Trying to get 500RWTQ holding on stock pressure plate

[Zazzn]

I'm looking for experiences on clutches for the R154.

So I've been though many clutches in my day and i haven't found the right combo yet.

Having started with the RPS 3200 dual diaphragm (RPS MAX) pressure plate / 6 puck ceramic disk it never slipped... Ever... However, it simply broke transmissions, because all the shock went to the drive-train and transmission.

Next I tried making it shift softer by adding a full face kevlar disk to the RPS MAX Pressure plate. It held static load (meaning in gear punch it) but could not handle launching or if it was heated up though a 1/4 pass.

The next issues I ran into after swapping in a 2jz was breaking straps on the RPS MAX pressure plate, my theory is the added weight of the second diaphragm and the extra revs from the JZ engines stress the diaphragm too much causing it to break straps. (strangely though it never happened on the 1jz)

Knowing that the extra pressure on the pressure plate causes crankwalk as well, I opted to try to use a stock pressure plate but this time with a 6 puck fermaic disk, so far this has been holding up with my stock twins on my 2jz @ 430rwhp/435tq but it cannot hold fast shifts or launching (dynamic load)

I'd like to know if anyone has been able to hold 500TQ on a stock pressure plate and if so what combo did you use for the disk? I'm trying NOT to increase the pressure plate pressure as I want a soft clutch pedal and I do not want to ware my thrust bearings prematurely.


Any suggestions?

Thanks,

 

[gsxr141]

i'm sure others will chime in with the same answer....... you'll probably have to go twin disc.
I don't think the stock pp will hold more that 400 or so hp.

 

[Alec]

My Clutchmasters FX400 uses a very very light pressure plate, which is most likely just a rebuilt stock one. Pedal feel is as light as stock, possibly lighter.

My car makes in the neighborhood of 700wtq without issue

 

[emericaskater285]

cant say it will hold for sure, but ive always had good luck with act xtreme clutches. i love them, and will always buy them for my cars besides my white one which i am going twin or triple disc in (havent decided yet). I would only do sprung, unsprung clutches are for track cars only imo, and shock the drivetrain much more. As far as I know, the act xtreme is the highest rated single disc clutch for 7m's. (not sure about 2j's)

at 500tq you are probably going to want to step it up to a multi plate clutch setup anyways, also ive always done the recommended 500 mile break in on my clutches, and have had good luck, and no slipping at all (just under 500hp & just under 450tq). the only downside is the clutches don't last too long, at least with my driving. I tend to drag the clutch off the line when racing to spool harder/faster, and not bog.

 

[Zazzn]

My Clutchmasters FX400 uses a very very light pressure plate, which is most likely just a rebuilt stock one. Pedal feel is as light as stock, possibly lighter.

My car makes in the neighborhood of 700wtq without issue

So wait a second, I only see a W58 version on DM. Where you pick it up from?

 

[gsxr141]

i have the act extreme pp with full face disc. it's supposed to be good to like 600lbs. I haven't been on the dyno, but based on my trap speed and my tuner's but dyno i'm near that.
I got 2 runs in at the track before the clutch slipped. strangely, it doesn't slip on theh road, but does smell pulling away in first.
i'm thinking about going spec twin disc, but i'm open to othersuggestions.

 

[Zazzn]

Yeah, remember, I'm on stock twins so that should do me well... How is the engagement smooth? Can it be slipped?

Do you have the full face disk or the 6 puck disk?

 

[Alec]

So wait a second, I only see a W58 version on DM. Where you pick it up from?

http://www.spracingonline.com/store...FX400_STREET_Clutch_kit_R154_MKIII_Supra/3778

 

[Zazzn]

So an update, believe it or not, I believe my original clutch was holding, i just think that the disk is worn. It's started to make metal on metal noises recently.

Going to have to inspect it to see what is going on.

George @ raptor was using Fermaic and stock pressure plate with others to hold over 500 WHP as well apparently.


Found my dyno from wayback, I believe i'm making more torque and HP now as I'm running a boost controller to make the boost come on faster, and also adding a bunch more timing though the use of 50/50 mix of E85.

 

[GC89]

Which 6 puck disk were you running, I didn't see where you mentioned a brand.

 

[Zazzn]

The one I'm running is not sold by raptor, but just ask him for a 6 puck fermaic he can get you one. The one I got was from a local shop in Toronto Canada, I think i paid like 200 canadian for just the disk, I paid 100 for a asian original pressure plate from another shop and I have a Gripforce moly flywheel.

