attacks on christmas
- Thread starter Ckanderson
- Start date
arent there more important things to get bent out of shape about? that includes the PC advocates, and the people that get mad at the PC advocates.
Just like on SF. Eggy hates on me because I do hate him and he accuses me of hating him because he's white, which is funny because he's Jewish, but only claims that when he's it suits him. As in when he's justifying he knows prejudice.
It's Christmas. Those who think otherwise will come around eventually. 
The tree comes from one tradition, the gifts from another, and so on and so forth. Everyone celebrates for different reasons, but whatever it is, the fact is that we celebrate it.
Oh - and I really don't have a problem with the Happy Holidays thing - I've always viewed that as a method of lumping Christmas and New Years in the same boat, not a way to exclude Christ from the name of the holiday.
The tree comes from one tradition, the gifts from another, and so on and so forth. Everyone celebrates for different reasons, but whatever it is, the fact is that we celebrate it.
Oh - and I really don't have a problem with the Happy Holidays thing - I've always viewed that as a method of lumping Christmas and New Years in the same boat, not a way to exclude Christ from the name of the holiday.
This country is in big trouble. Most people think the answer is to be supportive and tolerant of new ideas, ways of life and styles of thinking. I'm sorry, I know that societies need to change and evolve, but this is ridiculous. Everyone claims discrimination and screams for equality. "The way things have always been" should not be changed unless it's truly harming someone else. We're not talking "Oh, my feelings are hurt because I'm a mental case" or "I'm so special - my mommy said so, so you guys need to change this". Those are not reasons to change a nation's way of expressing holiday cheer.
The next thing you know, the Wiccans are going to start screaming about Halloween and it's imagery being stereotyped with their religion, and we lose out on another holiday.
We're losing the Pledge of Allegiance already. When I was going through school, you didn't have to say "under God". You could all together say "One nation," pause and wait for others to say "under God," and here's the magical part - then you come back together and say "indivisible, with liberty and justice for all". I don't know how we managed in school, what with our way being so drawn out and complicated, but I guess the lazy, sensitive kids and parents just wanted to cut out "under God" to make it easier on us all.
Here's the kicker: I'm agnostic - I don't know WHAT I believe in, but this whole "you can't worship in front of me" thing STILL pisses me off. There's a difference between someone cramming religion down your throat and someone upholding old traditions and faith. Maybe if people were more concerned with changing the world in OTHER ways instead of this little Mickey Mouse shit, we wouldn't be in some of the messes we are in today!
The next thing you know, the Wiccans are going to start screaming about Halloween and it's imagery being stereotyped with their religion, and we lose out on another holiday.
We're losing the Pledge of Allegiance already. When I was going through school, you didn't have to say "under God". You could all together say "One nation," pause and wait for others to say "under God," and here's the magical part - then you come back together and say "indivisible, with liberty and justice for all". I don't know how we managed in school, what with our way being so drawn out and complicated, but I guess the lazy, sensitive kids and parents just wanted to cut out "under God" to make it easier on us all.
Here's the kicker: I'm agnostic - I don't know WHAT I believe in, but this whole "you can't worship in front of me" thing STILL pisses me off. There's a difference between someone cramming religion down your throat and someone upholding old traditions and faith. Maybe if people were more concerned with changing the world in OTHER ways instead of this little Mickey Mouse shit, we wouldn't be in some of the messes we are in today!
aye mate said:
Oh wow.
Not a fan of your rights eh?
or is it just other people's rights you dont like?
As for PC going too far, yeah, I agree, as for our old buddy Rush 'the pill man' Limbaugh, he will say whatever he thinks will piss off liberals, or otherwise pander to his right wing listeners... that is, when he isnt blitzed passed the point of coherant speech.
to recap:
Christmas has commercializtion issues, and trying to force people into saluting a god that they may not worship or think is real is bullshit.
And Rush <and most extremist hype monkey media types> are sacks of shit.
