Top Gear Episode Idea... Best EVER Japanese GT Cars from pre-2000

[mk1spyder]

Ya MK3 is not a track car. I raced at 24hoursoflemons and saw Kyle Busch try to race a gutted caged built MK3 with a single turbo VVT-i 1JZ (he was penalized 6,800 laps for cheating over the $500 btw lol). It still didn't hold a candle to miatas, hondas, subarus, mitsubishis, and RX-7's on a tight course. Now a long wide swept corner high speed course, yes, it would murder people.

The RX-7's were so funny though, all FC's, and when they came off the trailers and fired up instantly you could tell they had ALOT of cheater money in the engines. Old rotaries dont start that fast, nor do they sound like a cracked out diesel due to being bridge ported. But alas they all started to smoke and proceeded to blow up around lap 100 lol.

Our lexus ES-250 with the 2VZ-FE that I found in a field with 170k stock did great until the stock clutch finally let go.


And we all know that if you can't have something you want it more, the McRib sandwich, hot girls that are a tease, etc.... and no i'm not fat, but you get my point lol. Now that the skyline is here and anyone that wants to finance it can have one, its like psshhh whatever. Where's the supra?

 

[te72]

The RX-7's were so funny though, all FC's, and when they came off the trailers and fired up instantly you could tell they had ALOT of cheater money in the engines. Old rotaries dont start that fast, nor do they sound like a cracked out diesel due to being bridge ported. But alas they all started to smoke and proceeded to blow up around lap 100 lol.

Our lexus ES-250 with the 2VZ-FE that I found in a field with 170k stock did great until the stock clutch finally let go.


And we all know that if you can't have something you want it more, the McRib sandwich, hot girls that are a tease, etc.... and no i'm not fat, but you get my point lol. Now that the skyline is here and anyone that wants to finance it can have one, its like psshhh whatever. Where's the supra?

How is bridge porting cheating? Isn't it the same idea of porting a head on a piston engine? All you're doing is taking away material that Mazda put there, not adding anything...

And a Lexus with a clutch? Blasphemy! That's like a Cadillac with a clutch... oh wait. Nevermind.

As for bringing back the Supra... as much as I'd love to see it revived, I think some things should just be left alone. Look at modern 'revival' cars. Name one that wasn't an embarrassment to it's predecessor. Skyline got fat. Camaro got fat. Challenger got fatter. A modern Supra, with the constraints of modern pedestrian and passenger safety laws would probably weigh 4500lbs and look like a turd. If it somehow managed to get to production without being fat and ugly, it would cost more than all but possibly a couple members on here could hope to afford in the next 10 years.

 

[Poodles]

Honestly, the LF-A is the closest thing we have to a Supra. The styling elements are obvious.

 

[Wildfire007]

Hey can anyone link me to this youtube video with those GT cars? I tried finding it and couldn't.

 

[mk1spyder]

Yes the FJ cruiser was terrible, all the muscle cars suck, the FT-S will be even gayer. But Toyota has enough money to do anything they want, look at the LF-A. A guy can have hopes ya know lol.

It's not the bridge port itself thats cheating, it's that there is no way in hell you only spent $500 to build a race ported rotary engine (the cost includes value of parts even if you already own them).

 

[TRDownShift]

so wait... they go by the "value" of any parts on the car... even if said parts CAME with the car wen you bought it? Like say I found an old MKI MR2 S/C with a boost controller and a few other things, but they sold me the car for 400 with a BHG because there done messing with it... so i run to vatozone and pick up a SUPER cheap gasket kit and only the bear minimum needed to do that cars head gasket and I do the work myself... there still going to add up the over all value of the car?... thats kinda makes me feel like it's geared toward only thoughs who have had a 85 5.0 mustang sitting in there back yard for a year... >.>.....

