Car impounded and $1,000+ in fines.
- Thread starter 89Turbo
- Start date
supra community come together and make a huge rebelious organization and plot against the police!
89Turbo said:
Unless they can quote a specific passage in the ORS that gives them the right to impound the vehicle for 811.125 I think you have a pretty good case. I searched the ORS regarding both racing and impounding and those are the only two statutes specifically covering them. Also, like I said before its a Class A traffic violation...its not a traffic crime, and its not a misdemeanor. but they could have hit you with a bigger fine if they deemed that worthy. Seems pretty wierd that they would only hit you with about 60% of the possible fine, but at the same time see fit to tow your vehicle.
It pays to know something about the law, and I keep a copy of the ORS and the Oregon Drivers handbook in my glove box. I also recommend you treat all law enforcement with respect, but that doesnt mean you should kowtow to them either. They have to follow the law every bit as much as you do. I would have politely asked the officer at the scene to explain to me under which statute he was having my vehicle impounded. If he doesnt site the exact ORS number he doesnt have any business doing it.
This was within the city of Portland right? I will look and see if the city (or the county for that matter) has any specific ordinances that supercede the state law, but Im pretty sure they dont. I believe all traffic laws are under the states jurisdiction.
Maybe the cop thought you were doing a "time attack"... hence the street racing charge.
Make sure you camp out just outside the yard... make sure no one messes with your stuff.
Make sure you camp out just outside the yard... make sure no one messes with your stuff.
theWeezL said:
where can i pick a copy up? the DMV? yes it was within the city of portland, 102nd and Stark, how do i go about fighting the Impound charge if i need my car back on Monday and the first court date isnt until the 8th of September? pay on Monday and then fight it when i get my trial?
Yes, pay the impound and get your car out, and fight the charge and cost in court. If they find in your favor you would be eligible for a refund from the county. You may not get it all back, in fact you may not be able to recover any of the fees you pay, but you will have a better understanding of the legal system and if you win, you will gain an enormous sence of accomplishment and self achievment. When they say, "you can't fight city hall" what they really should say is "you CAN fight city hall, just dont expect it to be easy or get anything if you win".
If you want a full copy of ORS you can purchase a copy here: Legislative Council
But, if its just for court you can print out the pages you need from here: ORS online
The sections I cited earlier are the pertainant ones. But there is an index (not searchable though) and you should do a complete read through to see if you can find any thing I might have missed. I would also recommend you call a legal helpline or contact a place like TixNix and get a free consultation. Use all the resources at your disposal, there are plenty. If nothing else you will learn something new about your rights and the laws that govern them.
Also: (from the Oregon Lawyers Association) Before you go to court, prepare your case. Check the law you are accused of violating to make certain you understand it. A copy of the vehicle code will be located in the courthouse law library. If pictures will help your case, bring them to court. (I'll go one further and say if you can, get a video camera and tape the exact same intersection at the same time of night on the same day of the week to show its typical traffic conditions, if nothing else it will show the judge you were prepared) Bring any witnesses, especially people who were in the car with you at the time of the alleged violation. Present your defense in as clear and simple terms as possible. Avoid legal terms you don't understand. Tell your story the way you see it. The court is usually very helpful to people without lawyers. Tell the truth and present your case carefully.
And I will add to that: dress as nice as you can. I really do recommend a suit if you own one, if not at least wear a collared shirt and a tie. Mind your manners, remember to address the judge as "your honor" or "judge". Dont be whiney or confrontational. Try to speak clearly and with conviction, but not with anger.
Be prepared to ask the officer pertainant questions that demonstrate to the judge the circumstances of the case...not just questions like "why did you give me a ticket" or "why is your neck so narrow". Try asking questions like: "what would you say the traffic conditions were at the time of the offence in question", "how many other cars were observed 'racing' in the area?", "Under what statute did you determine impoundment was justified"
Be willing to conceed that you lost control of your vehicle, and that you are sorry for that. Offer to take a diversion program or a drivers training course if they are willing to suspend the record.
But the most important advice I can give you is...if you have to pay fines or do something the court orders...DO IT!!! or at least call them if you have a problem paying...dont just ignore it and hope it will go away...IT WONT! you will only compound matters.
If you want a full copy of ORS you can purchase a copy here: Legislative Council
But, if its just for court you can print out the pages you need from here: ORS online
The sections I cited earlier are the pertainant ones. But there is an index (not searchable though) and you should do a complete read through to see if you can find any thing I might have missed. I would also recommend you call a legal helpline or contact a place like TixNix and get a free consultation. Use all the resources at your disposal, there are plenty. If nothing else you will learn something new about your rights and the laws that govern them.
