Lets say for the sake of discussion that IT IS a 2JZ block (which he insists it is NOT) He STILL MADE ALOT MORE POWER with NO NITROUS!!!!!!!!!!!!
842 RWHP 1.5JZ at Orlando Supra Meet
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porsches4lunch said:
Thats pretty crazy I saw him a year or 2 ago at one of the supra meets he had a 2jz in the car with lots of spray he was spinning on the dyno it was crazy.
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porsches4lunch said:
i'd be interested on the setup, since that;s the hight hp 74mm car i have ever seen. what kind of turbo was that. what are the supporting mods?
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2jzmk3 said:
That ALOT of folks don't make that MUCH power WITH spray AND a 2JZ Block and heads.
2jzmk3 said:
call Happy and ask him, i don't know the details. It is however a CUSTOM built turbo specifically for that customer, not an off the shelf unit. If you would like one built for your specific setup call us and we will make one for you.
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MK3Brent said:1.5JZ right?
whoops, someone changed the title already.
Someone who apparently didn't like what i was saying :biglaugh:
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porsches4lunch said:
no thats alright, that kinda stuff doesnt keep me up at night. and thanks for the offer, but i have seen what you have to do to get your turbos to fit.
wuts wrong with their turbos sean, not trying to be sarcastic at all. just really wanna genuinly know what the problem is with them.2jzmk3 said:
2jzmk3 said:
Yea Sean, what's wrong with our turbos? I would be HAPPY to put up one of our turbos against anything Turbonetics or Precision has. And i am sure you have seen what they do AFTER you get them to fit huh
I changed the title, If it has a 2J bottom end it is a 2J period.MK3Brent said:1.5JZ right?
whoops, someone changed the title already.
Nope, it's not.MK3Brent said:
Duane
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porsches4lunch said:Yea Sean, what's wrong with our turbos? I would be HAPPY to put up one of our turbos against anything Turbonetics or Precision has. And i am sure you have seen what they do AFTER you get them to fit huh
i am not saying anything bad about your turbos. im just not a fan of banging the shock tower, shaving the compressor cover to clear the runners and cutting to hood to make a turbo fit... the turbo makes power, thats not a question.
well no i havent seen what they can do after they fit.. i have never seen one on a car that would make a clean pass, Happys car didnt rev out on the dyno, he let out at like 7500 rpms. it did make sick power at 7500 rpms, but i dont know the actual size of his turbo or any of the specs of his entire setup or even how much of boost he was running on that pull. i know what he has done, but they are to many variables as you already know.
i can go by what i have seen. and with darins 75mm BW custom turbo, it made about 200hp less that when he had the PRE 76gts on there.
but class rules limited him to that, so thats what he run.
he broke just as many BW as he did the PRE. i dont think the problem lies with the turbo, i just dont think they like being put on the 2step all the time, crazy timing and making 40+ psi all the time.
i am no turbo expert, but i am also not clueless, as i do work in the industry.
AGAIN, i am not downing your turbo's, turbo systems, or anything.. im just not cutting up my car to get one to fit. i rather lose 30whp, and leave it the way it is...
borg wheels are claimed to be engineered for higher pressure ratios than traditionally seen in the past years. at least, thats what they claim their "extended tip" technology is for. i mean, i beleive it... the old PTE/SP 71GTQ with the S372 compressor wheel is supposed to sustain higher PR's w/o failing. you know, cuz of that 5-axis cnc'd billet compressor wheel.
did darin lose turbos because of overspeeding the turbine wheels or what? its probably cuz of the 2-step eh?
did darin lose turbos because of overspeeding the turbine wheels or what? its probably cuz of the 2-step eh?
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porsches4lunch said:Yea Sean, what's wrong with our turbos? I would be HAPPY to put up one of our turbos against anything Turbonetics or Precision has. And i am sure you have seen what they do AFTER you get them to fit huh
I don't think Sean was necessarily speaking badly of the turbos. They are however significantly larger than the opposing T series Turbonetics or Precision PT Series units. As Sean noted, we essentially back-to-backed an S400SX 75mm and a PT76-GTS. Kurt et. all at BW were pretty confident we were going to blow the 76 out of the water in terms of horsepower but it wasn't the case.
Sean was a bit mistaken about losing that much horsepower with Darin's car, the seemed to be actually remarkably similar in terms of power production. The performance issue comes down to reliability. I don't know if the S400SX lineup is still coming with the 270* thrust that the BW lineup is infamous for - it's like pulling teeth to get information out of BW in a timely fashion, but the lack of reliability on this unit was unacceptable. This is one of BW's first stabs at a "shelf-stock" performance oriented unit (a la Garrett GT) and is a good turbo, but it does not necessarily take the throne as the Alpha and Omega of hair dryers.
If BW/Airwerks will finally step up to the plate with some BB units, especially in their S3 and S4 chassis, and some more suitable turbine-to-compressor combinations, then it will be a stout lineup. Sadly right now the industry is very limited on what it can get from BW, with the few players in the game normally having to resort to custom units which build more price and lead time into getting their cars together.
