98mkiv AKA(XSPOWER Turbos) - SCAM!!!! WILL NOT HONOR WARRANTY!!!! BEWARE!!!!

[iHartSupra]

I gav him my info 2 months into the warranty to supply warranty information, which he asked for. I waited and assumed he forgot....HE DID!!! Why is that my fault?

Because you didnt follow up. A few PM's really doesnt show a whole lot of effort on your part to get ahold of him.

If you need something it's your responsibility to get ahold of the vendor, not the other way around.

 

[SuperRunner]

Because you didnt follow up. A few PM's really doesnt show a whole lot of effort on your part to get ahold of him.

If you need something it's your responsibility to get ahold of the vendor, not the other way around.

And I did.

If a company has on record that you had communicated a failed or failing product, they will honor the date of first contact. That is business ethics. Find me a reputable company that wouldn't do this.

How about this, I will post a page that has our entire communication process. YOu will be able to see HOW HARD I have been trying to PROVE to him that the turbo was bad. The warranty didn't even come up until he ran out of way to try to prove it was MY FAULT!

 

[SuperRunner]

hey super runner are you the owner of supracharged? if so then you seem to know quite a bit and im not bashing your knowledge on any mechanical terms...just what i have heard from xspower is that it is hit and miss with there turbos. good luck with whatever happens.

Yes, I do own http://supracharged.com and run a swap forum overthere. Unfortunatly I am soo busy with projects I don't spend much time updating the site.

 

[Brewster]

Stop buying cheap shit?

 

[Jervis Mcstabby]

How about this, I will post a page that has our entire communication process.

Then do it. You've said you're going to for three pages already.

So DO IT.

 

[Clueless]

it is well known on cb7tuner that XSturbo's compressor housing will split in half....damn good enough reason to stay away from them.

 

[MDCmotorsports]

Something else I noticed. For balancing the compressor wheel. I would have figured it would have been machined. NOT EVEN! Looks like they took a grinding wheel to it. I will have to take a picture of that. I mean seriously, a grinder?

99% of all turbo & balancing shops use a grinding method to balance the wheels. Why? They are all balanced on a Heins style balancing machine. You can only accomplish this by using an abrasive disk and air power.

The other 1%?

Automotive certified rebuilders who use a VSR balancing system and use CNC or semi-automated milling machine.

This runs HUNDREDS OF DOLLARS AN HOUR AND IS NOT COST EFFECTIVE TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC.

You sir, may not be the idiot your posts make you out to be, but when you go blasting all over the internet about a problem that was created by you - YOU LOOK LIKE A 14 YEAR OLD TWAT WAFFLE.

Now that being said - Your turbo has suffered severe catastrophic rear piston ring seal / bore failure. This is caused by several things.

1.) Piston ring not fitted correctly to the piston ring bore. (Gap too large)
2.) Piston ring not aligned correctly to the piston ring bore. (Gap not 180 deg away from oil drain)
3.) Oil pressure too high. Any thing above 50psi @ WOT (4000rpms +) will cause the turbo to leak, typically out of both seal sides (compressor & turbine)
4.) Oil return line restricted, too small, or running up hill. Again, oil has no where to go and typically chooses the exhaust side to leak out of.

ONCE THIS HAPPENS TAKE NOTE: The leaking oil instantly turns into hard carbon. The carbon scores the seal bore, then takes out the seal. The seal then scores the seal ring lands on the turbine wheel & shaft. The same hard carbon also attaches itself to the turbine wheel and makes the turbine wheel end of the rotating assembly out of balance making it leak oil. Thus leaking oil, the balance problem only gets worse.

Now, I shouldn't have to explain any of this to you since the warranty is up. You should have presented the case against the dealer BEFORE THE 6 MONTH MARK.

Hopefully you have learned not to wait until a warranty expires.

 

[SuperRunner]

Thanks MDC for the explaination, and yes, I did already know pretty much the basics. I tried to explain that to 98mkiv, but he refused to listen.

He persisted to tell me there was no oil seal, and that the stamped rear cover between the turbine wheel and the center section is what held the oil back, not the seal.

