Global Warming is over. (Really, it is. No joke.)

[Adjuster]

Anyone read "State of Fear" by Crighton?

Very interesting book. Full of footnotes and very well researched. Most, if not all of them when searched on the net come up with TONS of data and proven facts that show the world is being scamed with the whole "global warming" idea.

Seas are not rising.
Ice is not melting off.
Overall temps are not going up, if anything it's getting colder on average, a possible reversal of the warming trend we have been in for about 10,000 years.

I've known about the hydrocarbon deal for years.
"Fossil Fuels" is totally wrong. Hydrocarbons are not from dead animal and plant life roaming around a few hundred thousand years ago. (I know, we were all taught that in school, so it must be right eh?) Keep in mind, we all knew that the world was flat untill just a few hundred years ago...

Thomas J. Gold came up with a new theory about hydrocarbons and Earth, and it's been proven correct time and time again.

Oil fields are not running out, but are filling up from the bottem, deep in the earth.

Oil deposits are found in rock older than life on earth. (Pretty hard to get dead dino's and plants when there were NO plants or animals alive when the rock was formed where the oil is being found now.)

Clearly hydrocarbons are part of the compostion of the planet. They tend to collect around some geologic features, and from the pools, we can use them to refine other products used every day the world over. (Gas is just one of many things that crude oil provides.)

Hydrocarbons are everywhere in the solar system, and universe for that matter. (Explain to me the dead animals and plants on Neptune for example. A planet with a huge atmosphere of methane gas.)

Back on topic, hydrocarbon consumption is not causing global warming. We have plenty of hydrocarbons, but are being lead to believe they are scarce. We are being told that global warming will end all life, but in realitiy, the earth continues on, pretty much oblivious of what is going on caused by man.

Have fun and discuss.

 

[CTsupra]

i never believed in that global warming crap either. maybe i'll pick this book up!

 

[GrimJack]

Just as some more evidence that things change - my mother, who is a grandmother now - went to school long before anyone made it to the moon. At the time, children were LITERALLY taught that the moon was made of green cheese - she still has one of her textbooks, printed in the 40's, that says that.

What seemed perfectly reasonable 60 years ago is now viewed as completely insane. So, logically, some of the things that we think are perfectly reasonable will likely be proven totally wrong in the near future.

 

[Joel W.]

well i have to politely disagree on global warming issue. thermal sensitive satalite mapping provides evidence that global warming is happening however the cause could be a number of things.

It has happened in the past before cars were invented so it will happen again. glaciers are disapearing. oceans are rising and getting warmer to feed all these hurricanes that get there energy from warmer waters..

as soon as more ice melts and releases more fresh water into the ocean the global underwater "conveyer belt" or Gulf stream which regulates the planets temps like an ac unit. will come to a hault and then were all done. game over man. so party now cuz its gonna get worse... i hope your right though...

edited, here is an ocean temp graph over 50 yrs..

 

[SupraMario]

I read somewhere that 1 volcano puts off as much emissions as the total number of cars in the world have for the past like 40 years.
and the earth will addapt like it has for millions of years to what ever is thrown at it.

 

[Joel W.]

ive read that also... the last super volcano that eurupted something like 74k years ago supposably knocked the population down to about 1500 survivors.. We're all descendants from those 1500+- poeple..."they say" it was almost a global killer my brothas... read up on yellow stone nat park sometime.. omg.. scary...

ya the earth will recover, with or with out us.. hehe

 

[Afunk]

Hydrocarbons are formed naturally, and methane, being one of the most basic of the hydrocarbons forms quite easily under the right circumstances (anerobic)

Crude oil, on the other hand, is not simple hydrocarbons, it is composed of long chains of C and H that do not form very easily.

If you look at geological temperature maps, you can see quite distinctly that the overall temperature of the earth has been rising almost exponentially.

The have recently fixed the largest counterarguement against this theory spawned from inconsistencies between atmospherical ballons and satellite readings which makes it quite obvious for anyone of any interllectual capacity to see clearly that global warming IS happening and IS a real danger.

I am not a hippie, I just want to state the facts.

 

[Brewster]

Global Warming may be happening, but there is no proof that it stems from atmospheric pollution.

 

[Joel W.]

It could be from under water volcanos eurupting that we dont yet know about... or large quantities of methane carbanate deposits being released deep in the ocean that is reacting to the warmer water temps and violently releasing something called C12 gas?? maybe the fact we cut down rainforest that actually scrub Co2 from the atmosphere? all i know for sure is:::



i need a girlfriend.. im not a hippie either

 

[Adjuster]

Please read the book, and do some more reasearch.

The data provided from sources who are promoting the idea that global warming is happening, and they want your money to prevent it does not hold much weight with me.

This is why I think this book was so excellent. It is not that great of a story. However, the data and footnotes as sources is excellent. Most, if not all are unbiased, and the information is clear.

Sea levels are NOT rising around the world.
Total amounts of glacial ice is not decreasing, but is actually INCREASING.
Average temps when you take out the "urban" effect heated areas, shows the actual temps around the globe changing very little, and actually getting colder in places.
The effect of so called "greenhouse" gases is so far proven to show no change in net global temps. (CO2 especially.) Methane is a much more insulating gas, and water vapor is really where it's at, and more clouds and vapor seems to have a cooling effect according to the data.

I don't have the book infront of me, but one example outlined is the reality that just termites alone produce more methane gas than all the humans on the planet. (There is more bio-mass in termites than all the humans on the planet, and these termites produce more methane gas.) Keep in mind, this is just one of the many species of insect on the planet.

On that same subject, the claims of lost species appears to be bogus as well. (this is coming from scientists who are trying to figure out how many species there are, let alone how many are dying every year.)