 

[Poodles]

lemons racing is odd

 

[mk1spyder]

No it's geared towards RICH people in the off-season. Tons of nascar drivers do it, everyone there had MILLIONS in their RV's, trailers, tools, spare tires, they had like 3 entire spare cars to jack parts off of. Because after they judge you initially, you can swap whatever you want onto it in the night and they don't check it again. Plus it is just a popularity contest with the judges. I saw a 67' chevrolet truck get in with a LS6 and no penalty points because they had great costumes and were funny guys, but the F'in radiator cost more than $500.

It is just SCCA with more humor, it is all a big game to see who can cheat their way in. The judges just look over your car and give it their "perceived" value. Doesn't matter how much you paid for anything.

They took one look at the ES250 (most were 5-speeds) and waived it through, they said it was the first one they'd ever seen enter and that it was gonna hecka blow up. Which it didn't. 2VZ is a crap engine but for some reason ours held in there. 2.5L of doom baby. Then the judges took another look at it going by and stopped us because they saw it was a 5-speed. Talked about it for a bit, thought we had done a serious swap or something, and I showed them the owners manual, they let it roll on at that point no penalties. I'll post a pic if I get a chance.

 

[terrenceLP]

Don't think so fast that a Skyline will eat up the MKIII - as noted Nissan build quality is crap outside of the Pathfinder late 80's - 2003, so an older mostly stock skyline might as well be a POS. And the new one is straight up price gouging! Fuck them turds at American Corporation of Nissan, I hope they bomb and fail massively.

The LFA is NOT THE NEXT SUPRA! First because it's a Lexus, as Hammond would say, 2nd because somewhere in the late 90's Toyota got their balls cut off for profit. So to say a Real 5 Gen Supra will come out is a Far cry from the truth. Toyota is more concerned with keeping it's status as the #1 car dealer in the World and LESS about making a splash with a new Supra. It's corporate thinking at it's finest. So when will you see a gen 5 Supra...??? When Toyota is struggling to stay in business (maybe never?)

And again on the point of Reliability, I place my bets on a MKIII any day of the week next to the other brands.

But again, hammer on both top gear shows to see if we can make some noise. I want to see a Skyline wet itself!

 

[Poodles]

Don't think so fast that a Skyline will eat up the MKIII - as noted Nissan build quality is crap outside of the Pathfinder late 80's - 2003, so an older mostly stock skyline might as well be a POS. And the new one is straight up price gouging! Fuck them turds at American Corporation of Nissan, I hope they bomb and fail massively.

The LFA is NOT THE NEXT SUPRA! First because it's a Lexus, as Hammond would say, 2nd because somewhere in the late 90's Toyota got their balls cut off for profit. So to say a Real 5 Gen Supra will come out is a Far cry from the truth. Toyota is more concerned with keeping it's status as the #1 car dealer in the World and LESS about making a splash with a new Supra. It's corporate thinking at it's finest. So when will you see a gen 5 Supra...??? When Toyota is struggling to stay in business (maybe never?)

And again on the point of Reliability, I place my bets on a MKIII any day of the week next to the other brands.

But again, hammer on both top gear shows to see if we can make some noise. I want to see a Skyline wet itself!

Go look at a MKIV and look at the LF-A. It's obvious what the LF-A was designed after. Also, the Supra was Toyota's flagship car, and they tested a lot of features they later used in the Lexus brand (the Supra predates Lexus).

 

[te72]

It is just SCCA with more humor, it is all a big game to see who can cheat their way in. The judges just look over your car and give it their "perceived" value. Doesn't matter how much you paid for anything.

Speaking of NASCAR...

"It isn't about the cheating, it's about not getting caught," I believe is the mentality behind this (and other) race series R&D...

Would love to see pics of the ES Lemons car though, you were probably the most comfortable team out there.

Go look at a MKIV and look at the LF-A. It's obvious what the LF-A was designed after. Also, the Supra was Toyota's flagship car, and they tested a lot of features they later used in the Lexus brand (the Supra predates Lexus).

