and is correct. Not a big issue at all for a street car, especially when you consider the impact the EGR has in this RPM band. Once above 4000 RPM, the motor produces the max power it's capable of. I have a hard copy of that catalog BTW ;)

If you want to remove the EGR for a race car, go for it...you should be running a standalone EMS anyway and can tune as required.
 

Mike Morris

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I think its too risky to leave it off. I have not run one in years but maybe I am lucky since I don't really commute in it. I will either add it or get a JDM ecu.
 
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