Adjuster
Supramania Contributor
No way I can stay out of this one... LOL
Christmas is here to stay. "Happy Holiday's" is fine, but I still say and will always say Merry Christmas. (Well, Actually I like the Happy Christmas, Merry New Year, just because it makes people think and pull strange faces when you say it.)
PC should be for Political Crap. ACLU has done more harm than good, and many of my fellow Americans agree with me. Amen, and God Bless... (And fuck you ACLU.)
We are so backward right now it's not even funny.
It's OK to talk about Kwanza, or whatever "non Christian" religion wants to call their winter solstice celebration.
It would be limiting their rights to have to say God or Allah or whatever in any speaches, or pleges.
To these offended souls, I say "Screw you!" I've lived in other countries where Allah was in charge, and Christmas was talked about in hushed tones like some secret society. (Well, actually the Armenian Iranians celebrate Christmas, or they used to when the Shaw was still in power.)
Here in my country I will always celebrate Christmas. And In God I trust to the end of time.
Don't belive in God, Fine with me.
Don't want to celebrate Christmas, also fine with me. Nobody is holding a gun to your head you know.
Don't like money with "IN GOD WE TRUST" printed on it? Fine, use a credit or debit card, they have nothing printed on them.
If you really hate so much of America, please leave and go somewhere else. The world is a large place, and there are flights leaving many times a week, so your travel plans will not even cause you pain and suffering.
The vast majority of this country will party when your gone.
Merry Christmas!
IN GOD WE TRUST.
PS, Christ was actually born in the spring, that's when the Romans collected taxes, and why Mary and Joeseph had to go to his home town of Bethlehem to be counted and taxed under Roman rule. Sometime in April is Christ's birthday. Does this knowlege stop me from enjoying Christmas? Heck no. (Even though it really is a combination of a few pegan rituals, and parties around the winter solstice.) I celebrate Christmas with the rest of the world Dec. 25th. And I enjoy it and think of everything Christ did for me and this world. (Even for the ones who don't belive in him...) Ok, end of religious rant for now.
Christmas is here to stay. "Happy Holiday's" is fine, but I still say and will always say Merry Christmas. (Well, Actually I like the Happy Christmas, Merry New Year, just because it makes people think and pull strange faces when you say it.)
PC should be for Political Crap. ACLU has done more harm than good, and many of my fellow Americans agree with me. Amen, and God Bless... (And fuck you ACLU.)
We are so backward right now it's not even funny.
It's OK to talk about Kwanza, or whatever "non Christian" religion wants to call their winter solstice celebration.
It would be limiting their rights to have to say God or Allah or whatever in any speaches, or pleges.
To these offended souls, I say "Screw you!" I've lived in other countries where Allah was in charge, and Christmas was talked about in hushed tones like some secret society. (Well, actually the Armenian Iranians celebrate Christmas, or they used to when the Shaw was still in power.)
Here in my country I will always celebrate Christmas. And In God I trust to the end of time.
Don't belive in God, Fine with me.
Don't want to celebrate Christmas, also fine with me. Nobody is holding a gun to your head you know.
Don't like money with "IN GOD WE TRUST" printed on it? Fine, use a credit or debit card, they have nothing printed on them.
If you really hate so much of America, please leave and go somewhere else. The world is a large place, and there are flights leaving many times a week, so your travel plans will not even cause you pain and suffering.
The vast majority of this country will party when your gone.
Merry Christmas!
IN GOD WE TRUST.
PS, Christ was actually born in the spring, that's when the Romans collected taxes, and why Mary and Joeseph had to go to his home town of Bethlehem to be counted and taxed under Roman rule. Sometime in April is Christ's birthday. Does this knowlege stop me from enjoying Christmas? Heck no. (Even though it really is a combination of a few pegan rituals, and parties around the winter solstice.) I celebrate Christmas with the rest of the world Dec. 25th.
And I enjoy it and think of everything Christ did for me and this world. (Even for the ones who don't belive in him...) Ok, end of religious rant for now.