I love driving a development platform done right... You can see it in any brand that has a halo car. Corvette... got some things VERY right (LS series, fiberglass bodies, IRS, etc), and some things VERY wrong (the Doug-Nash 4+3, the entire C3 era, etc). The Supra though? Where, aside from a screw up on head bolt torque values, did they screw up on the Supra?

 

[Poodles]

Think they just screwed up by pricing the car out of reach of people that would buy a Toyota.

 

[terrenceLP]

Think they just screwed up by pricing the car out of reach of people that would buy a Toyota.

Great point! Price was in the atmosphere as far as people were concerned.

But I ask this... Why Lexus for a new Supra?

I will agree the "Goal" was the same, build one of the most technological cars in the world, like the MKIII for it's day, but the process is all different. Where the Supra MKIII was pushing limits, what is the LFA doing that other super cars aren't?

The reason the MKIII should be looked at and not a remake of a MKIV is simple to me...

The MKIII was when they hit the mark, since then they've been trying, MKIV, and trying, SC400, and just gave up here, Solara - Toyota needs to build a GT, no wait, A Proper GT car... Then call it the Supra V! :icon_surp

The reason behind this OP, get Toyota thinking again! Even if they only make 2500, I want one! For My son, I love my MKIII too much. :aigo:

 

[nothix]

Tons of ignorance in this thread. Can't we all just respect nice cars instead of bashing everything that isn't a Toyota?

Lemons is awesome and nothing like described in this thread. It's all in good fun and gets a lot of people out on a track in wheel to wheel racing that would otherwise never get the chance.

Sure people cheat, but you would be amazed to see which cars are winning.

 

[TRDownShift]

Really? cause wen I read the lemons rule book all I see is a $3500 car not a $500 car.... with all the crap you have to do to it there just about telling you go out and build a race car -all the "go-fast" bits... stills looks like a metric shit ton of money get in just to run a bucket if you ask me lol.... would run my MKIII at the local track for $150 a track day way before I would ever consider entering lemons... and it's all down to one thing... money.. The whole point of lemons is to let "anyone" race... but as i've said before rules state that you just about have to build a full blown race machine -all the HP adders... that costs a lot of money... WHY in gods name would i do that wen i can simply run down to track here pay a quick $150 and drive the piss outa my MKIII... and yes... it gets pretty competitive even on normal track days ( we get to go out on track at the same time here hehe)

To me lemons should be just what it sounds like.... jump on Craigslist, buy the first $500 rust bucket you see and go find out just how long it'll take you to blow that motor say high lol.... THAT would be fun.... but the way it's set up now just makes the whole thing a huge pain in the ass .... Just my honest Opinion...

Oh, and you cant say I'm wrong about the GT-R.... it's a nice, fast, maybe crazy fast car... the fact is.... you breath on it the wrong way and your on your own... I think it's messed up If nissan feels tht strongly about the car not being raced then the car should be sold strictly As-Is.... I thinks it messed up that they even offer the service plan

 

[nothix]

1) you will not race on a track day
2) a legit lemons car costs $1500ish and a whole team of 4-6 pays for it.

It's a whole weekend of racing and way more fun then a track day.

Racing isn't for people without a little bit of extra cash.

---------- Post added at 10:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:13 PM ----------

GTR has it's problems, but they are over embellished. And yes they are expensive to repair. But they are amazing vehicles for the price.

---------- Post added at 10:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:14 PM ----------

First lemons cost
race suit = $400+
Entry Fee = $150
Car cost = $1500/5 = $300
fuel costs = $50

Total Cost for first race: $900+

Every other race: $200+

 

[TRDownShift]

Huh.. funny how I go by the track on track days all the time and they get pretty competitive from my point of view

and as for the lemons car running you only 1500.... thats in ideal conditions, in other words, you own your own garage, tools, and you have the skills to do all the work yourself. not everyone has access to everything needed to build a race car hence, for the rest of the working world it's a $2500~3500 car at the end of the day.

