starscream5000 said:On a properly assembled and running STOCK 7m-gte it SHOULD handle about 500 HP.
yup, but I wouldn't keep it at that level daily.
power on stock internals?
- Thread starter 1_slo_92
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yup, but I wouldn't keep it at that level daily.
On a newer rebuilt engine with stock internals, I don't see any problem with 500hp everyday. The problem is with people pushing old, abused engines too hard. Then they try running 20psi on 91 octane with 13.0 AFR. I run 18psi everyday, which puts right around 410rwhp. If I had more money, I would be running race gas all the time and have it cranked up to 22psi which puts me at about 465rwhp. But I do turn it up to 24psi at the track which puts me at about 480rwhp. All on my 35k mile stock bottom end.
ViR2 said:i wouldnt push stocker above 350rwhp. I just dont see her beeing reliable after that level
Though you may not, but MANY people do, like Shaeff the gentlemen above me.
Shit, many people are over 350 on stock head gasket. I plan to be over 350 on the stock bottom end with a 60-1 ct26.
Take Malloy for example, he HAD over 600 HP on stock rods... until today, but I still think it would have lasted a lot longer if his MBC didn't fuck up on him and caused it to overboost a few times past 30 psi....
if you're gonna keep the stock internals and bracket race just run a dead consistent 12.0 at around 400-425whp but i have to add there are much better cars for braket racing, and car with a solid rear axel should launch more consistently and keep the times even
s388mmber1 maybe you have very decent shape engine, otherwise it's just a matter of time when will it go out
89supturbo said:
Not my choice really, he loves my car and wanted to build a decent one for himself. Also my last bracket car was a little automatic tercel, talking about consistant. Easiest car to win in a bracket system.
nein, stock has proven itself. Im running for 400 rw as well. Weird as it is, me and William are doing the same basic setups with the same cars (well mine is an 87 turbo burgundy/burgundy and his is a NA) but same premises. Crazae.ViR2 said:s388mmber1 maybe you have very decent shape engine, otherwise it's just a matter of time when will it go out
IMHO if you're making 600+whp, an MBC shouldn't really be a part of the equation...starscream5000 said:
It worked for Malloy . He did some pretty amazing shit with his car. He had an EBC, but prefered the MBC, his choice.
. He did some pretty amazing shit with his car. He had an EBC, but prefered the MBC, his choice.
CryoSlash, OK i take my words back, but i'm still stating that safe mark is 350rwhp, over that there is no warranty for engine to stay reliable. We all know what has happened to Malloy, and its always better to stay on the safe mark just in case.
I'm doing my winter project and i'm planing to push somewhere near 400 rwhp by this spring so i'll test stocker's reliability on my engine before swaping some wiseco's and other forged internals
I'm doing my winter project and i'm planing to push somewhere near 400 rwhp by this spring so i'll test stocker's reliability on my engine before swaping some wiseco's and other forged internals
Power on stock internals? Until it blows up...Mike just illustrated that. Will some guys make and maintain that kind of power on the stock rods? Sure they will...maybe you got your hands on the rods that were a little stronger than the rest. That brings me to my point. If you are building a high HP motor, you over build it...if your goal is 500 HP, build it to handle 750. That way you know it's going to last and you've left some fudge factor for when that over boost happens.
One other thing...the guys that are talking about the tune are absolutely correct, but it gets even more basic than that. Attention to detail....keep any vibration to a minimum...check and re-check torque spec...truly balance the motor.
Did you:
- Weight every rod and adjust to make them identical
- Weight every piston/pin and adjust to make them identical
- Resize the rod ends
- Gap your rings
- Turn and balance the crank...re-nitrate any journal that had material removed
- Triple check all the machine work
- Make your bearing clearances as close to the same as possible across the mains and rods
- Use a known good harmonic damper
- Thoroughly lube every part that gets oil from the system
This is by all means not a complete list, but you can see my point. Any lapse of attention to the build when pushing a motor to the 500+ HP range and it's only a matter of time before it comes back to haunt you. We can talk about the strength of the rods, pistons, MHG, etc all day...that's where over building the motor comes in. But once you make the decision to hit the big numbers, be prepared to take the time and attention to detail to do it right.
One other thing...the guys that are talking about the tune are absolutely correct, but it gets even more basic than that. Attention to detail....keep any vibration to a minimum...check and re-check torque spec...truly balance the motor.
Did you:
- Weight every rod and adjust to make them identical
- Weight every piston/pin and adjust to make them identical
- Resize the rod ends
- Gap your rings
- Turn and balance the crank...re-nitrate any journal that had material removed
- Triple check all the machine work
- Make your bearing clearances as close to the same as possible across the mains and rods
- Use a known good harmonic damper
- Thoroughly lube every part that gets oil from the system
This is by all means not a complete list, but you can see my point. Any lapse of attention to the build when pushing a motor to the 500+ HP range and it's only a matter of time before it comes back to haunt you. We can talk about the strength of the rods, pistons, MHG, etc all day...that's where over building the motor comes in. But once you make the decision to hit the big numbers, be prepared to take the time and attention to detail to do it right.
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jdub- those are the types of posts that deserve reputation. nicely said. i wasn't implying that everyone should try to get every bit out of the stock bottom end. i was just saying that it's tough enough to take some abuse if you do it correctly.
besides- for bracket racing, you don't need a fast car. you need a consistent car. so that pretty much puts off this entire thread for me.
-shaeff
nicely said. i wasn't implying that everyone should try to get every bit out of the stock bottom end. i was just saying that it's tough enough to take some abuse if you do it correctly. besides- for bracket racing, you don't need a fast car. you need a consistent car.
so that pretty much puts off this entire thread for me. -shaeff
Well said . Don't risk pushing the envelope on the stock rods, etc. Think of those new rods (insert brand here) as cheap insurance as compared to another rebuild.
. Don't risk pushing the envelope on the stock rods, etc. Think of those new rods (insert brand here) as cheap insurance as compared to another rebuild.