I tried 2 months into the warranty to get the turbo replaced. He failed to commnuicate back, and that is my fault how? The turbo was found to be bad DURING the warranty. As far as companies go, that is usualy enough. They have a documented case of the failure, and if it took until after the warranty to finally verify that the ORIGINAL problem was in fact failed product, it does not matter.

I contaced Mark DURING the warranty about the failure!!!!!

 

[flight doc89]

^relevant?

You should have sent it back to them if you knew it was bad. You especially should not have "Nobody has pushed this turbo as hard as I" if you knew it was bad.

 

[SuperRunner]

You should have sent it back to them if you knew it was bad. You especially should not have "Nobody has pushed this turbo as hard as I" if you knew it was bad.

How many times to I have to tell people this.

I tried to 2 months into warranty. C'mon people, read the whole thing before you post. If you don't want to read, DON'T POST.

Here I go again:

I gave Mark ALL the information that was needed to show that the turbo was bad. My return line size, the fact that there was no obstruction, that it was leaking out the turbine housing, and all my contact information. What more does he need. Turbo IS BAD, end of story, and this all happend 2 months into warranty, and 2 weeks after I put the turbo on the car.


PLEASE PLEASE, read before you post. I TRIED TO RETURN IT OVER 4 MONTHS AGO!!

 

[ForcedTorque]

I have just finished reading this whole thread. NOWHERE in it does it say you tried to contact him again after 2 months. You did say that you assumed he had forgot. If I was gonna be butthurt about loosing the money, I wouldn't sit by idle while the warranty period went by. I respect the fact that you didn't bug the shit out of him every day until you had an answer like a 16-17 year old kid. But when you asked where are you at fault, 4 months is your answer. At the 5 or 5 1/2 month mark, I would have been reminding him. And this is not to mention that you have had a known bad turbo on your car for 4 to 6 months. Losing oil is never good for a motor!

Maybe I'm wrong. You have mentioned posting your whole list of conversations. I don't know that it would clear anything up, but who knows. Without it, I feel like there may be something you are not telling us.

 

[SuperRunner]

Well, it wasn't posted in the first posts. By post 16 I had specifictly stated that I had tried to.

I will post the entire conversation later. I have nothing to hide, I just have to spend time to format it so it is easy to read.

The car was down for over 3 months. I figured I would hit him up when I really needed it taken care of. I don't like to bug people. Same goes for people who owe me money. Even after the time has passed they were supposed to pay me back, and they haven't paid me. I will wait. Maybe I am just too nice.

Guess being nice to people doesn't pay off. It will end up biting you in the end. Guess that is why I still have thousands of dollars still loaned out to people. My wife gets mad at me about that. Oh well.

 

[Doward]

There is no seal back there. It's a small piston ring that keeps the oil from escaping, not a seal.

That said, you should have ridden the guy's ass about the turbo. You say something 2 months into the warranty, and then nothing since? Then, 4-5 months later, you get ahold of him again?

 

[iwannadie]

And I did.

If a company has on record that you had communicated a failed or failing product, they will honor the date of first contact. That is business ethics. Find me a reputable company that wouldn't do this.

How about this, I will post a page that has our entire communication process. YOu will be able to see HOW HARD I have been trying to PROVE to him that the turbo was bad. The warranty didn't even come up until he ran out of way to try to prove it was MY FAULT!

First contact over a warranty issue should be the date the vendor/manufacture goes by. If they got the info then just stalls and forgets for a few months then suddenly says, out of warranty. Well, I think thats pretty low and the OP has a legit reason to be mad with the vendor.

If I send a part in under warranty and it gets lost in the mail how is that anyone fault to deny my warranty. The first pm/email claim over a warranty problem should be the date, which was within the 6 month period. After that first email the vendor then can decide to try and trouble shoot the problem or just replace. You cant hold that time perior against the buyer.

If the vendor is so worried about proper install, have that in your warranty terms? Alot of warranties Ive seen require proof of install(receipt from a shop), tuff luck to DIY'ers but thats Their terms.

Ill never buy anything from this vendor, anyone who stalls to avoid a warranty is just low.

