Ok, Ive got one of those recharge kits but my Haynes bood does not tell me about the high/low side ports are and which is which, any help?
A/C recharge
- Thread starter JesseH
- Start date
They're not called "death kits" in the MVAC biz for nothing. You're making a big mistake by using one but I suppose it's too late now.
Please tell me why they are called death kits? I've considered charging mine myself as well.
Thanks.
Thanks.
They're called death kits for several reasons. If they don't kill the person using them, which is what happens when someone hooks them to the high side (can't do it on a Supra though), they almost always lead to the death of the AC system down the road.
Many have sealants, no oil, ect. If the system is low on refrigerant it's also low on oil. Not to mention a system that is low on refrigerant can't be topped up properly for other reasons. Or I should say it can, but the eventual failure will end up costing a lot more than it would've to do it right the first time. Frankly, why anyone who doesn't know the difference between the high and low side would even be attempting to service an AC system in the first place is beyond me. MVAC techs are licensed for a reason you know.
For those seeking AC help I can sometimes be found on:
http://tinyurl.com/8bmdw and http://tinyurl.com/ekp3u
The other guys there are always willing to help if I'm not around. Mention death kits at your own risk though...
Many have sealants, no oil, ect. If the system is low on refrigerant it's also low on oil. Not to mention a system that is low on refrigerant can't be topped up properly for other reasons. Or I should say it can, but the eventual failure will end up costing a lot more than it would've to do it right the first time. Frankly, why anyone who doesn't know the difference between the high and low side would even be attempting to service an AC system in the first place is beyond me. MVAC techs are licensed for a reason you know.
For those seeking AC help I can sometimes be found on:
http://tinyurl.com/8bmdw and http://tinyurl.com/ekp3u
The other guys there are always willing to help if I'm not around. Mention death kits at your own risk though...
i need my AC to work too, it still has r12, it is completely dry, and thus it doesn't turn on... what are my options? Also, I would like to stay with r-12... Thanks guys!
what do you mean you cant hook it up to the high side on a supra?? there is a high and a low side the high side is the port infront of your radiator, the low is directly on the compressor, and johnathan1 why would you want to stay with r-12? i dont even think you can get that anymorejetjock said:Goodie, I get to flaunt my EPA 609 certified MVAC technican certification, sometime I almost never get to do here because most guys rip out their AC.
They're called death kits for several reasons. If they don't kill the person using them, which is what happens when someone hooks them to the high side (can't do it on a Supra though), they almost always lead to the death of the AC system down the road.
Many have sealants, no oil, ect. If the system is low on refrigerant it's also low on oil. Not to mention a system that is low on refrigerant can't be topped up properly for other reasons. Or I should say it can, but the eventual failure will end up costing a lot more than it would've to have done it right the first time. Frankly, why anyone who doesn't know the difference between the high and low side would even be attempting to service an AC system in the first place is beyond me. MVAC techs are licensed for for a reason you knowhttp://
The high side port should not fit your kit. That's done to prevent people like you from killing themselves. Only a fool or someone knowledgeable would charge from the high side anyway. It can be done with adapters but the ports are different sizes for a reason.
There are lots of good reasons to stay with CFC-12, not the least of which is better performance and the car's system was designed for it. Can't get it anymore? There's more R12 out there than you could shake a stick at. It's a bit spendy but that's just another reason you should be doing things right.
I may have been a bit hasty. Are you converting to 134 or simply recharging using the small cans?
There are lots of good reasons to stay with CFC-12, not the least of which is better performance and the car's system was designed for it. Can't get it anymore? There's more R12 out there than you could shake a stick at. It's a bit spendy but that's just another reason you should be doing things right.
I may have been a bit hasty. Are you converting to 134 or simply recharging using the small cans?
johnathan1 said:
Why did it die in the first place? Did the compressor fail or is it just low on CFC-12? You could convert to 134 but I'm not a big fan of conversions. Some cars convert well, others don't. Not sure about the Supra but a 134 conversion will stress any 12 system to some extent.
hmm, im hoping it just doesn't have any refrigerant in it, because when i push the AC button, nothing happens... I was told by some people on here that it means that it's dry...
