Alright so I know most toyota purists would hate the idea of a nissan engine in a supra but I would like to build something different. A 350z engine is allot lighter and shorter so there would be more room under the hood plus with such a lighter engine placed as far back as possable the weight distribution would be much better than with the typical 2jz swap plus the added displacement and greater availability of parts. Sure the 2jz can take more power with the stock internals but I'm not looking to make insane amounts of power just 450 to 500 so I think it would be perfect for my build
QV35 swap?
- Thread starter mazdamx640
- Start date
VQ35 is a decently underpowered pile of aluminum. Not to mention a pain to work on....
With that said, a goal of ~400hp is going to get very pricey with that power plant. Ask yourself this: how much is it worth to me to have a never before done engine swap?
The handling gains from this swap IMO isn't worth the money for power.
Would be cool tho... Stillen (IIRC) has a nice TT kit for the VQ
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With that said, a goal of ~400hp is going to get very pricey with that power plant. Ask yourself this: how much is it worth to me to have a never before done engine swap?
The handling gains from this swap IMO isn't worth the money for power.
Would be cool tho... Stillen (IIRC) has a nice TT kit for the VQ
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I was thinking of a qv35 with a sts twin turbo setup that should achieve my goals as far as power goes
mazdamx640;1868782 said:
Now that I'm off my phone and can actually look things up.....
From Wikipedia (yea, I know..... but hey it's available) and other forums - 5 minutes worth of searching.
7M-GE - (your engine)
The Toyota 7M-GE introduced in the early months of 1986 is a 3.0-litre (2954 cc) 24-valve (4 valves per cylinder) DOHC/fuel-injected engine. The valves are spaced at a performance-oriented 50° angle. Cylinder bore is 83 mm (3.27 in) and stroke is 91 mm (3.58 in).
The 7M-GE was produced from 1986 through 1992. Output was 190-204 hp (142-152 kW) at 6000 rpm and 185–196 lb·ft (250-265 Nm) at 4800 rpm.
Specifications:
Displacement: 2954 cc (180.2 cu in)
Bore: 83.00 mm (3.27 in)
Stroke: 91.00 mm (3.58 in)
Compression Ratio: 9.1:1
Weight: 199 kg (440 lb)
7M-GTE - The option for your car at the time it was produced
The turbocharged 7M-GTE was produced from 1986 to 1992. Output was 173 kW (232 hp) at 5600 rpm and 325 N·m (240 ft·lb) at 4000 rpm for most 5 psi (0.34 bar) versions. It was Toyota's top performance engine until it was replaced by the 1JZ-GTE.
A special 7M-GTEU version, with a modified CT26 high-flow turbocharger and large volume intercooler, pushed output to 267 hp (199 kW) at 5600 rpm and 358 N·m (264 ft·lb) at 4400 rpm. This was used only in the racing homologation Toyota Supra Turbo A road and race cars. The Turbo A models also measured air based on manifold pressure rather than using an air flow meter, had a larger intercooler, larger throttle body, optimized CT-26 turbo, and various other differences. It was the fastest Japanese car at the time. The homologation was for the Group A series. The Group A Supra with a 7M-GTE and CT26 turbo produced 433 kW (580 bhp).
Specifications:
Displacement: 2,954 cc (180.3 cu in)
Bore: 83.0 mm (3.27 in)
Stroke: 91.0 mm (3.58 in)
Compression Ratio: 8.4:1
Weight: 210 kg (463 lb)
1JZ-GTE
What you were planning to do here:http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?130958-Planning-1JZ-swap-need-info&p=1624890#post1624890
217kg (478 lb)
~290hp
2JZ-GTE
what you were planning to do here: http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?133109-Want-to-do-2jz-swap-need-info&p=1639490#post1639490
~320hp
~450 lb from what I'm gathering online
VQ35DE
The 3.5 L (3498 cc) VQ35DE is used in many modern Nissan vehicles. Bore and stroke are 95.5 mm and 81.4 mm. It uses a similar block design to the VQ30DE, but adds variable valve timing. It produces from 231 PS (170 kW; 228 hp) to 304 PS (224 kW; 300 hp) of power and 246 to 274 lb·ft (334 to 371 N·m) of torque depending on the application.
~313lbs
While I'm sure moving the weight backwards in the car will improve the cars handling, this is not an easy task to complete. Keep in mind, while parts are available, the Nissan stuff (from my dealings wrenching on them) are just as salty if not more than Toyota. The wiring would be a nightmare, plus mating the trans, plus the driveshaft, cooling system, exhaust, trying to fit a turbo in there with the V6...... The obstacles are many, and high. The cost to overcome these obstacles are going to add up quickly. If you're serious, save up, research, save up some more, and then research even more prior to buying anything....