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I always find this quite funny - as Christmas just moved ~4 months to replace the midwinter fest from the older, now (mostly) extinct religion.Adjuster said:
Agreed Adjuster...
For those who dislike Christmas, they can piss off and stop bitching.
Cheers,
Roy
For those who dislike Christmas, they can piss off and stop bitching.
Cheers,
Roy
Right on there! IF YOU DONT LIKE CHRISTMAS..........PISS OFF.
I like that one. What is religion? Its a mixture of loads.
Christmas is Traditional and very comercialised.And a good thing realy,it takes our minds of the crappy winter days and nights for a couple of weeks.
Something for the kids to look forward too,Its great.
Get this over here the infant school stopped hot cross buns at Easter,
reason its not fair on other religions.
What a load of shit.
Religious education aswell thats all changed. I dont follow any religion i just look after my own and anyone else that does there bit and sticks to rules.
People that come into your country and demand this that and the other should just pack there bags and PISS OFF! or get on with others.
Put up or shut the fuck up.
Im not raceist or religious, I get along fine with anyone who plays by the rules.
I like that one. What is religion? Its a mixture of loads.
Christmas is Traditional and very comercialised.And a good thing realy,it takes our minds of the crappy winter days and nights for a couple of weeks.
Something for the kids to look forward too,Its great.
Get this over here the infant school stopped hot cross buns at Easter,
reason its not fair on other religions.
What a load of shit.
Religious education aswell thats all changed. I dont follow any religion i just look after my own and anyone else that does there bit and sticks to rules.
People that come into your country and demand this that and the other should just pack there bags and PISS OFF! or get on with others.
Put up or shut the fuck up.
Im not raceist or religious, I get along fine with anyone who plays by the rules.
I'm with you guys, i cant beleive they would want to change something so small.
this just goes to show you people will do anything for 15mins of fame/media attention. FUCK THEM ALL, its going to stay merry christmas, and im going to continue to tell my brother, to say "One nation, under God" and people who dont like it can go fuck off.
this just goes to show you people will do anything for 15mins of fame/media attention. FUCK THEM ALL, its going to stay merry christmas, and im going to continue to tell my brother, to say "One nation, under God" and people who dont like it can go fuck off.
IJ-There is no "political correctness" anymore.
Hey everybody, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! (not to steal your thunder, Nate)
Hey everybody, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! (not to steal your thunder, Nate)
<sigh>
Ok, first and foremost, Christmas. It was originally the Roman festival of lupercalia, which was a celebration of some sort to their pagan gods. Christmas, like so many other holidays (halloween for example) was an adaptation of a pagan holiday to a Christian one so that pagans would be more likely to convert. Most scholars believe at this point that Jesus was most likely not born on December 25th and was probably born in the spring. There are several reasons for this, but the most likely is that the bible mentions the shepherds tending their flocks in the fields, and that would historically not have occurred during December. I am not a historian so I do not know the information in detail, but if you want to flame me about this, then LOOK IT UP FIRST and show me a current source of information that contradicts this and I'll shut up about it.