If the refrigerant charge gets too low the low pressure switch will cut off the compressor so yeah, it's probably empty. This is done because the oil circulates with the refrigerant. No refrigerant, no oil circulation. No oil circulation, boom goes the compressor. That sends compressor trash into the system requiring it be opened up and flushed.
It's a big expensive job including the cost of a new compressor and, sometimes, a new condenser, evap, and expansion valve. At minimum you'll need to replace the receiver/dryer, add some oil, pull a deep vacuum, check for leaks, then charged and test. If you're lucky all will be OK.
MVAC is a specialized field that requires specialized knowledge and tools. Since I'm a "do it right" kinda guy and fairly experienced AC tech I'll tell you what you *should* do: Bring it to a shop and pay. If you want to do it on your own you'll need at minimum R12, a vacuum pump, and oil. Better would be a scale (or charging cylinder) and a manifold set but you can live without them. If the system has refrigerant in it you'll also need a recovery system unless you're planning on busting several dozen federal laws.
See the TSRM for details specific to the Supra, which uses a TXV type system. It's a pretty generic system, nothing special about it. Don't skimp though or it'll come back to bite you. In the MVAC biz they have a saying: "Do it right and you'll do it once"
For $20 you can take an open book test on the internet and become 609 certified. Then you can buy all the R12 you want. It sure as hell won't make you an AC tech as that'll take a lot more study. I'm both 609 and 608 Universal certified. Although that requires testing at a designated facility it allows me to do more than MVAC.
It's a big expensive job including the cost of a new compressor and, sometimes, a new condenser, evap, and expansion valve. At minimum you'll need to replace the receiver/dryer, add some oil, pull a deep vacuum, check for leaks, then charged and test. If you're lucky all will be OK.
MVAC is a specialized field that requires specialized knowledge and tools. Since I'm a "do it right" kinda guy and fairly experienced AC tech I'll tell you what you *should* do: Bring it to a shop and pay. If you want to do it on your own you'll need at minimum R12, a vacuum pump, and oil. Better would be a scale (or charging cylinder) and a manifold set but you can live without them. If the system has refrigerant in it you'll also need a recovery system unless you're planning on busting several dozen federal laws.
See the TSRM for details specific to the Supra, which uses a TXV type system. It's a pretty generic system, nothing special about it. Don't skimp though or it'll come back to bite you. In the MVAC biz they have a saying: "Do it right and you'll do it once"
For $20 you can take an open book test on the internet and become 609 certified. Then you can buy all the R12 you want. It sure as hell won't make you an AC tech as that'll take a lot more study. I'm both 609 and 608 Universal certified. Although that requires testing at a designated facility it allows me to do more than MVAC.
Mine was completely dry, you can tell by looking through the little looking glass, and if you dont see any foam (foam tells its low) or any thing at all its prob empty. Jetjock, the adapter does fit on the high side too, because my dad was helping me and he started to screw it on to the high side, luckly I noticed and stoped him. loljohnathan1 said:
Man that's bad. Lucky you stopped him. The kits must be getting worse these days. An R-12 mainfold set normally won't fit the high side of a Supra without an adapter.
If you were just doing a recharge and not using a kit to convert I jumped on you too soon. Never use a cheap kit to convert. Use one that has all the parts, including new oil. That said, if the system was truly empty you can't just add refrigerant to it. You should've changed the receiver/dryer and added some oil. If the can had sealant in it all the worse. Never put anything but oil, refrigerant, and maybe tracer dye into your AC system.