And to add to this whole thing, and clarify my prior post; the handling gains seen from this swap, would be more than able to be reproduced by simply investing the swap money into proper suspension. Get all the "normal" track suspension, coilovers, sways, bushings, etc... then have it profesionally aligned and balanced by a race shop. Viola! A supra that handles like a dream.
Just my opinion on this whole topic. I have drove TT 350Z's before. They are quite fun and peppy, but it still feels like an overpriced tin can to me.
Oh - If anyone has info that proves my above gathered info wrong; post it. I don't want to feed mis-information to anyone. I just hit Google for 5 minutes.
Ya it's vq35 not qv35.
That's is going to cost quite a lot to put a vq35 tt into a mk3. You'd have to use the Nissan trans as well. Make all the mounts and get a custom drive shaft. Tt kit and custom route everything. Wiring. And with non factory tt's you will need tuning.
Simple 2jz swap with bolts on and a slight tune will net the same power. Tho is a tad heavier. But with a lighter motor the nose is going to lift up so suspension change would be in order.
That's is going to cost quite a lot to put a vq35 tt into a mk3. You'd have to use the Nissan trans as well. Make all the mounts and get a custom drive shaft. Tt kit and custom route everything. Wiring. And with non factory tt's you will need tuning.
Simple 2jz swap with bolts on and a slight tune will net the same power. Tho is a tad heavier. But with a lighter motor the nose is going to lift up so suspension change would be in order.
Would be an interesting swap but lots of custom work. Wiring sucks.
Want something different? Try the 4.2l trailblazer swap. My mother's trailblazer really moves for being 4600 lbs. And I even hear the R154 bolts up to the engine too... 275 horse and torque bone stock naturally aspirated sounds kinda nice
http://forums.trailvoy.com/showthread.php?t=51636 <-I'll even do the research for ya
Want something different? Try the 4.2l trailblazer swap. My mother's trailblazer really moves for being 4600 lbs. And I even hear the R154 bolts up to the engine too... 275 horse and torque bone stock naturally aspirated sounds kinda nice
http://forums.trailvoy.com/showthread.php?t=51636 <-I'll even do the research for ya
Too expensive for not enough gain.
It's been hashed over many times, and if you want a motor lighter than a M or JZ, then a 1UZ is the best bet. It's not a powerhouse stock, but if you plan to turbo anyway it can make whatever power you want it to. It's also a fairly easy swap.
If you were going to swap an alloy V6 in there, why not a 1GR-FE 4.0L or a 2GR-FSE direct injected 3.5L? TRD makes a supercharger kit for the 1GR, and I'm sure someone makes a turbo kit for the 2GR-FSE since it's in the IS350. They both cost about the same as a VQ35HR ($3,000 used). All of them would need a bellhousing or bellhousing adapter to fit too.
It's been hashed over many times, and if you want a motor lighter than a M or JZ, then a 1UZ is the best bet. It's not a powerhouse stock, but if you plan to turbo anyway it can make whatever power you want it to. It's also a fairly easy swap.
If you were going to swap an alloy V6 in there, why not a 1GR-FE 4.0L or a 2GR-FSE direct injected 3.5L? TRD makes a supercharger kit for the 1GR, and I'm sure someone makes a turbo kit for the 2GR-FSE since it's in the IS350. They both cost about the same as a VQ35HR ($3,000 used). All of them would need a bellhousing or bellhousing adapter to fit too.
destrux;1868858 said:
I really don't get this. The 1uz is by far the worst choice of all the V8s out there. It doesn't bolt up to any manual trans and you still need to build mounts and fab up an exhaust. Basically the same steps for any V8 around. The expense to turbocharge any V8 is high. People spout off all the time how cheap it can be but it usually doesn't turn out that way. You can get 1uz's cheap because nobody wants them. I can appreciate what some people have done with this motor but all of them have dedicated a lot of time and money to get power out of the 1uz.
I have put a 1uz in a supra and I was far from impressed with its capabilities out of the box. There are far better options out there.
MightyAl;1868912 said:
I have a buddy that makes everything to make it bolt on drop in. Motors all day at the junkyard too.
hvyman;1868958 said:
I am aware. All those bolt ons add up when purchased from a thrid party. Motor might be $400 from a junkyard but you are going to spend another $3k to drop it in and have 250fwhp at best. There is no aftermarket for the 1uz and parts are outrageous so getting anymore power out of it is going to cost you at least another $3k-$5k depending on what path you take. Check out ScottURnot on club lexus. He has done a beautiful job on his SC400 but I wouldn't want to add up the receipts on that build.