Also: (from the Oregon Lawyers Association) Before you go to court, prepare your case. Check the law you are accused of violating to make certain you understand it. A copy of the vehicle code will be located in the courthouse law library. If pictures will help your case, bring them to court. (I'll go one further and say if you can, get a video camera and tape the exact same intersection at the same time of night on the same day of the week to show its typical traffic conditions, if nothing else it will show the judge you were prepared) Bring any witnesses, especially people who were in the car with you at the time of the alleged violation. Present your defense in as clear and simple terms as possible. Avoid legal terms you don't understand. Tell your story the way you see it. The court is usually very helpful to people without lawyers. Tell the truth and present your case carefully.
And I will add to that: dress as nice as you can. I really do recommend a suit if you own one, if not at least wear a collared shirt and a tie. Mind your manners, remember to address the judge as "your honor" or "judge". Dont be whiney or confrontational. Try to speak clearly and with conviction, but not with anger.
Be prepared to ask the officer pertainant questions that demonstrate to the judge the circumstances of the case...not just questions like "why did you give me a ticket" or "why is your neck so narrow". Try asking questions like: "what would you say the traffic conditions were at the time of the offence in question", "how many other cars were observed 'racing' in the area?", "Under what statute did you determine impoundment was justified"
Be willing to conceed that you lost control of your vehicle, and that you are sorry for that. Offer to take a diversion program or a drivers training course if they are willing to suspend the record.
But the most important advice I can give you is...if you have to pay fines or do something the court orders...DO IT!!! or at least call them if you have a problem paying...dont just ignore it and hope it will go away...IT WONT! you will only compound matters.
JustAnotherVictim
Supramania Contributor
IJ. said:
yeah, he could do that as well...it kinda depends on if he has anything better to do or not...lol
IJ. said:
LMAO. Yep, as my dad used to say: "when ya pay to learn, ya learn".
Gotta give +1 to weezl though....he knows his stuff. Prior experience no doubt
so on the ORS Online it says under 811.125: Speed racing on highway; penalty
WTF i wasnt doing that?
seems like what i did falls under 811.355
(Turning)
811.335 Unlawful or unsignaled turn; penalty
811.340 Improperly executed left turn; penalty
811.345 Failure to use special left turn lane; penalty
811.346 Misuse of special left turn lane; penalty
811.350 Dangerous left turn; penalty
811.355 Improperly executed right turn; penalty
811.360 When vehicle turn permitted at stop light; improper turn at stop light; penalty
811.365 Illegal U-turn; penalty
WTF i wasnt doing that?
seems like what i did falls under 811.355
(Turning)
811.335 Unlawful or unsignaled turn; penalty
811.340 Improperly executed left turn; penalty
811.345 Failure to use special left turn lane; penalty
811.346 Misuse of special left turn lane; penalty
811.350 Dangerous left turn; penalty
811.355 Improperly executed right turn; penalty
811.360 When vehicle turn permitted at stop light; improper turn at stop light; penalty
811.365 Illegal U-turn; penalty
Thank you to Weezl for the greeat info for us in the Oregon area. Like I said, cops around here like to use the speed racing ticket. There may be something behind the towing thing though, may not be legal but they use it alot.
My example:
Pulling onto 82nd from a side street near my house that I am aware has loose gravel at times because of trucks turning in and out and dropping it. The turn is a hairpin going south (actually have to head a little north to clear the bridge sidewalk area). View to the north is obscured by a cop car parked perpindicular to the street talking at the back of the car to an assumed "lady of the night". Time is dusk so some cars have lights on, others don't. Have to be passed the cop car to see oncoming traffic but that puts me IN oncoming traffic. Speed limit is 35, cars move from 20 to 50mph down the street. I have a 5 speed NA.
I wait until I can't see anything past (through) the cop cars windows and pull into traffic. My tires don't spit gravel everywhere, but since I was trying to move into traffic that could have been going any speed I did burp the tires on the gravel. I get up to 35mph and continue on. Cop pulls me over 3 or 4 blocks down at a shopping parking lot. He walks around my car several times before approaching the drivers window, where I was sitting waiting. He asks why I did the "burn out" or whatever "you guys" call it. I explained to him that I did not intend to kcik any gravel but that his car parked where it was was obscuring the view of the road. He leaves me alone on that and asks how fast I was going. I told him and he said it didn't really matter what my speed was, it was how fast I got to speed that was the issue. I can't find current insurance card in the car but I have the one for the last 6 months. He says that it isn't his job to call and ask if the insurance is current or not and then he says he is going to do me a favor ;
1) He can write me a ticket for speedracing for "burning out" and moving to speed to quickly and have my car towed or..
