Hoodpins + Stupidity

cjennings

New Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Des Moines Iowa
Well I guess I am a ricer then.... My car has been called alot of things, you're the first to say rice. I guess all the domestic guys are ricers too with there old muscle cars. You might want to check many local track requirements, many of them will require pins for cars within certian times.

As for the fire and nomex comments..... first off, the nomex gloves are pretty thin, nomex does not protect you from heat, but rather the flash that is involved with instant exposure to a flame, I think you are refering to structural firefighting gloves which have a significant amount of insulation in them. I open 3 or 4 hoods a month while they are on fire with them, takes a little practice, the gloves are clumsy like you said. The nomex Gloves I have go about up about mid forearm and provide just a enough heat insulation for a second or two of exposure, but you are right about not protecting my face or other body parts, my car is not worth a lifetime of burn scares.

As for the hood pooping up, if you have the pins installed, you still leave the spring mechanism inplace to get the hod up a few inches, you just disable the hood latch (the device that catches the hood when you pop it.) so you can get to pulling it up.

Your other statements about open a hood when a fire is present is of course correct. No agruement there, however in my case, the fire was in its early stage and I would have been able to easily manage the task quickly. Another point on an engine fire, depending of course what is burning, but many fires will burn themselves out when the hood is opened, you are actually allowing the engine fire to cool (elminating the thermal layering and build up of fire gases by the hood). You have to take into account that fire needs heat to burn, when the hood is down, the heat breaks down the plastics and rubbers which release the gasses which allow the burn to take place. This process is call pyroalysis, but this is getting way off base. Do however try to burn a rubber hose or fire resistant wire, it will burn itself out in open air, put a bunch of the stuff together in a enviroment where the heat is trapped and oxegen is still able to be consumed, the stuff will burn like crazy.

I did try as you mentioned to hit the fire with a Dry Chem from under the car, the manifold was simply blocking any agent from sificiantly stopping the fire. You statement about hitting the fire from under the car is absolutely correct, I do it all the time that way. The fire I had, when I realized I had a fire, was nothing, I could have blown it out, but it just kept growing and growing.

Moral of the story, be careful with fire, it wants to burn you.

P.S. - my hood does hold itself up by itself, My gas struts work great. All I needed to do is pop the hood and give it a push -> from the side of the car that was not involved in the fire at the time.
 
B

Boostaddctn

Guest
That is very interesting, this is the first I heard that hood pins are required in certain times, the whole time I was only told about helmts faster than 14s and roll bars after 12s, but when are hood pins required? Generally at tech they usually just make sure my hood stays shut and I have hood pins on my car as well because my latch assembly was taken out when I was doing some front end modification, but at what time do you have to run that requires hood pins? aight peace
 

cjennings

New Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Des Moines Iowa
I swear I had one of the track guys mention it once when I was first starting out, I am not sure if it was track requirement or if perhaps I totally misunderstood. Anybody know for sure the answer to this?
 

flubyux2

Madd Tyte JDM yo ®
Apr 2, 2005
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yo CJ. youre not exactly a ricer. youre car isnt mostly stock...

now if you have the spring still functional, that would make a world of difference in quickly getting the hood open. alot of people would completely remove the entire latch assembly and not have anything to pop the hood up at all. at this point you WOULD have to dig your finger tips into a 10mm gap between the hood edge and nose panel. your heat resistant gloves are bulky and cumbersome. the closest thing i have to compare to are my welding gloves, and those are thinner i think. the nomex gimmicks that everyone else was referring to are coming to mind as the Mechanix gloves. those are thinner, but still dont allow the dextarity or accessiblity required to pry up a hood w/o the spring in place.

an underhood flame suppressant system is quite an idea... a halon system would be quite cool. any thoughts on that?
 

cjennings

New Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Des Moines Iowa
There are many systems out there, I will have one of those installed one day, you basically install the storage tank, a firing pull pin mechanism and some lines to various shooting points in the bay. Should be pretty simple, I have seen it on some really built up muscle cars around here. Only problem is you only got one shot.

I don’t think you can actually use Hallon any more. I think they banned it completely. There is some other agent, and I am drawing a blank now this is mostly used. I would almost think most systems are using a dry chem. compound for its coating ability. Hallon once released (or any airborne gaseous agent) would dissipate and a charged electrical fire would flare back up pretty quick, then again that is the point of the battery disconnect switch.

I think there was discussion on this a while ago and a kit was only like $200~$300 to piece together for purchase.
 

flubyux2

Madd Tyte JDM yo ®
Apr 2, 2005
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well, i guess halon would be primarily for use around sensative electronics... being that its an engine bay, there really isnt much call for Halon as there are minimal electronics that are super sensative.

CO2 would probably be nice, like a big 15lb bottle. i dont like dry chem... its a Huge mess to clean up.. .and ive seen dry chem cause flare up too. almost lost my apt due to a dry chem.
 

cjennings

New Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Des Moines Iowa
Your right about halon for eletrical, but what I was talking about was that the halon is actually banded now, clean air act of 1994 I think due to halon being a CFC. There is an newer, enviro product out there... damn what the hell is it.

And yeah, dry chem is a mess, and crappy to breath in. It will leave a mess and can also damage engine parts, if you ever hit a fire with dry chem, get rid of the stuff fast, it must be have some oxidation properties or something.

What is this apt sorry? currios to know. The thing I dont like about dry chem is you really need to cover the fire with it, think of it as pressured backing soda for all intents and purposes (yeah I know there is a difference). I am thinking by a flare up you mean the pressure of release spread some flames like in an cooking pot fire or something where the fluid gets pushed out of the container?
 

chevyeater

wastegate hose is pulled
Mar 30, 2005
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Long Island, NY
Yes, Halon is illegal. It is too bad, I witnessed a 10 lb bottle of halon extingish a fully involved Ford Bronco fire years ago. It is a very effective fire suppresant. Dry chemical extinguishers are the second best for car fires IMO. We have them all around the shop, and I have witnessed thier effectiveness as well, on a Geo Metro engine (and surrounding parts of the shop) fire. The mess they make is completely irrelivant when a working fire needs to be put out. It isn't that hard to clean up anyway, having actually cleaned it up myself. It may damage polished parts but simply wipes or washes off of most anything else.

I can open my hood quickly and easily with my Nomex gloves on, same as bare handed really, except I have some protection. They aren't like oven mits or something.

I don't know about you guys but, I can't get under my car with an extinguisher, without jacking the car up. I would have no choice but to open the hood to put the fire out.

I also helped a friend put a fire supression system in his SCCA race car. It was designed to supress the fire in order to allow the driver time to escape. There are corner workers, and usually fire trucks as well, on standby at the track to actually extinguish the fire.
 

cjennings

New Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Des Moines Iowa
You are bang on, Halon was one of the most effective fire suppresants around. I saw guys shoot it through a crack of a hoodline and drop a good engine fire before I got off the firetruck one day. We would have used at least 100~150 gallons of water.