Here's the best truth the book brings out. (I've heard this before, but it's very well done in the book.)
The Indians living here managed the forrests with fire, hunting and active removal of animals they did not want. (Killed them all off if they did not want them competing with animals they did want.) The so-called pristine forrests that Europeans arrived to a few hundred years ago were managed with fires and selective hunting by the current natives. (Indians are transplants here like the rest of us.)

Old growth forrests are another myth that is debunked in this book.

Hopefully in time, with better information, less hype and bald-faced lies from special intrests groups like Earth First, The Sierra Club and others, we can get back to where we manage the forrests, and other lands in our care.

The sad part is, this is about as likely as the residents of SF suddenly finding respect for the military.

Debate on the subject should help.

Keep it going, and I'll start to list some of the footnotes and links to the data as I get a chance.

 

[Brewster]

It could be from under water volcanos eurupting that we dont yet know about... or large quantities of methane carbanate deposits being released deep in the ocean that is reacting to the warmer water temps and violently releasing something called C12 gas?? maybe the fact we cut down rainforest that actually scrub Co2 from the atmosphere? all i know for sure is:::



i need a girlfriend.. im not a hippie either

The fact is that the Earth gets hotter and colder in cycles, and nobody knows why.

 

[Joel W.]

I agree with you on that brewster...but that book is a nice peice of fiction, like jurrassic park. but seriously. read these. we all should...

here some FACTS on ocean temps.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0325/p17s02-sten.html
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/04/0420_040420_earthday.html
http://www.grida.no/climate/vital/19.htm
http://www.grida.no/climate/vital/24.htm
http://yosemite.epa.gov/oar/globalwarming.nsf/content/ClimateFutureClimateSeaLevel.html

here are FACTS on the oceans conveyer belt.

http://www.enviroliteracy.org/article.php/545.html
http://www.grida.no/climate/vital/32.htm
http://seis.natsci.csulb.edu/rbehl/ConvBelt.htm
http://carto.eu.org/article2513.html

more FACTS on glacier melt..

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/2558319.stm
http://www.worldwatch.org/press/news/2000/03/06/
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0922-02.htm
http://www.livescience.com/environment/050421_glacial_retreat.html
http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/planetearth/ice_melt_010117.html

i have 1000's more web sites like this if your interested in reading more... post some good desputes to any of these links.. ill be happy to read em.....

 

[Brewster]

We're those links to dispute my previous comment?

 

[Joel W.]

no not at all, just againt the topic in general..

 

[Adjuster]

Interesting thing about this book.
1) I think he started out to write a book on the dangers of global warming, and radical climate shift.
2) During 3 years of research, found that MOST of the crap being spewed by the likes of the BBC and others is not facts, but just talking points provided by environmental groups funded from your donations. (They only exist with your donations, and you have to be concerned to want to donate, so what do you think their going to report to you?)

Only the real scientific journals count guys. National Geographic, I hate to say it, is not real science, but it's interesting reporting. And they like the other environmentalist groups want to ignore the obvious, and concentrate on slivers of data that might support the idea this theory is anything but complete BS. (Global warming that is.)

Please read the book. Research the sources listed. Read some of it. The simple fact is, the SCIENCE and data clearly shows MAN has NOTHING to do with climate change in the long term, and if there is any diference in our actions, it's so small of an effect as to be insignificant at best.

That's my point. Stop with the "we can make a difference" crap. WE can't make a difference, so get used to it, and we may learn to better manage what we can do in the short term for the betterment of everyone involved. (Us and the animals etc.)

 

[Joel W.]

ok, i will read the book. i like his books anyways.

i did read this artical.. it was a little helpful..

fact vs myth on global warming
http://www.environmentaldefense.org/documents/382_myths.htm

this was a fun topic. lets do it again sometime...
goodnight man..

 

[mcpcola]

ok well I am going to die one day in a blaze of gun fire screaming Fuckem all watch'm fall screaming "AUTOMATIC GUN FIRE". So i couldn't give a crap less the Important issue here is How many licks does it take to get to the center of a tootsie pop? WE MAY NEVER KNOW.

 

[GrimJack]

I think I'm with Brewster on this one.

There is absolutely some truth to what Adjuster points out. You cannot trust information from people who want money from you.

My real life example is greenpeace. These people are outright crooks! They like to make money off practices that they know NOTHING about. They like clear cutting timber - or at least they like to make a fuss about it, because it makes them money. They came up here after a big storm, found a 1000 year old tree that BLEW DOWN IN THE STORM, cut the top off of it, shipped this monster stump over to Europe, and trucked it all over the place complaining about how these stupid Canadians are clear cutting 1000 year old forests. They made shitloads of money off of a tree that fell down naturally.

I've lived in BC, Canada, all my life. Have our forests changed any in the last 35 years? Not a bit. I take people on tours here all the time for mountain bike riding, virtually nobody realizes that the forest we ride through is all second or third growth. So what exactly is greenpeace making all the ruckus about? I'll tell you what - they are screaming and wailing about the level of coin in their coffers, that's what.

 

[SupraMario]

grim this is wat green peace is getting pissed about, but in all fairness isnt %99 of foundations that are supposed to help just make money or really dont help at all. theres a difference between logging and clear cutting like they do to the rain forest, i dont mind logging but this right here is not logging.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/10/1020_051020_amazon.html
:3d_frown:

 

[GrimJack]

Dead, have you been to the rain forest? I have. Do you know what tree farms are? I do, and Greenpeace does, but they don't care.

Pictures like that are misleading. I can't speak to those in particular, because I don't know their history - but I know that Greenpeace has taken similar photos of farms - these are privately owned tree plantations, where literally every tree cut is one that was planted years ago by the owner - and used those photos in a smear campaign to raise money.