Should I retrofit to r134a? or is r12 possible?

chris89

chris89

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May 31, 2005
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My A/C has not been up to par over this summer, And i think my A/C is low on r12... I can retrofit to r134a, but i'm worried that it's not going to be as cold as full system charge of r12.... I can get the retrofit kit at O'reilly for $25... I don't have a clue on what to do, Maybe u guy's could help answer my questions.
 
csnow

csnow

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Apr 5, 2005
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R12 is around $45-$65 a pound depending on the shop. I would stay R12 as the 134 will not cool as well with around town driving. It will cool, but not as cold as R12. I would assume the supra would take 2 or so pounds. I am sure others here have more information.
 
Nick M

Nick M

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R12 is available. Some shop owners just won't buy it. Converting will hurt nothing. Yes, it won't cool as well, as R134 does not have the 1:1 temperature to pressure ratio that R12 has. But it will still work.

Fix your system. It is broke, that is why it isn't cold. If you can't recover what is left, repair the leak, replace the receiver/dryer, evacuate then recharge in your driveway, then don't do it.
 
chris89

chris89

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well my ac has never been recharged, My A/C does get cool, But not as cool as i'de prefer. I work at a Ford Dealership, so someone said they could retrofit it for me and charge it with r134a. I'de be happy with it being a little cooler than it is now. Once i drive for over 30min it starts to cool pretty well. The guy who's gonna retrofit it and recharge is asking $55 for everything... I'de say it would be worth it?
 
jetjock

jetjock

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You can buy small cans of R12 on ebay. A license is normally needed but many sellers will accept a statement you're not going to resell it. Based on your symptoms it sounds like your problem is nothing more than low charge. Look at the sight glass in the receiver/dryer while the system is running at fast idle and you'll likely see bubbles.

Get a cheap can tap with a long hose and add R12 to the low side fitting until the bubbles go away then add a bit more. The low side fitting is on the compressor. Keep the can of R12 upright at all times and don't connect it to the high side fitting at the front of the car. It shouldn't fit anyway but just in case I'm telling you. Connect it to the high side and the can will explode in your face. Turn the can upside down while it's connected to the low side and you'll destroy your AC system. Are we having fun yet?

If you don't feel comfortable doing this let the guys at work do it. They should have the can tap and hose. Course, if your system has a leak you'll be back where you started in a few months to a year. It's why I'm with Nick about doing stuff right.
 
chris89

chris89

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Yeah, I'll have him check for leaks as well. I'm just gonna retro fit my car, Here at ford r134a costs $2 a can, $30 labor + $25 parts.
 
Nick M

Nick M

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chris89 said:
Yeah, I'll have him check for leaks as well. I'm just gonna retro fit my car, Here at ford r134a costs $2 a can, $30 labor + $25 parts.
Click to expand...

If you are having it done by your buddy at Ford, he will check for leaks. Upsells are his lively hood.

If he is on flat rate, he will likely be able to pull the car into his bay when not busy and hook up the gauge set to see what is going on.
 
CPT Furious

CPT Furious

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I vote for keeping the R12. Yes, I converted and did it properly, but when it is 100 degrees out I long for the R12 in stop-n-go traffic...
 
csnow

csnow

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I am converting mine to R134a during my 2J swap. However, my 2J compressor is a R134a compressor and I am going to get new lines made with the 2J compressor ends and the MKIII ends. I will also be replacing all the seals with 134a seals and getting a new drier and condensor. A/C is a big deal to me here in Florida. From what I read, the r12 compressors are smaller than the 134a compressors and that is why they dont cool as well when you retro fit them. I am hoping mine will cool like a newer 134a system..... fingers crossed.
 
annoyingrob

annoyingrob

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If you're low don't just fill it up, find out where it's leaking from so you don't have to fill it again.

Both my 91 Supra, and my 83 Celica have ice cold A/C, and to the best of my knowledge, neither has ever been recharged. (Hell, the A/C on the Celica had been disconencted for years when I got it)
 
chris89

chris89

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Well tonight my belt started squealing after 45min of driving with a/c on full blaster and I was running it rather hard, Then I pull over and there's smoke pouring out from the AC compressor, Whatevers connected to the belt... Am i screwed now? By the way, I still haven't retrofitted it nor refilling with r12..
 
jetjock

jetjock

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^ What Jeff said. If you have a license you can buy all you want. I have tons of it lying around. (Well OK, maybe not tons). That said if I'm not mistaken it *is* illegal in Canada.

All MVAC systems leak a little because of the hoses and connections used. It's not like your fridge or an industrial unit when it's all hard plumbed. A leak of any appreciable size will take the oil with it. That's why the system has a low pressure cut off switch.

Chris: You compressor probably seized. I hate to say it but it's probably given you a case of what's known in the AC biz as black death. The compressor will need to be replaced, the system flushed, vacuumed, and recharged with oil and refrigerant. If you're lucky the condenser and expansion valve won't have to be replaced. Either way you're looking at some spendy work. Frankly, you shouldn't have been using it when low on refrigerant.
 
gtsfirefighter

gtsfirefighter

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Sep 26, 2006
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jetjock said:
You can buy small cans of R12 on ebay. A license is normally needed but many sellers will accept a statement you're not going to resell it. Based on your symptoms it sounds like your problem is nothing more than low charge. Look at the sight glass in the receiver/dryer while the system is running at fast idle and you'll likely see bubbles.

Get a cheap can tap with a long hose and add R12 to the low side fitting until the bubbles go away then add a bit more. The low side fitting is on the compressor. Keep the can of R12 upright at all times and don't connect it to the high side fitting at the front of the car. It shouldn't fit anyway but just in case I'm telling you. Connect it to the high side and the can will explode in your face. Turn the can upside down while it's connected to the low side and you'll destroy your AC system. Are we having fun yet?

If you don't feel comfortable doing this let the guys at work do it. They should have the can tap and hose. Course, if your system has a leak you'll be back where you started in a few months to a year. It's why I'm with Nick about doing stuff right.
Click to expand...

Out of curiousity, why would turning the can upside down on the low pressure side destroy you AC system? I've never heard this. I'm not doubting you, just find it interesting.

I do miss the days of going to Walmart and picking up R12 for $2.00 a can.
 
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