 

[black89t]

i cant really see the and stock pressure plate holding 500wtq unless you just do highway pulls. even then though if you like to brake boost its gonna rape that clutch. and drag racing would kill it even faster. its worth a try though i guess for just 300 bucks. let us know how it holds up. i had an action 6 puck from dm before i got my os giken twin and it held up pretty good with my hx35 but not on the s363. it was pretty old by then though but its not rated over 500 i dont think. i decided to go for the twin then if i want to turn it up more i don't have to worry about my clutch slipping. plus it drives much smoother. theres zero chatter.

 

[Zazzn]

Currently I can break boost, without it breaking...

 

[Nick M]

Having started with the RPS 3200 dual diaphragm (RPS MAX) pressure plate / 6 puck ceramic disk it never slipped... Ever... However, it simply broke transmissions, because all the shock went to the drive-train and transmission.

That isn't right. Is height adjustable? I hardly deal with clutches anymore because Americans are...Americans.

(strangely though it never happened on the 1jz)

Actually, it isn't that strange and makes sense.

I'd like to know if anyone has been able to hold 500TQ on a stock pressure plate and if so what combo did you use for the disk? I'm trying NOT to increase the pressure plate pressure as I want a soft clutch pedal and I do not want to ware my thrust bearings prematurely.

Sadly, we don't have the aftermarket support that the Mustang and Camaro community have.

 

[Alec]

My car makes in the neighborhood of 6-700wtq and I brake boost the shit out of my FX400 and it's still holding strong. That's also with sticky R888 tires

 

[black89t]

^thats crazy i can't believe you've had such great luck with that fx400 its awesome! if it can hold up to drag racing then id say thats the best option out there for a r154 car for power holding vs price. doing a burnout to heat tires then clutch slip for launch then pulling through all 4 gears is hard as hell on it though thats when i got my 6 puck to slip with the hx35. im putting a line lock on my car this winter though so the brake drag doesn't put so much heat in the clutch and some other things gonna go for 10's on the 7m ecu not sure if anyone has done it yet :biglaugh:

 

[Zazzn]

Is what height adjustable? If you mean can I adjust the clutch pedal engagement, yes, it's a stock pressure plate with a second diaphragm.

What does Americans being american have to do with anything?

Also, why isn't it strange that the straps didn't blow on the 1jz? Fully, unhelpful your answer there.

Agree, dozens of mk3's left, vs thousands of mustangs all over, but that doesn't change the fact that most of the clutch combo's are just variations of materials on the disks and pressure clamping power, which shouldn't make it any different. I remember back in the day my buddy loved his centerforce dual friction clutch, but I don't think i know of another supra owner running on. The only issue he had was it didn't last very long.

 

[Alec]

^thats crazy i can't believe you've had such great luck with that fx400 its awesome! if it can hold up to drag racing then id say thats the best option out there for a r154 car for power holding vs price. doing a burnout to heat tires then clutch slip for launch then pulling through all 4 gears is hard as hell on it though thats when i got my 6 puck to slip with the hx35. im putting a line lock on my car this winter though so the brake drag doesn't put so much heat in the clutch and some other things gonna go for 10's on the 7m ecu not sure if anyone has done it yet :biglaugh:

I would not suggest drag racing on anything other than a twin/triple disk over 500wtq

 

[Nick M]

Is what height adjustable?

Clutch height. The release point is the height.

If you mean can I adjust the clutch pedal engagement, yes

No.

What does Americans being american have to do with anything?

Americans don't buy manual transmission cars anymore, and the manual trans clutch is not serviced very often as a result. So I would have to think about it for a minute.

Also, why isn't it strange that the straps didn't blow on the 1jz?

Torque is a function of bore and stroke, including when it peaks.

Agree, dozens of mk3's left, vs thousands of mustangs all over, but that doesn't change the fact that most of the clutch combo's are just variations of materials on the disks and pressure clamping power, which shouldn't make it any different. I remember back in the day my buddy loved his centerforce dual friction clutch, but I don't think i know of another supra owner running on. The only issue he had was it didn't last very long.

Back in the day, I saw plenty of the Centerforce clutches not last long. So, yeah.

 

[Zazzn]

Just it's adjustable.. The strangest thing happens with this clutch. I always though it had air in my slave, because when the clutch got warmer/hot the engagement point always moved way high. when it's cold it engages mid way, and slips really really nice. When hot, it doesn't slip at all and chatters pretty bad off a stop light.

I've bled the clutch at least 5-6 times over 4-5 years trying to get the air if there was any in the system. Maybe i'll give it one more bleed and adjust the engagement lower, and see if it still slips when hot. (not many miles over 4-5 years so yeah it's not that I believe it's worn) I just swapped out my worn 275/45/18's for a set of 275/30/19 and car still blows off 2nd so hard it hits rev Limit. I really really am enjoying stock twins damn. (at least mine) and clutch still holding, just like I said dynamic load (fast shifts, launches = slip until I get out of it and back on it)