2) He can write me a ticket for no proof of insurance, and have my car towed.
Nice favor. I don't answer him because technically I'm guilty of both in his eyes and I don't really want the car towed. He ends up writing me a no proof of insurance and then lets me drive on home. Really nice of him, I thought, until I went to court.
Didn't go to argue the ticket but usually just showing up drops your ticket. The guy in front of me in court had gotten a "no insurance" ticket for whatever the fee was.....I think around $200-$250, shows his proof of insurance and the fee was dropped to around 30-50. Me, I get up and the judge tells me that since the officer wrote the ticket as "no proof of insurance" some statute won't allow him to drop the fine at all, so I payed the 180 and left. But lucky for me, no tow....don't know if it was a scare tactic or if he really could have. BTW, I'm 35, so he wasn't thinking some youngster with an attitude, and I was as polite as I could be with him.
I know this is long and doesn't really help, but I had some extra time and wanted to explain a little about the mentality of the cops around here. He also said since my car stood out I better be careful cause he would be keeping an eye out for me.:icon_conf
Brian
My example:
Pulling onto 82nd from a side street near my house that I am aware has loose gravel at times because of trucks turning in and out and dropping it. The turn is a hairpin going south (actually have to head a little north to clear the bridge sidewalk area). View to the north is obscured by a cop car parked perpindicular to the street talking at the back of the car to an assumed "lady of the night". Time is dusk so some cars have lights on, others don't. Have to be passed the cop car to see oncoming traffic but that puts me IN oncoming traffic. Speed limit is 35, cars move from 20 to 50mph down the street. I have a 5 speed NA.
I wait until I can't see anything past (through) the cop cars windows and pull into traffic. My tires don't spit gravel everywhere, but since I was trying to move into traffic that could have been going any speed I did burp the tires on the gravel. I get up to 35mph and continue on. Cop pulls me over 3 or 4 blocks down at a shopping parking lot. He walks around my car several times before approaching the drivers window, where I was sitting waiting. He asks why I did the "burn out" or whatever "you guys" call it. I explained to him that I did not intend to kcik any gravel but that his car parked where it was was obscuring the view of the road. He leaves me alone on that and asks how fast I was going. I told him and he said it didn't really matter what my speed was, it was how fast I got to speed that was the issue. I can't find current insurance card in the car but I have the one for the last 6 months. He says that it isn't his job to call and ask if the insurance is current or not and then he says he is going to do me a favor ;
1) He can write me a ticket for speedracing for "burning out" and moving to speed to quickly and have my car towed or..
2) He can write me a ticket for no proof of insurance, and have my car towed.
Nice favor. I don't answer him because technically I'm guilty of both in his eyes and I don't really want the car towed. He ends up writing me a no proof of insurance and then lets me drive on home. Really nice of him, I thought, until I went to court.
Didn't go to argue the ticket but usually just showing up drops your ticket. The guy in front of me in court had gotten a "no insurance" ticket for whatever the fee was.....I think around $200-$250, shows his proof of insurance and the fee was dropped to around 30-50. Me, I get up and the judge tells me that since the officer wrote the ticket as "no proof of insurance" some statute won't allow him to drop the fine at all, so I payed the 180 and left. But lucky for me, no tow....don't know if it was a scare tactic or if he really could have. BTW, I'm 35, so he wasn't thinking some youngster with an attitude, and I was as polite as I could be with him.
I know this is long and doesn't really help, but I had some extra time and wanted to explain a little about the mentality of the cops around here. He also said since my car stood out I better be careful cause he would be keeping an eye out for me.:icon_conf
Brian
mine was dropped to 360 which is apparently the max it could be dropped. My impound was 500 set fee from sergant cuz they dont have a storage fee. Ive probly paid the state about 2k by now and Im still not done.
Gargoyle, you not having proof of insurance was cause enough to tow you. I am still trying to find out if there is a statute that states they can tow your car for racing. The law is vaguely written and they are getting away with the "exhibition of speed" subsection for writing the racing ticket.
Mainly you guys are getting profiled. Young white males driving imports that go "pssssshhh VROOM Pssshhh" (to quote Jake) and Im afraid your peers have screwed it for all of you. Every new traffic fatality caused by kids racing fuels on the desire to curb the practice. And anyone seen as a possible "tuner" gets the same treatment regardless of place, time...and actual citable offence.
Mainly you guys are getting profiled. Young white males driving imports that go "pssssshhh VROOM Pssshhh" (to quote Jake) and Im afraid your peers have screwed it for all of you. Every new traffic fatality caused by kids racing fuels on the desire to curb the practice. And anyone seen as a possible "tuner" gets the same treatment regardless of place, time...and actual citable offence.