GE>GTE Swap finished..for now!
- Thread starter yankiwi
- Start date
OK... Time for an update.
Just finished making my exhaust. The old 2.5in NA exhaust is gone. In goes the full 3in turbo back system.
What I used....
1x length of 3in pipe from local muffler shop = $20
1x 3in mandrel bent pipe bends from ebay = $32
1x Magnaflow 12298 3inch in 2x 3in out muffler = $78
Total spent = $130:aigo:
Just finished making my exhaust. The old 2.5in NA exhaust is gone. In goes the full 3in turbo back system.
What I used....
1x length of 3in pipe from local muffler shop = $20
1x 3in mandrel bent pipe bends from ebay = $32
1x Magnaflow 12298 3inch in 2x 3in out muffler = $78
Total spent = $130:aigo:
Overall this exhaust, with the test pipe, gave me 2psi more boost. Now running 10psi on the stock turbo/wastegate. With the NA compression this thing rocks:biglaugh:
I like the fact that shit on my car is built by me, this was the first time I tried something like this. My welding sucks, but it got better..... stupid gasless MIG:icon_evil
Looks just like the sets sold for $3-400, just cheaper!
Oh and the sound of it gives me wood:naughty: nice deep roar, at WOT it is awesome.
Pic on the car, I know it's crooked. I had one more hanger to put on when this pic was taken. Just need some shiny tips to put on, then it's done.
I like the fact that shit on my car is built by me, this was the first time I tried something like this. My welding sucks, but it got better..... stupid gasless MIG:icon_evil
Looks just like the sets sold for $3-400, just cheaper!
Oh and the sound of it gives me wood:naughty: nice deep roar, at WOT it is awesome.
Pic on the car, I know it's crooked. I had one more hanger to put on when this pic was taken. Just need some shiny tips to put on, then it's done.
Very nice man, I'll use some of your advice when I go NA-T in the future. But I was wondering what you used concerning the 1/2 NA-T as far as tuning as concerned, what did you try to tune with? I've seen people tune with a simple tuning device such as the S-AFC and have great results, you think you just might have been a different case? What was your setup during the 1/2 NA-T? And did you tighten down the AFM flapper all the way?
-Matt
-Matt
The 1/2 Na-t thing just isn't worth it IMHO, when you can get a set of turbo electronics pretty cheap if you piece it all together from the for sale section. I look at it this way, for what I spent on a rising rate FPR and if I bought a Safc for the 1/2na-t, I would be at the same $$$ as using turbo electronics. The car now runs like Toyota meant it to. No problems at all. I had constant driveablilty issues before.
The NA AFM just doesn't like boost. I had the car running OK, but I was constantly fighting issues. Like stalling every time I let off the gas, or stumbling acceleration from low revs. I couldn't ever get a nice steady AFR across the RPM band. It works, but its not as usable as full NA-T.
Maybe my setup was FUBAR, I dunno. I used all the knowledge of guys that have done it before, and I make my old setup sound worse than it probably was, but that's only because I've been spoiled now by the ease of this setup.
The NA AFM just doesn't like boost. I had the car running OK, but I was constantly fighting issues. Like stalling every time I let off the gas, or stumbling acceleration from low revs. I couldn't ever get a nice steady AFR across the RPM band. It works, but its not as usable as full NA-T.
Maybe my setup was FUBAR, I dunno. I used all the knowledge of guys that have done it before, and I make my old setup sound worse than it probably was, but that's only because I've been spoiled now by the ease of this setup.
That is one of the nicest conversion I have seen. Very clean and well done. Real nice job on the Exhaust as well.
Hello yankiwi!!!
If you dont mind I have a couple questions!!! You are running a stock ge block and head??? What injectors are you using??? How are you running your turbo oil lines??? I know you are limited on boost with the GE what do you think is your max boost. At 10 psi do you have any Idea of HP??? And finally any guess on quarter times???
I love my NA and love the thought of being NA-T but am just wondering if NA-T is worth it????
Oh I love your car!!! It is supra classy. Stock body on TT wheels and sticking to its NA heritage. Nicely done!!!!
If you dont mind I have a couple questions!!! You are running a stock ge block and head??? What injectors are you using??? How are you running your turbo oil lines??? I know you are limited on boost with the GE what do you think is your max boost. At 10 psi do you have any Idea of HP??? And finally any guess on quarter times???
I love my NA and love the thought of being NA-T but am just wondering if NA-T is worth it????
Oh I love your car!!! It is supra classy. Stock body on TT wheels and sticking to its NA heritage. Nicely done!!!!
VERY nice conversion..looks clean, GOOD JOB!
about how much would you say the conversion cost ya? (pretty much, what parts do i need to get, and how do i fit it all on there?) and, can ya post a link to where you found some of the guide/info? thanks
about how much would you say the conversion cost ya? (pretty much, what parts do i need to get, and how do i fit it all on there?) and, can ya post a link to where you found some of the guide/info? thanks
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da89soup,
First, congrats on your ROTM. Nice car.