The problem that I have is that everyone says "90% of america is chrisitan so fuck everyone who has a problem with it." In this country, we have this thing called "freedom of religion" that allows people to believe whatever they want, WITHOUT PERSECUTION. now, let's do a proof of opposition for this one (my favorite type of inductive proof). What if, for example, the pledge of allegiance said "one nation, that affirms god does not exist" instead? Would you have a problem with it? What if it said "one nation, under allah?" I would bet that in either of those situations, that having to say it in school would make christians uncomfortable and they would be up in arms. However, because it says "god" it's supposed to be OK? How is that freedom of religion for those people who do not believe in god? They have equal rights under the law too. In fact, "under god" was only recently added to the pledge (in the 60's I think). As for currency, if you read your history, it did not always say "in god we trust" and the word "god" does not appear in the constitution. The christian organizations (note: organizations, not christians themselves) state that this is because the idea of secularism didn't exist when it was written, but I think that is nonsense because there have always been people that do not worship "god" or have other, totally different religions, even when the constitution was written. The more logical explaination (in my opinion) is that the founders of this country wanted to guarantee religious freedom for all people and all religions, no matter how they were concieved. the founding fathers thought of all kinds of stuff that affects things that were never conceived of during their time (otherwise how would the FCC regulate radio frequencies, as an example?) and I think that leaving the word "god" out of the constitution was a powerful statement for religous neutrality of our government. I think that this is an important protection of the rights of the 23% of americans that are not christian (you heard me, if you think I'm wrong, google it). No one should be forced to say or see anything with reference to god or a specific religion in public places in public facilities. Choosing to put a cross on the wall of your office in a federal building is ok, it's your personal office. Choosing to have a cross over your grave in Arlington is ok, it's your monument (and the state does not force every grave to have a cross, the army recognizes over 200 religions). However, having the 10 commandments displayed in the entryway to a courthouse is wrong. Even if it's only a small percentage of people (it's not, but even if it was), religious freedom is guaranteed to ALL people in this country, not just the majority, and as a result, the minority should not be forced to conform to the majority's religion, nor should that religion be a part of the government.
anyway, happy festivus everyone.
Ok, first and foremost, Christmas. It was originally the Roman festival of lupercalia, which was a celebration of some sort to their pagan gods. Christmas, like so many other holidays (halloween for example) was an adaptation of a pagan holiday to a Christian one so that pagans would be more likely to convert. Most scholars believe at this point that Jesus was most likely not born on December 25th and was probably born in the spring. There are several reasons for this, but the most likely is that the bible mentions the shepherds tending their flocks in the fields, and that would historically not have occurred during December. I am not a historian so I do not know the information in detail, but if you want to flame me about this, then LOOK IT UP FIRST and show me a current source of information that contradicts this and I'll shut up about it.
The problem that I have is that everyone says "90% of america is chrisitan so fuck everyone who has a problem with it." In this country, we have this thing called "freedom of religion" that allows people to believe whatever they want, WITHOUT PERSECUTION. now, let's do a proof of opposition for this one (my favorite type of inductive proof). What if, for example, the pledge of allegiance said "one nation, that affirms god does not exist" instead? Would you have a problem with it? What if it said "one nation, under allah?" I would bet that in either of those situations, that having to say it in school would make christians uncomfortable and they would be up in arms. However, because it says "god" it's supposed to be OK? How is that freedom of religion for those people who do not believe in god? They have equal rights under the law too. In fact, "under god" was only recently added to the pledge (in the 60's I think). As for currency, if you read your history, it did not always say "in god we trust" and the word "god" does not appear in the constitution. The christian organizations (note: organizations, not christians themselves) state that this is because the idea of secularism didn't exist when it was written, but I think that is nonsense because there have always been people that do not worship "god" or have other, totally different religions, even when the constitution was written. The more logical explaination (in my opinion) is that the founders of this country wanted to guarantee religious freedom for all people and all religions, no matter how they were concieved. the founding fathers thought of all kinds of stuff that affects things that were never conceived of during their time (otherwise how would the FCC regulate radio frequencies, as an example?) and I think that leaving the word "god" out of the constitution was a powerful statement for religous neutrality of our government. I think that this is an important protection of the rights of the 23% of americans that are not christian (you heard me, if you think I'm wrong, google it). No one should be forced to say or see anything with reference to god or a specific religion in public places in public facilities. Choosing to put a cross on the wall of your office in a federal building is ok, it's your personal office. Choosing to have a cross over your grave in Arlington is ok, it's your monument (and the state does not force every grave to have a cross, the army recognizes over 200 religions). However, having the 10 commandments displayed in the entryway to a courthouse is wrong. Even if it's only a small percentage of people (it's not, but even if it was), religious freedom is guaranteed to ALL people in this country, not just the majority, and as a result, the minority should not be forced to conform to the majority's religion, nor should that religion be a part of the government.
anyway, happy festivus everyone.