That said, I'm a big proponent of the ETT BW wheels, the billet 71mm is an amazing performer, as shown by the S400SX models with the 83.5mm turbine they come with and the PT71-GTS which uses the same BW wheel mated to the 82mm GT42 turbine.
Moral of the story is each turbocharger manufacturer has some stout units, and some that should have never been created. We had a Turbonetics Super 72 car that made amazing power with great all around charactersitics and most in the industry know T-netics customer service sets them apart from most. The PT71-GTQ made incredible power because of the BW wheel, but would cook the bearing out of it by leaning on the boost control solenoid just a hair. A friend went through six in a season. The GT3582R is one of the best all around turbos you can buy. The Mitsubishi-GReddy T88 is not only one of the most durable turbos you'll ever put on a car, but it also makes very stout power for a 69mm
The list goes on and on with every brand. That's why I choose to sell pretty much all of them.
Alright guys, gotta get back to work.Regards,
Mark Conte
Real Street Performance
407.695.0699
PS - Hong is that you? Good to hear from you buddy. Hope the business is going well.
2jzmk3 said:I don't think Sean was necessarily speaking badly of the turbos. They are however significantly larger than the opposing T series Turbonetics or Precision PT Series units. As Sean noted, we essentially back-to-backed an S400SX 75mm and a PT76-GTS. Kurt et. all at BW were pretty confident we were going to blow the 76 out of the water in terms of horsepower but it wasn't the case.
Sean was a bit mistaken about losing that much horsepower with Darin's car, the seemed to be actually remarkably similar in terms of power production. The performance issue comes down to reliability. I don't know if the S400SX lineup is still coming with the 270* thrust that the BW lineup is infamous for - it's like pulling teeth to get information out of BW in a timely fashion, but the lack of reliability on this unit was unacceptable. This is one of BW's first stabs at a "shelf-stock" performance oriented unit (a la Garrett GT) and is a good turbo, but it does not necessarily take the throne as the Alpha and Omega of hair dryers.
If BW/Airwerks will finally step up to the plate with some BB units, especially in their S3 and S4 chassis, and some more suitable turbine-to-compressor combinations, then it will be a stout lineup. Sadly right now the industry is very limited on what it can get from BW, with the few players in the game normally having to resort to custom units which build more price and lead time into getting their cars together.
That said, I'm a big proponent of the ETT BW wheels, the billet 71mm is an amazing performer, as shown by the S400SX models with the 83.5mm turbine they come with and the PT71-GTS which uses the same BW wheel mated to the 82mm GT42 turbine.
Moral of the story is each turbocharger manufacturer has some stout units, and some that should have never been created. We had a Turbonetics Super 72 car that made amazing power with great all around charactersitics and most in the industry know T-netics customer service sets them apart from most. The PT71-GTQ made incredible power because of the BW wheel, but would cook the bearing out of it by leaning on the boost control solenoid just a hair. A friend went through six in a season. The GT3582R is one of the best all around turbos you can buy. The Mitsubishi-GReddy T88 is not only one of the most durable turbos you'll ever put on a car, but it also makes very stout power for a 69mm
The list goes on and on with every brand. That's why I choose to sell pretty much all of them.
Regards,
Mark Conte
Real Street Performance
407.695.0699
PS - Hong is that you? Good to hear from you buddy. Hope the business is going well.
We have over 10 customers who have switched from Precision and Mitsubishi to BW because of reliability. NONE of these customers have had ANY issues with their BW units. The Precision units, were having terrible quality issues (two of them locked up on the dyno on two different cars. Those turbos were BRAND NEW from Precision). These same two customers, one with a MKIV and one with a Mitsubishi Eclipse have pushed their cars to NEW RWHP levels with NO issues with the Turbos. Also, we have these turbos on several Rotary Race cars running two steps and NONE have failed as a direct result of the turbo!!! These rotary cars routinely see OVER 50 PSI of boost and the Turbos STILL TAKE IT!!!! I also have Several race customers who have switched from Precision to BW and have become immediate fans. The only turbo i would recommend OVER this turbo to any customer is a Garrett. I guess different folks have had different experiences with these Turbos.
PS- No Dan, i work WITH Hong and Mike.
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porsches4lunch said:
Dan, I'm glad the units have worked for you, I have no issues with BWA, I'm still putting a hybrid I'm piecing together on my own car. That said, I can only go by what I have seen, and the BW units that I have been around have had unacceptable failures. You may be confusing 2 step with antilag. Anti-lag is violent and can injure a turbo, especially a journal bearing turbo very easily. If my turbo fails, I'll be putting on a Garrett Ball Bearing unit.
I have seen reliability issues with precision as well. As I noted in my previous post, a friend going through six in a season does not inspire confidence. However on the car that Sean spoke of, our PTE-76 made equal or better power, and lived longer...twice over. (about 20-30 passes each for the PT76, about 10-15 passes each for the S400SX) I've had problems with brand new Garrett product too. I had one of the first GT5533Rs in the country and when I put it on the chip in the pits it decided to dislocate the exhaust wheel from the shaft. Mind you Garrett actually gave me a new unit after this, something that you will almost NEVER see in a race application.
/Mark
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