Upper mount questions?

[prsrcokr]

Can anyone verify what spring diameters will work with various upper mounts?

Stock springs and springs designed to work with OEM mounts are tapered to ~3.25" ID to match the OEM mounts (these have an inner cup that will not allow straight 2.5" / 2.75" springs to line up. I'm wondering what diameter springs can be used with various (Tein and HKS are the only I've found) upper mounts? Does anyone know this?
I don't want to spend more money on a chance these might or might not work with 2.5 - 2.75" springs.

To those with coilover setups, are they all using constant dia. springs or are they tapered as well? (my thinking that you could find replacement springs in standard sizes if they're constant dia, not tapered like stock)
I've had a tough time finding tapered springs.

Thanks,
Brian

 

[Wiisass]

So you want to use stock upper mounts? Or you want to get Tein of HKS upper mounts?

You can use normal spring hats for 2.5" ID coil springs on stock rear mounts, the front mounts are a little different and you could try some things, but using rear upper mounts in the front would probably be a better option. Or Mk4 front upper mounts, I think will work, but I don't know who sells them or if they're available.

Just make the rest of the setup right, so you can use normal springs. It will work out better than trying to find tapered springs.

 

[prsrcokr]

Thanks for the help. I'd use stock mounts for now if possible but I don't think it will work. Looks like the 'cups' on the bottom of the mounts are, rear ~3.125" and fronts ~3.75" so they wouldn't fit over standard springs. The fronts look like the 'cups' could be easily cut off (3 tack welds), are those really necessary? (Looks like they're in place to keep spring concentric on shock)

I was wondering if aftermarket upper mounts (Tein, HKS, etc) will work with any dia. spring (like 2.5-2.75") or only specific diameters like stock.

Brian

 

[supraguru05]

sorry i forgot to pm you cokr about my setup. i finished my bilstein setup. used a1racing top spring mounts and just let them sit into the cups on the rear using a big spacer i made and let them sit on the rubber dome on the front mounts. this forced me to use a 8inch spring in the back instead of the 10 you originally had. also the front spring could be a little shorter i think you sent me a 8 but thats mainly due to the reuse of the top mounts. ill take some pictures sofar the setup works and hasnt broken a mount yet. real test is at putnam in 2 weeks with the 275 ra1s on.

the 400lb spring in the back feels a bit stiff I have lowered my sway bar setting to help a little but on my azenis the car rotates ill say different havent decided if its worse or better yet.

we really need to get some custom mounts made because the factory mounts make me lose alot of spring length and force me to run the spring collar way down on the sleeves

 

[Wiisass]

Brian,

I don't know what size springs aftermarket mounts will work with. It might fit on 2.5" coil springs or they might be sized weird. See if you can find someone that has them in stock and give them a call.

Or just use stock rear mounts in both the front and rear and get a spring hat that will sit inside that cup, it should work fine that way. I mean it's definitely not the best option, but you could do worse. And I don't think the front even has any type of cup, at least the upper mounts I have don't. I thought the top of the spring just sat right against the flat part on the upper mount, maybe I'm wrong though, it's been a while since I looked at them.

Supraguru,

I know someone that makes custom mounts for the supra.

And what springs are you running in the front with the 400 rear?

 

[supraguru05]

850 fronts. which seem pretty good, they prevent alot of the dive i had on the eibacs. but autocross is a different animal then the nasa races i do so ill have to wait until this nasa race to know how nuetral the car really is. how much does the guy charge for the mounts because i really could use some esp in the back which is the side im most worried about failing.

and as far as the front mounts they have a 1 inch buldge in the middle that guides the ID of the factory spring. my spring sides into a hat that sits on this buldge

 

[prsrcokr]

Iv'e confirmed that the Tein mounts will not work with sleeve over type coils (using 2.5" ID springs)
The Tein mounts have a ~3" spacer at the bottom which will work with stock type springs but will not allow smaller dia. springs to seat against the underside of the mount.

It looks like the top hat with a sleeve over setup may be able to sit against the bottom of the mount but it's not a perfect fit. Anyone know if there are 2.75" top hats out there or something else?
Still don't see how anyone will be able to use 2.5" springs on the mk3 as the stock and Tein mounts don't accomodate these.
Brian

 

[supraguru05]

lol guess i need to get you some pictures. just ran my setup at putnam and ignoring the blown diff i ran a 1:22 which is ok i would have liked to have gotten under a 1:20 but the diff just wouldnt let me put any power down. my setup didnt break but its far from ideal but it works for now. ill get pictures tommorrow hopefully when im switching out rear springs

 

[prsrcokr]

Pics would be helpful, I can see how the spring hat(?) could be used between the spring and mount but it doesn't have a flush surface with the bottom of the mount either.

I've seen several sleeve kits offered lately but can't see how they're coming together. My springs would be a little larger (2.75") but the 2.5" hats may work if they can mount to the upper mounts.

Thought about a Torsen? I used to have problems with diffs going out (slipping, sometimes can be corrected at least temporarily by replacing fluid) but I really like the Torsens.

 

[supraguru05]

welp i spoke to soon. i had the car rather high up at the road course and didnt notice any issues but when i went to autocross this weekend i lowered the car to really where it needs to be and have almost no suspension stroke because of the factory mounts and the way i have them rigged. im going to make some custom mounts in the off season but i still will probably only have a inch or a little more of travel when i have the car at the height i run. the bilsteins are just to tall and there is no easy way to lower and get more stroke other than running thin upper mounts which is my plan now. also ive switched from the 400lb rears down to 350lb rear. this helps the car in bump and has allowed me to put my rear sway bar back on the higher setting for roll resistance. ill get pictures tommorrow morning since ill finally have a day without a test in school and show you the suspension stroke problems.


i did manage a 1.22 on stoke boost at putnam tho on cold tires. im pretty proud of that

 

[Wiisass]

It's not because of the factory mounts. It's because the off the shelf damper body is too tall. There's only 4" of stroke on the front dampers, and you can't get the car to the right height without bottoming out the damper before you even start driving. If you're serious about the suspension, you'll ditch the front dampers for something else. Or just talk to me and I can get you set up with something and it doesn't necessarily mean that it will be expensive, there are lots of options out there.

 

[supraguru05]

front and rear respectivly. as you can see in the front the bulge in the middle of the upper mount is taking at least a inch of travel away from me. by making a flat upper mount with a spherical bearing in the middle i can get some of that travel back. in the back ive got a little more travel but the flat mounts will still buy me some travel. so thats my plan this off season. also need to get bump stops as im pretty sure ive already bottomed the two front shocks and probably blown them. i need to have them revalved anyway.

 

[prsrcokr]

That's the problem I'm running into with mine, you lose some travel because the spring hat with solid or stock mounts add ~1.25" inch to the setup. If you could place an upper mount at the top of the spring, you'd close that gap. I've asked the seller of some ebay upper mounts about the bottom of those. If someone made a flat bottom or smaller OD ring on the underside of upper mounts, you could use them with 2.5" through stock springs.

 

[supraguru05]

my plan is to just take some 6061 round stock cut it to like .5 in thick. turn down the bottom to get the 2.5 od for the spring to seat on. and then press in a spherical bearing in the middle for the shock top to center on and then put a nut on top and be done. the total thickness of this mount would only be like .25in which would give me a ton of travel left. ill make 3d models of this next week.