Now let me answer your questions.
I am running the stock NA block and head, I pulled the engine to do the conversion cause it is easier to do. I also put the R-154 on too. I am using a stock headgasket with ARP bolts @ 80ft/lbs.
Oil lines are custom. I have a -4AN feed line off a tee from the oil pressure sender, and the drain line is -10AN. I pulled the oil pan off when the engine was out and drilled a hole, then welded in a -10 bung. Stainless braided lines. You can buy the lines from Rabidchimp.com. I think MDC on here makes them too, but if I am right, his are for a turbo block and the lines are a little shorter. I don't know if they would be long enough to go down to the pan as the turbo return is midway up the block.
Injectors are stock turbo 440's.
I bypassed the turbo coolent lines, didn't need them, just use a turbo timer.
As for max boost, I think 12-13 is about it without some fuel/timing management. I am staying with 10 for now, I have an HK$ MHG hanging on the wall in my garage but I didn't want to strip the motor down for machining this time around so to keep reliability up somewhat 10psi is max for now.
I plan on dynoing soon, so HP #'s will be up then. But the ass dyno says 287.4rwhp:biglaugh: 300rwhp is my goal. I need to swap in my 3.91 LSD then I will take it down the quarter. My goal there is 13's, but that is more up to me and my skills (or lack of) than the car!
Honestly, this is the best thing you could do to an NA. It really is a great car, I love driving this thing, and the turbo power just makes it 10 times more fun. I haven't run against any local turbo guys but it is obvious that 10psi to 10psi I will toast them!!! No lag, boosting + from about 1800rpm:naughty:
I have owned high boost turbo cars before and that kick when it boosts is fun, but this car is more driveable. This car will be used for autocross more than drag so the current powerband is better suited to that.
Do it!!!!!! You will fall in love with your supra all over again.
First, congrats on your ROTM. Nice car.
Now let me answer your questions.
I am running the stock NA block and head, I pulled the engine to do the conversion cause it is easier to do. I also put the R-154 on too. I am using a stock headgasket with ARP bolts @ 80ft/lbs.
Oil lines are custom. I have a -4AN feed line off a tee from the oil pressure sender, and the drain line is -10AN. I pulled the oil pan off when the engine was out and drilled a hole, then welded in a -10 bung. Stainless braided lines. You can buy the lines from Rabidchimp.com. I think MDC on here makes them too, but if I am right, his are for a turbo block and the lines are a little shorter. I don't know if they would be long enough to go down to the pan as the turbo return is midway up the block.
Injectors are stock turbo 440's.
I bypassed the turbo coolent lines, didn't need them, just use a turbo timer.
As for max boost, I think 12-13 is about it without some fuel/timing management. I am staying with 10 for now, I have an HK$ MHG hanging on the wall in my garage but I didn't want to strip the motor down for machining this time around so to keep reliability up somewhat 10psi is max for now.
I plan on dynoing soon, so HP #'s will be up then. But the ass dyno says 287.4rwhp:biglaugh: 300rwhp is my goal. I need to swap in my 3.91 LSD then I will take it down the quarter. My goal there is 13's, but that is more up to me and my skills (or lack of) than the car!
Honestly, this is the best thing you could do to an NA. It really is a great car, I love driving this thing, and the turbo power just makes it 10 times more fun. I haven't run against any local turbo guys but it is obvious that 10psi to 10psi I will toast them!!! No lag, boosting + from about 1800rpm:naughty:
I have owned high boost turbo cars before and that kick when it boosts is fun, but this car is more driveable. This car will be used for autocross more than drag so the current powerband is better suited to that.
Do it!!!!!! You will fall in love with your supra all over again.
yankiwi said:
Thank you so much for this post you have really shown all of us the proper way to NA-T. At this point I am so unsure the route I will take but I love how simple your set up is. Thank you for all of the info, you have helped us NA guys out more than you know. Again I am so sold on your car and I look forward to seeing you in future posts.................................:icon_bigg
Soup
Steven89,
Cost is relative to your patience! I was in no hurry as this car is not my daily driver, so I just kept checking the forums and picked up deals when I could.
I ended up buying an 87 turbo with a BHG for my parts. I actually made money on it so this conversion cost me nothing. I got the 87 from some honduh kids that needed it gone from their momma's house for cheap. I parted out what I didn't take and sold the shell. I ended up with the R-154, LSD and block/head, and the electronics. The engine is sitting in the corner of my garage for the future. The rest is on the car now.
But here's an example of how you can do stuff cheap if you look araound.
I made my intercooler hardpipes from a honda crx intake-$15, and some mandrel bent piping from ebay-$27. About $50 for silicon couplers and clamps-ebay again. Probably around $100 total for hardpipes that would sell for $300+.
Got my 3inch downpipe and high flow turbo elbow for $120, all stainless. Just needed some holes enlarged to fit. Ebay again.....
Read above for my exhaust $$$ savings. The key is being able to do stuff yourself.