 

[ForcedTorque]

This is a valid point. Suprarunner kinda got this into a shootout from the get go, and I got a little caught up in that to pay attention to the problem with the vendor. He asked where he could be at fault, so I tried to set a tone with my answer, but explain how I saw he "could" be. Now how could the vendor or manufacturer be wrong is a whole nother story. The stall, then transfer "blame on time" is very telling, and should show us all what we don't want to do in the future. I read Jon's (MDC) description of what went wrong, but I couldn't tell if he was blaming you, or the manufacturer for the problem. I do have the utmost respect for Jon though, he is very knowledgeable, and one hell of a guy.

 

[SuperRunner]

There is no seal back there. It's a small piston ring that keeps the oil from escaping, not a seal.

That said, you should have ridden the guy's ass about the turbo. You say something 2 months into the warranty, and then nothing since? Then, 4-5 months later, you get ahold of him again?

You might want to go check your definition of a seal, and go ahead and tell me it isn't a seal after that.

Yes, you are right, I should have. My mistake. I figured it wouldn't matter since we already both new it was bad. I didn't want to be a nagging customer. Same reason I decided not to warranty the wastgate. Even though it was broke, I could fix it. Not really my responsablity to fix a broken part, but I didn't want to bug him about it. I WAS TRYING TO BE NICE!!!

Same reason in a post I made in November on how well the turbo was performing. Even though it was leaking oil all over, I kept that out of the public because I was trying to HELP Mark.

 

[SuperRunner]

Iwannadie

Thank you for actually taking the time to understand the situation. So many people hop on the band wagon to protect the vendor againts some NOBODY, who may or may not actually know what they are doing, without fully understanding the entire scenario.

Mark has done great things, and will continue to do so. I just hope he takes this a learning experience on how to deal with failures. He told me over the phone before I had ever purchased a turbo(s), that he has NEVER had to deal with a failure. I suppose mine was the first, and he didn't know how to deal with it when there was an acutaul defect in the turbo.

 

[drunk_medic]

When it comes to customer service, being courteous is a must - being nice is a plus.
When it comes to being a customer, neither is a must - being courteous is a plus. Being nice can get you screwed.
I hope YOU take this as a learning experience on how to deal with your OWN failures. If you want sympathy over your sob story, you are coming to the wrong place. If you knew the part was defective from early on, you needed to bring it to someone's attention fast, and follow up on it once a week, minimum. Were you this concerned about the problem you should also have written down the time/date of each call or attempt. It is great that you were trying to be nice and not nag him every day, but is once a week unreasonable? Do you see where being nice crossed over into you having no common sense, or business sense? Being nice has also earned you a nice paperweight, to complement how very nice you have been.

To me, this thread seems less about trying to help other people and more about you waving the martyr flag. You had a set of reasonable conditions set before you and you did not honor them because you claim that you are too nice. Why should they honor the conditions if you did not do the same? Perhaps they should "be nice" and give you a new turbocharger or a rebuild?

Finally, I'm not justifying anything that may have happened on the seller's end, but if you had talked to someone that had the intentions of buying and then pushing the hell out of a delicate piece of equipment [for what it is, and is used for, a turbocharger is pretty delicate] "to find it's limits", what would you think when they came to you crying about failures and warranty information? It's great that nobody has pushed these turbochargers as hard as you have. What a nice guy.

If you were truly done wrong, contact the Better Business Bureau. Personally, I think that if you tell them the same story which you have slung here, it will be concluded that you do not have a leg to stand on. You know this to be true, you know that you did wrong and this is why you won't contact them and are bitching here, hoping for some sort of retribution.

Good day, sir.

 

[SuperRunner]

Actually I am sure the BBB would side with me, due to the documentation about the failed part during warranty. If I want to take it that far, I will.

Kind of funny though, even through all this, you will still find me posting postive information about the Turbo itself, even though it still is chinese low quiality part, and will reference as that. I still say positive stuff about what Mark has done for the community. I have nothing but negative stuff to say about the way he handled this warranty issue.

30psi, here I come!!!

 

[Doward]

Well said, drunk_medic!

btw -

seal - fastener that provides a tight and perfect closure

The ring does not provide a perfect closure. It can be described as a 'sealing ring' but not a seal.