running lean on dyno help

wardog

R.G.V WARDOG
Jan 19, 2006
564
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ALTON, TX
I took the supra to get it dynoed and we couldnt get it under a 14 afr even at 44psi of fuel pressure with vac on . what can cause this here are my mods

Upgradded ct26 60-1 , k&n fipk, ddp no cats and 3 exhaust, stock 440s , walbro 225lph, afpr , lex afm, 2.5 hardpipes on stock intercooler,safc 2 , evc 4 set at .8 bar or 10 psi spec stage 3 and 11lb flywheel and it was still realy lean and it would cut off like at around 5k rpm

I just put some autolie copper 3923 @ 30 gap and did a compression test and all cylinders were 150 exept #2 at 146 and i just found a loose clamp on the hard pipes any help would be appreciated thanks...:1zhelp:
 
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TurboWarrior

New Member
Apr 1, 2005
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I wonder if you disable all the other stuff if it will go semi normal with just raised fuel pressure. then start turning the other stuff back on. See what happens
 

suprahero

naughty by nature
Staff member
Aug 26, 2005
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robbo185 said:
the 440's with lex afm would be my guess.

I think the 25% more air with stock injectors is the problem, unless you're adding the fuel with your SAFCII.
 

dbsupra90

toonar
Apr 1, 2005
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indiucky
does your fuel pressure go up 1psi per 1psi of boost?

id drill out the cover over the stock screw and crank it all the way in to close off some of the unmetered air. better yet, throw the stock afm on there and see if the problem goes away.
 

BillyM

MK2 + 7M = FUN
Mar 3, 2006
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Haha, Suprahero ...I can just see someone with stock injectors throwing a lex AFM on there to drop the AFM hz (yay, no more fuel cut!), then using a SAFC to raise it back to what the stock AFM would have been outputting (hey fuel-cut, nice to see you again!). Tehehe.

...Loose clamp on the hardpipes would issue a rich condition.

Question: when it cut-off at 5k, was it obviously fuel-cut, or simply leaning out too much? You did have a wideband on it, yes? Scan up the sheet and let us see, it will give us much more to work off of.

I bet $$$ there is nothing physically wrong with your system, it is working exactly as you have built and set it, which is incorrectly.

Hypothetically, the lex AFM with upped fuel pressure should be a good way around fuel cut, if your pump is able to hold up, and you are able to set the necessary fuel pressures to work with the lower AFM signal. (remember, flow does not increase in a directly-proportionate relationship to pressure due to increased turbulence within the injector, but rather in an exponential relation) See below:

formula-4.gif


Using that, if you are seeing a peak of 48psi on your stock setup, and would like to increase flow from said injectors by 25% to match the lower hZ output of the lex-afm, you would need a peak of 75psi to work correctly with the lex-afm.

...again, with the exponential nature of the pressure/flow relationship, having a system mapped to compensate for a 1:1 FPR, you will have a grossly rich condition at the low-end of this system when your full-boost is tuned right. Where your old base pressure (no-vac) was 38psi, to increase the fuel flow 25%, with a 1:1 and fuel pressure to correct your top-end, your base pressure will have to be 65psi. ...sadly, you need ~59psi, so you'll have to either compensate pulling fuel (safer than adding up-top also negating the fuel-cut resistance of the LEX) with the SAFC or investing in a RRFPR (cartech/BEGI makes a nice one) to have the correct base pressure with the necessary pressure at full boost.

Honestly, I doubt your fuel pressure is where it needs to be when in boost. A, you simply added 25% more base pressure, instead of the necessary ~55%. B, your fuel pump may not be able to deliver 75psi at the flow needed when hitting 5krpm at full boost (You'll need one hell of a fuel pump!).

I'd have a fuel pressure gauge on there for-sure when going about it this way. Safer yet, would be getting a set of 550s and bringing your base pressure back down. ...injectors are ~$400, engine rebuilds are slightly more.

--billyM
 
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wardog

R.G.V WARDOG
Jan 19, 2006
564
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ALTON, TX
Guys at the dyno they had one of those widebands that u put in the muffler and tomorrow ill get the sheets from them and post them up ....what is wierd is that on the street i have no problems with my car. Im gonna installl a new oxygen sensor.I found a replacement from Borg warner that replaces the Napa Echlin os885 that dr jones found im gonna order it and ill post as soon as i get it to make sure they are the same...and thanks for your responses. Like i said ill get those sheets up tomorrow...
 

wardog

R.G.V WARDOG
Jan 19, 2006
564
0
16
ALTON, TX
Another question my car backfires sometimes like when i step on the gas , let go and hit the gas again itll make a loud poooopin noise could this be caused by bad timing ...and can bad timing be the cause of my other problem...:1zhelp:
 

MKIIINA

Destroyer of Turbos
Mar 30, 2005
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HERE IS YOUR PROBLEM..... YOU ARE RUNNING 440'S WITH A LEXUS AFM!!!!!!

We did this with my brother's car as a test and guess what it was lean as hell everywhere. We did it as a proof for people saying that it was safe to run 440s and a lex afm. you just added some more proof.

other note an aftermarket bov can cause the backfiring you saw also.
 

wardog

R.G.V WARDOG
Jan 19, 2006
564
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ALTON, TX
Ok then Im on the search button as we speak looking for some 550s any recomendations on some inexpensive 550s not venoms though... thanks MkIIINA breath now ...:icon_bigg
 

wardog

R.G.V WARDOG
Jan 19, 2006
564
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ALTON, TX
I found some 550cc Precision turbo and engine lucas injectors for 360 shipped with clips matched to 1% to each other and they come with flow sheet for the injectors u guys think they are good injectors they are Lucas afterall....lmk:evil2:
 

MKIIINA

Destroyer of Turbos
Mar 30, 2005
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wardog said:
Ok then Im on the search button as we speak looking for some 550s any recomendations on some inexpensive 550s not venoms though... thanks MkIIINA breath now ...:icon_bigg

lol sorry im having a rough few days.... ive been running lucas injectors for about 2 years now w/o complaint. im gonna go have a few beers before i gotta work some more... least my car is running!:evil2:
 

TurboWarrior

New Member
Apr 1, 2005
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Theres only one cheap way that could end up not being so cheap. Finding injectors from other cars that are 550cc low impedance. I think the RX7 uses them. But they are used...so youd have to get them, flow match them, and chances are some will be bad. So you'll be flow testing more than 6. and at around 20$ per injector it can get expensive anyway.

Get those PTE's if anything. RC's I think are machined to fit the rail properly. But people still seem to be able to use the pte's. Maybe its a tight fit i dunno.