Won't start 'til cooled off

Satan

Supramania Contributor
Mar 31, 2005
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I could've sworn I started a thread about this, but can't seem to find it now.

Problem,
On hot days (~80), after driving for awhile, my car won't start. I'll stop at the gas station or whatever (after driving just fine)... car won't start 'til it's cooled off a bit (15-20 minutes). Real problem... Spring/Summer are here and this will begin to be a REAL issue.

Anyways,
I did not have the issue with my 87T and am wondering what anyone's done, that will fix it for sure. I guess it's the heatsoak issue that others have had, but I don't know how to fix. I was told to put a turbotimer on and that would likely fix it (which is a good idea to have one anyways), but until then.... what else?

P.S.
No real mods yet... intake and 3" elbow/exhaust...

E
 
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MK3Brent

Very expensive....
Aug 1, 2005
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Hmm. Try running an ign-switched 12v source straight to the fuel pump.

There was a <resistor?> problem with RX7 (FC's) that did this too, but I've never had an issue with my supra.
 

GrimJack

Administrator
Dec 31, 1969
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From Reg's site @ http://www.suprasonic.org/public_html/sonictech/mk3/mk3_pmtn.html:

On a warm day, when restarting the engine, as when leaving a gas station or coffee shop after a short visit, the 7M-GE and 7M-GTE engines may exhibit weak idling, hard starting and putting around at 500 rpm for a short period. If this happens only very occasionally it is perfectly normal and is caused by a condition called HEAT SOAK, which happens, after shutting off the engine. After shutdown the water pump and fan are no longer cooling the engine so the heat from inside the engine comes out into to engine bay cooking everything in its way, EFI sensors say "Wako sure is hot in here," gasoline in the fuel rail on the intake manifold is boiled {not to mention a host of other thermodynamic conditions that occur after shutdown}. All Engineering levels are taxed.

To combat this inherit EFI {Electronic Fuel Injection} problem a number factory installed electronic and mechanical engine control systems are used, but under certain conditions they fail to correct the problem completely. For the most part EFI is a wonderful system allowing great fuel economy and silky smooth drive ability so a small bug like HEAT SOAK is still a more livable end than going back to carbs. If this rough idling symptom is happening more often than seems normal there may be a problem with one or more of the following: Cold start injector time switch, Bad Fuel, Throttle position sensor, Plugged or restricted fuel filter or gas cap, Idle speed solenoid air valve (ISC Valve), Fuel pressure, 2 speed fuel pump system, Head Gasket, Air intake leaks, Engine mechanical, Fuel pressure up VSV {vacuum switching valve}.

Other points to remember about the idle speed control valve (ISC valve) are: After shutting of the engine you should here a faint clicking sound for a short time after the engine is killed, this is normal operation.

Unplug the wire at the ISC valve after the valve makes its normal clicking noise after engine is shut off, will cause the engine to run in high idle when the engine is restarted. This is a good sign that the ISC valve is working correctly.

When E1 & T1 in the check connector (Diag Block) are shorted, this will cause the valve to go to a standard closed position. This is the first step in setting the curb idle and ignition timing.

Failure of the ISC valve is not a common problem, what should be checked is the seat section of the valve that sits in the intake manifold. When the ISC valve is removed, this seat will remain in the hole in the intake manifold. This seat valve will get sticky and not work smoothly due to excess carbon and deposits in the intake manifold.

The Bardal Super Tune kit comes with a can of gunk for the fuel tank and a can of gunk to be slowly sucked into the intake manifold while the engine is running at high idle. This gunk stuff works great. Also included in the Bardal super tune kit is a can of gunk that is sprayed into the intake plumbing, and throttle body. Spray this gunk into the airline going into the idle speed control valve. Presto changeo the valve will most often work fine again. Wins also makes a good fuel injection cleaning kit that works wonders as well. The Wynns kit does not have the can of gunk spray, but it does a great job on the injectors and intake manifold.

When the VSV for fuel pressure up is working correctly it allows the fuel pressure regulator to receive atmospheric air pressure to its vacuum port when the engine is hot. To test this VSV you can unplug the vacuum line from the fuel pressure regulator and start the car to see if the vehicle starts normally. If it does the fuel pressure up VSV is the problem.
 

Satan

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Mar 31, 2005
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Idealsupra said:
check and test the fuel vsv under the intake manifold...its there for hot starts..... if its broken or malfunctioning it could cause the problem you are describing....

You say that like it's easy or sumthin' :(

I hate that Fing VSV!!!! I may just reroute the vacuum and install a spare VSV where it actually makes sense :naughty:

Lots of good info.... I read that heat soak thing many, many years ago... I shoulda paid attention, but at the time "it wasn't my problem."

Thanx guys... even more work to do now, before Wednesday (depart for TX2K6).


BTW: Aren't there 2 VSVs under the intake manifold? Is it the front one (behind the alernator, or that other beeeeyotch above the starter? THANX!
 
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Idealsupra

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Satan said:
You say that like it's easy or sumthin' :(

I hate that Fing VSV!!!! I may just reroute the vacuum and install a spare VSV where it actually makes sense :naughty:

Lots of good info.... I read that heat soak thing many, many years ago... I shoulda paid attention, but at the time "it wasn't my problem."

Thanx guys... even more work to do now, before Wednesday (depart for TX2K6).


BTW: Aren't there 2 VSVs under the intake manifold? Is it the front one (behind the alernator, or that other beeeeyotch above the starter? THANX!

the fuel one is in the front by the alt.... and ill see ya at tx2k6 mang :D
 
Apr 6, 2005
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Alpharetta, GA
Does the engine crank, but the car won't start or does it not crank at all?

Satan said:
......
Problem,
On hot days (~80), after driving for awhile, my car won't start. I'll stop at the gas station or whatever (after driving just fine)... car won't start 'til it's cooled off a bit (15-20 minutes). Real problem...
 

jmcboost

New Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Missouri
I had a similar problem also. Mine was cured by a faulty Main or ECU relay. It would get hot and would not switch. I replaced it with a different one and problem solved. Mine would would turn over but not fire up.
 

Satan

Supramania Contributor
Mar 31, 2005
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Engine turns over... Just won't start. 10, 15, 20 minutes later... it just starts right up, llike there's no problem.

I'll swap that front VSV since it shoul dbe easy enuff... no time for troubleshooting (when spare parts are available). I'll have to look at all that other stuff at some point, I'm sure.
 

GrimJack

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Troubleshooting that front VSV is EASY. Just wait until the engine has cooled after running for a bit - 30-60min should do the trick - pop the hood and pull the vacuum line off the FPR, right beside the oil cap.

Then try to start the car. If it starts easy, the VSV is toast.

Put the vacuum line back on after it starts. :)
 

jkendall86

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Apr 10, 2005
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I know this thread is a bit old, but I have seen a lot of threads related to this....check your coil pack for the right resistance once it dies. If it does not register, it is bad...I had this problem. Took it to a dealer and he wanted $800 for an igniter, and that wasn;t even the problem. Mine would die when hot, and it got worse with time, took longer to restart. Once I found the bad coil, happened to be #1, replaced it and have had no problem since. This was at the beginning of June 05.....hope this helps.