Topping off with small cans is never a great idea because you don't know how much refrigerant is in the system. The right way is to remove it and then recharged by weight. I'm guessing it still had some gas in there because if the system was truly empty it wouldn't be working. I'm also guessing you've converted to 134. Otherwise you'd need a license to buy R12 and anyone who has one usually won't take the path you did. I'm afraid you took the easy way out and it might cost you in the future. Then again you wouldn't be the first guy to cheat and get away with it.
The site glass can be misleading. It should be clear when running and foam for a few seconds just after the AC is shut off. If it remains clear you've over charged (clear could also mean the system is empty). If your system is charged right you should get about a ten degree drop across the evaporator. Turn the system on at a fast idle, let it stabilize with windows open, fan speed on medium, thermometer in the vent closet to the evap. You should see around 45 degrees on a 80-90 degree day. Anything less is frosting on the cake, anything more means your system still has a problem. If higher but still cool try adding a few onces at a times until it comes down.
If you were just doing a recharge and not using a kit to convert I jumped on you too soon. Never use a cheap kit to convert. Use one that has all the parts, including new oil. That said, if the system was truly empty you can't just add refrigerant to it. You should've changed the receiver/dryer and added some oil. If the can had sealant in it all the worse. Never put anything but oil, refrigerant, and maybe tracer dye into your AC system.
Topping off with small cans is never a great idea because you don't know how much refrigerant is in the system. The right way is to remove it and then recharged by weight. I'm guessing it still had some gas in there because if the system was truly empty it wouldn't be working. I'm also guessing you've converted to 134. Otherwise you'd need a license to buy R12 and anyone who has one usually won't take the path you did. I'm afraid you took the easy way out and it might cost you in the future. Then again you wouldn't be the first guy to cheat and get away with it.
The site glass can be misleading. It should be clear when running and foam for a few seconds just after the AC is shut off. If it remains clear you've over charged (clear could also mean the system is empty). If your system is charged right you should get about a ten degree drop across the evaporator. Turn the system on at a fast idle, let it stabilize with windows open, fan speed on medium, thermometer in the vent closet to the evap. You should see around 45 degrees on a 80-90 degree day. Anything less is frosting on the cake, anything more means your system still has a problem. If higher but still cool try adding a few onces at a times until it comes down.
my last Supra (NA) had a full R-134a conversion done by the previous owner (done by a shop) and it would blow SOO cold, it would get like freezing in there in just a few mins... So you can see how i'm not accustomed to having a non-op AC system...lol
Some cars respond better to conversion than others. The Supra is probably OK because it's an older robust system with a decent charge unlike today's cars which were designed for 134 and have dinky charges. I stick with 12 because I have 30 pounds of it lying around and some of my other cars also use it. If you do convert use only 134. Don't even get me started on alternates like Freeze 12 and the like.
Here's a tip for 134 guys. The price has gone way up in the last year or so. Rather than buy as labeled buy computer duster cans or the refills used for hand held air horns. Look on the can. Almost all of them are tetrafluoroethane which is R-134a. Lots cheaper than the "real" thing. Use a $2 can side tap and be happy. Lol, AC techs would kill me for suggesting this but it works great.
Leave it to the EPA to pass all kinds of laws restricting the discharge of HFCs into the atmosphere by MVAC techs while at the same time ignoring the millions of cans used for this purpose. It's your Gum'mint at work.
Here's a tip for 134 guys. The price has gone way up in the last year or so. Rather than buy as labeled buy computer duster cans or the refills used for hand held air horns. Look on the can. Almost all of them are tetrafluoroethane which is R-134a. Lots cheaper than the "real" thing. Use a $2 can side tap and be happy. Lol, AC techs would kill me for suggesting this but it works great.
Leave it to the EPA to pass all kinds of laws restricting the discharge of HFCs into the atmosphere by MVAC techs while at the same time ignoring the millions of cans used for this purpose. It's your Gum'mint at work.
It's coming up on our Winter but even so I made an effort to chase the bugs out of my aircon as it's the best window demister known to man
Thats true. Lol, you don't even need these refrigerants. Propane works excellent as one. Not safe, but it works great