You can get it running for far less than 3k.
Personally I'd go ls if I didn't want to do a jz swap.
Personally I'd go ls if I didn't want to do a jz swap.
MightyAl;1868912 said:
The 1UZ non-vvti is definitely lacking power. A vvti model with rods from an older non-vvti (they're much stronger) and a turbo system with a good tune though would do just fine. The torque curve would be flat from idle to redline. There are a few people out there who have made good power with turbo UZ motors. Not many though, since lightweight isn't a priority with most supra owners and it's so damn easy to make big power with a 2JZ. Most of the budget turbo UZ guys make shit for power though because they try to use the stock ECU with a piggyback... and that never works well with a turbo, especially on a high compression engine like the 1UZ. I know one guy using a megasquirt on a vvti 1UZ, but it's a 13:1 N/A build, and he was making 420whp last time I read his site (which is a joke considering what he has into it, an LS3 crate motor would have been $7K cheaper)... but the fact that the MSII ECU worked and could do the vvti is promising.
The 1UZ is a bolt in swap, mounts are about $200 and a bellhousing is $500. The rest is all OEM parts (including the 3SGTE flywheel and clutch). The wiring needs very little change to plug in, just swap the body connectors (the same as wiring a soarer 1JZ into an MA70). I don't see how any other V8 is going to be that simple. An LS is nice, but the cheapest LS would cost twice as much (for a 5.7L LS1) and only make 75 more HP. If cost is no option an LS7 would be awesome... or a 426 Hemi (new hemi) crate motor.... but nobody with that kind of cash was ever considering a 1UZ anyway.
All said and done I plan on having less then $5k in my L33 swap and it isn't a stock dump it in and go either. I like that there are so many options once I get it up and running.
As far as I am concerned making motor mounts, buying a thrid party bellhousing, and having to redrill a flywheel is not a bolt in affair. Installing a 1uz is the same process as installing any other V8. I am going through exactly the same steps with the LS engine and I wouldn't call it a bolt in job.
As far as I am concerned making motor mounts, buying a thrid party bellhousing, and having to redrill a flywheel is not a bolt in affair. Installing a 1uz is the same process as installing any other V8. I am going through exactly the same steps with the LS engine and I wouldn't call it a bolt in job.
I mean, you do what you want with your car. I don't care. I didn't mean to offend you by excluding GM engines in my list of suggestions. I just don't tend to think of domestic cars when I think of sourcing swaps for imports. Nothing wrong with the newer GM engines (don't get me started on their old stuff though).
destrux;1869205 said:
No offense at all and at most we seem to be arguing the same side of the point. I appreciate anything that was put together with a little blood sweat and tears.
Smartest thing I've seen you say in this thread... There is a reason they're put in pretty much everything with wheels to turn.mazdamx640;1868934 said:
Heh, I doubt you'd have anyone taking the other side of the bet...mattsplat72;1868939 said:
One thing with the VQ, how wide is it? I remember working on a friend's Z33, that thing was a headache and a half it was crammed in there so tight... Mk3 engine bays aren't exactly the widest out there either.
I literally just finished helping my friend build his 350z, complete with a full engine rebuild, wiescos, pauters, 272 cams the works. We built a custom midmount turbo kit with a precision billet 7175. I'll tell you what as far as possibly sitting in his car I will never in my life touch one of those cars again. They are bastards and also if you look at any vid on youtube and compare the sound of a vq to a 2jz its a simple choice to stay 2j imo.
Good luck getting 400hp to last for any distance the stock rods might as well be pencils...
In the long run you can probably make more power for cheaper with a ls1 and it will last longer/be a more driveable car.
One good thing about the vq is the 6 speeds out of the z can hold about 1000hp pretty reliably, just be sure to get the second version.
Good luck getting 400hp to last for any distance the stock rods might as well be pencils...
In the long run you can probably make more power for cheaper with a ls1 and it will last longer/be a more driveable car.
One good thing about the vq is the 6 speeds out of the z can hold about 1000hp pretty reliably, just be sure to get the second version.
Even though the VQ is no doubt lighter than the 7M or 1JZ, does the OP have any idea how much a TT setup, 3 row intercooler, and piping will end up weighing? Seems to me that taking a motor that isn't meant to be in the A70 chassis then adding a serious amount of weight defeats the entire purpose.