And no, I'm not spending almost 450 after taxes to buy a suit just to drive a car that MIGHT manage to pull past 80 just before braking, my cargo pants and T-shirt will work just fine (besides I'm going to be in a hot car for 3 to 6 hours at a time.. I do NOT want to wear some heavy racing suit ) ... Sorry, IMHO the only things you need a suit to race are, A: Open wheelers B: Shifter Karts and C: Motorcycles (maybe I would think about wearing one an a full GT car... but you get the point )

As I said before, LEMONS should be just that... LLLEEEEEEEMMMMMOOOONNNNNEEEEEESSSSS lol Go out, buy a car for 500 or less... and RUN THE BALLS OFF IT As-Is just like they do from time to time on TOP GEAR. besides, any car that can be had for $500 really cant go fast enough to really hurt you... well unless you do something flat out stupid... then maybe you had whatever you got coming to you .... (THEN AGAIN, I did get my MKIII turbo for just about that but we're not going to talk about that hehe)

Oh... and racing is for anyone that wants to, it's not all about money, what IS about is a canyon road in the middle of nowhere, a few good buddys you trust and the will to push the limits ... WAAAA there is NOTHING in this world like a good downhill run XD

 

[Compton74]

Huh.. funny how I go by the track on track days all the time and they get pretty competitive from my point of view

and as for the lemons car running you only 1500.... thats in ideal conditions, in other words, you own your own garage, tools, and you have the skills to do all the work yourself. not everyone has access to everything needed to build a race car hence,
for the rest of the working world it's a $2500~3500 car at the end of the day.

And no, I'm not spending almost 450 after taxes to buy a suit just to drive a car that MIGHT manage to pull past 80 just before braking, my cargo pants and T-shirt will work just fine (besides I'm going to be in a hot car for 3 to 6 hours at a time.. I do NOT want to wear some heavy racing suit ) ... Sorry, IMHO the only things you need a suit to race are, A: Open wheelers B: Shifter Karts and C: Motorcycles (maybe I would think about wearing one an a full GT car... but you get the point )

As I said before, LEMONS should be just that... LLLEEEEEEEMMMMMOOOONNNNNEEEEEESSSSS lol Go out, buy a car for 500 or less... and RUN THE BALLS OFF IT As-Is just like they do from time to time on TOP GEAR. besides, any car that can be had for $500 really cant go fast enough to really hurt you... well unless you do something flat out stupid... then maybe you had whatever you got coming to you .... (THEN AGAIN, I did get my MKIII turbo for just about that but we're not going to talk about that hehe)

Oh... and racing is for anyone that wants to, it's not all about money, what IS about is a canyon road in the middle of nowhere, a few good buddys you trust and the will to push the limits ... WAAAA there is NOTHING in this world like a good downhill run XD

You make somewhat decent points but I disagree with you a few things you say. Your going to go buy a $500 car that you have no real idea about conditions of things such as wiring or fuel lines and trust your body and life to a set of cargo pants and a tshirt? I value my life much more then that but to each his own. And every vehicle that goes onto a race track or races in water should require full race suit, gloves, helmet, and some sort of safety restraint such as a Hans device. I've been in a race car and if you have seen what happens when you hit the wall and catch fire you'd really understand why you racing suits for driver such as NASCAR costs 5 grand but once again to each his own.

Real racing is not about money but involves lots of it to be competitive and safe . I run a southwest tour truck which is a locally raced series in so cal, trucks cost about 10 grand. If you want to be competitive, be prepared to spend another 6 grand getting the truck setup correctly.

And what your speaking of, the fun with your friends, is illegal and all in all dangerous. You are putting yourself and others in danger for your quick 10 minutes of fun. Be safe race where it's legal, the track.

 

[nothix]

safety first

I'd sure hate for you to wreck your street car on a track much less into another car or wall - ouch!

The racing is a lot more intense then you'd anticipate even in legit $500 cars. Our altima was hitting 108mph on the longest straight

I promote safe and legal racing