a lot of people who celebrates christmas aren't christian, just like pretty much all the so called christian holidays, its more of a tradition now than a religous thing.
what we have problems with is when people bitch about minor crap, like calling saying merry christmas, "o that doesnt apply to me cause im not christian, so i'm goign to raise hell on the smallest fuckin thing" thats what we a pissed about, people take "freedom of religion or freedom of speech" WAY TO FAR. they dont know when somethings should just be left alone and not interferd with.
what we have problems with is when people bitch about minor crap, like calling saying merry christmas, "o that doesnt apply to me cause im not christian, so i'm goign to raise hell on the smallest fuckin thing" thats what we a pissed about, people take "freedom of religion or freedom of speech" WAY TO FAR. they dont know when somethings should just be left alone and not interferd with.
That's right. So if Christianity does not apply to you, appreciate your right to worship whatever goat or cow or even yourself if you wish. I'll continue this point after another one of your quotes.wh0wants2know said:
On this, first of all, nobody has to recite the Pledge of Allegiance. Freedom of religion grants anyone the right to choose to sit down or probably even step out of the room if they feel so inclined. Also, since our laws are based heavily on the Ten Commandments, I don't believe that there can be an absolute separation of church and state. Our nation was largely founded on Christian beliefs in the first place (I don't have the references in front of me but I can get them). I guess if you don't like it and think that you don't have enough religious freedom, then you can choose to move to another country-where you'll have fewer rights than you do here. You make the choice.
Who is imaginitively being forced to say or see any references to a religion they choose not to be affiliated with? Nobody is being forced to say anything and if you don't want to look at a cross, picture of Jesus or the Ten Commandments, then don't. The individual is the one who is in full control of where their eyes wander-nobody else. If they happen to hear or see something that does not apply to them, then instead of whining about it and becoming intolerant to the point of attempting to rid our country of all public displays of religion-a right granted to all, they should be so thankful as to have that right granted to themself in the first place. A cross in your office or on your monument is still a public display of religion as is the Ten Commandments hanging in a government building.
If you don't quite get my point yet-and lets be honest-who couldn't(?), the right that grants all Americans freedom of religion should stand as just that. Not the right to freedom of religion in private. If you're intolerant of someone simply using the rights and freedoms granted to all of us, then you don't belong in America, plain and simple. I think that should give you a good idea of your own worth (or lack of) if you can't just let people live in what we know as "The American Way."
Not even going to start....
But MERRY CHRISTMAS
And happy new year!
Its early I know.
Let them attack it! If you continue to call the season by its CORRECT name the evil do-ers won't prevail.
Use it against them... Freedom of speed you know? So Merry CHRISTmas!
But MERRY CHRISTMAS
And happy new year!
Its early I know.
Let them attack it! If you continue to call the season by its CORRECT name the evil do-ers won't prevail.
Use it against them... Freedom of speed you know? So Merry CHRISTmas!
And and thank you SP7m! Finally some one that knows america was founded on CHRISTIAN BELIEFS AND WAYS OF LIFE.
Christmas happens in this time of the year...Now people are being told to say "Happy Holidays and not merry christmas...
Its everywhere...tv..magazines...radio..
People always have to complain about other people's religious beliefs and traditions. I bet if you go to a dominantly Muslim country or communist country (I have nothing against them) they would not change the names of some important tradition or religious event for the lesser population.
I thought when you reside in another country other than your homeland you can enjoy your own traditions and also enjoy the country's traditions instead of bitching bout it. What will they want to change next? Who knows...
Cheers,
Roy
Its everywhere...tv..magazines...radio..
People always have to complain about other people's religious beliefs and traditions. I bet if you go to a dominantly Muslim country or communist country (I have nothing against them) they would not change the names of some important tradition or religious event for the lesser population.
I thought when you reside in another country other than your homeland you can enjoy your own traditions and also enjoy the country's traditions instead of bitching bout it. What will they want to change next? Who knows...
Cheers,
Roy