If I had to guess on your cost here's the list, and what I would pay for each:
ECU and harness $150-200
CPS $30-50
Coilpacks $30-50
Ignitor $20-30
Injectors $30-50
Turbo $100-150
Manifold $20-30
Stock intercooler and piping $75-100
Stock elbow/downpipe $20-40
AFM $40-50
So low side $500ish, high side eleventy billion depending on how many toys you buy:biglaugh:
My best advice, shop around. I have seen guys selling the whole list I just wrote for $3-400.
Here's a link to my main resource for my supra questions
www.supramania.com then "search" :naughty:
I've done so much to my car lately it is hard to list it all, but if anyone has any NA-T questions ask me and I will try to help, I certainly learned a few things this summer and would be glad to share.
Cost is relative to your patience! I was in no hurry as this car is not my daily driver, so I just kept checking the forums and picked up deals when I could.
I ended up buying an 87 turbo with a BHG for my parts. I actually made money on it so this conversion cost me nothing. I got the 87 from some honduh kids that needed it gone from their momma's house for cheap. I parted out what I didn't take and sold the shell. I ended up with the R-154, LSD and block/head, and the electronics. The engine is sitting in the corner of my garage for the future. The rest is on the car now.
But here's an example of how you can do stuff cheap if you look araound.
I made my intercooler hardpipes from a honda crx intake-$15, and some mandrel bent piping from ebay-$27. About $50 for silicon couplers and clamps-ebay again. Probably around $100 total for hardpipes that would sell for $300+.
Got my 3inch downpipe and high flow turbo elbow for $120, all stainless. Just needed some holes enlarged to fit. Ebay again.....
Read above for my exhaust $$$ savings. The key is being able to do stuff yourself.
If I had to guess on your cost here's the list, and what I would pay for each:
ECU and harness $150-200
CPS $30-50
Coilpacks $30-50
Ignitor $20-30
Injectors $30-50
Turbo $100-150
Manifold $20-30
Stock intercooler and piping $75-100
Stock elbow/downpipe $20-40
AFM $40-50
So low side $500ish, high side eleventy billion depending on how many toys you buy:biglaugh:
My best advice, shop around. I have seen guys selling the whole list I just wrote for $3-400.
Here's a link to my main resource for my supra questions
www.supramania.com then "search" :naughty:
I've done so much to my car lately it is hard to list it all, but if anyone has any NA-T questions ask me and I will try to help, I certainly learned a few things this summer and would be glad to share.
where did you get the stuff to make the longer wires for the relocation if you dont mind me asking? im looking to do something like that with my setup
Bigzavs,
The wires are MSD 7M-GE wires. They are longer than GTE ones obviously. They have the correct plug end and you have to modify the coilpack end to fit the GTE coilpack. The set I got came with that end unassembled. I cut to length then cut the brass electrode thingy in half, and squeezed it a little to reduce the diameter to snugly fit in the coilpack. Then cut the grey rubber boot, which starts out as a 90deg elbow. I cut it so it is straight, it then squeezes in the coilpack hole and makes a good weatherproof seal. I was concerned about the wires coming loose as I am not utilising the stock locking clip dealy, but they are on really tight. If you search for Bigaarons setup you can use one set of wires. With my setup the two shortest NA wires were just too short to reach my coilpack. Actually they did reach but it was too tight for my liking. I ended up with 2 sets of wires to make it work. I might move my coilpack down to where bigaarons is, then sell my spare set of NA wires.
I will try to get a pic to explain all the crap I just wrote.
EDIT to add pic
In order: My modified wire, the electrode before assembly/cutting, the boot before cutting, a stock NA wire
The wires are MSD 7M-GE wires. They are longer than GTE ones obviously. They have the correct plug end and you have to modify the coilpack end to fit the GTE coilpack. The set I got came with that end unassembled. I cut to length then cut the brass electrode thingy in half, and squeezed it a little to reduce the diameter to snugly fit in the coilpack. Then cut the grey rubber boot, which starts out as a 90deg elbow. I cut it so it is straight, it then squeezes in the coilpack hole and makes a good weatherproof seal. I was concerned about the wires coming loose as I am not utilising the stock locking clip dealy, but they are on really tight. If you search for Bigaarons setup you can use one set of wires. With my setup the two shortest NA wires were just too short to reach my coilpack. Actually they did reach but it was too tight for my liking. I ended up with 2 sets of wires to make it work. I might move my coilpack down to where bigaarons is, then sell my spare set of NA wires.
I will try to get a pic to explain all the crap I just wrote.
EDIT to add pic
In order: My modified wire, the electrode before assembly/cutting, the boot before cutting, a stock NA wire
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yankiwi said:
Thanks, yea i was really just wondering if this is a lot cheaper than getting a whole 7M-GTE setup and installing it... and it is, the only 7M-GTEs ive seen around costs like $1000-1250(for everything u need) I will definately do a swap like yours in the future, especially if its only like $500-700