Question about TTR spring rates

[yhatzee89]

Does anybody actually know what the spring rates for the TTR and/or JZA70 springs are? I'm looking into my suspension setup for this summer and I think the TTR springs may be my best option (linear, factory piece, lowers, and is rare) but I can't find any info on the spring rates for them. The only info I've found so far is post #10 in this thread which lists specs possibly for the JZA70
Estimated Front Drop - 35mm(1.4in)
Estimated Rear Drop - 20mm(0.8in)
Front Spring Rate - 12.00kg(677lbs)
Rear Spring Rate - 6.00kg(335lbs)
http://www.supramania.com/forums/sh...III-spring-rates-OEM-aftermarket-and-coilover

So if anybody could help me I really would appreciate it.

Thanks

 

[hvyman]

Honestly your prolly better off just buying new springs. Any ttr spring is over 20years old.

Eibach will make springs to what your fancy is.

 

[Silver MK3]

I was going to say the same thing. Don't springs tend to sag over time?

 

[yhatzee89]

Eibach is a progressive spring and I'm looking for linear, and it's like any other used part, you just have to be thorough and careful

 

[yhatzee89]

Still looking for info on this...

 

[Poodles]

High quality springs don't sag much if at all. TTR springs are going to be rare, and they're not enough drop to worry about. You're already a bit lower compared to a pre-89

Also IIRC Eibach's are functionally progressive. The "progressive" part is functionally a helper spring so the springs don't come out of their seats under droop (as they assume you're running a full stroke factory shock)

 

[hvyman]

Eibach can also make you custom springs.

 

[yhatzee89]

High quality springs don't sag much if at all. TTR springs are going to be rare, and they're not enough drop to worry about. You're already a bit lower compared to a pre-89

Also IIRC Eibach's are functionally progressive. The "progressive" part is functionally a helper spring so the springs don't come out of their seats under droop (as they assume you're running a full stroke factory shock)

What I'm most concerned with is the stiffer spring rates and that they are rare. I've heard that about the helper spring, but I would rather not chance it. I've also read some posts about them getting sloppy depending on what type of driving your doing.

Eibach can also make you custom springs.

Can they make them fully linear? And I'd still want TTR spring rates

 

[IJ.]

Could always change the perches and use Eibach linear springs in whatever rate and length you need, I did this on the Koni's for my Mk3.

 

[yhatzee89]

Could always change the perches and use Eibach linear springs in whatever rate and length you need, I did this on the Koni's for my Mk3.

View attachment 72693

Very nice! Which sleeve setup?

My whole idea was to get either a set of Illumina-II's or a new set of factory TEMS shocks, TTR (or similar) springs, an adjustable full sleeve kit that allows me to adjust both spring and ride height. This would allow me to have full travel of the shock so I don't blow them out after a couple of potholes. The big problems right now are finding a threaded bottom mount, and determining the right spring

 

[IJ.]

My Koni shop supplied them, nothing special though.

You need to run some good,long, progressive bump stops though or you'll destroy shocks.

Springs rates I chose are in the pics.

 

[yhatzee89]

My Koni shop supplied them, nothing special though.

Did they have an option for a fully threaded kit?

You need to run some good,long, progressive bump stops though or you'll destroy shocks.

Factory won't cut it? Even if I'm able to retain full travel?

Springs rates I chose are in the pics.

Are those "coilover" style springs?

 

[IJ.]

If you choose the right spring length the short sleeves have more than enough adjustment range, it'll go from slammed on the stops to Monster Truck.

Yep

 

[yhatzee89]

The thought behind the full sleeve is so I can retain the full travel of the shock, if all I do is lower the spring, then I've already compressed my shock some before I've even moved the car
How did you mount the sleeves to the shock body?
Are your springs linear?

 

[IJ.]

If you lower the car you compress the Shock... there's no way around that, one end is bolted to the car the other to the arm.

The Koni's have circlip grooves the sleeves have a receiver groove in the bottom that goes over the clips.

Yes Linear.

 

[yhatzee89]

That's the point of the full sleeve, it lowers the full shock down (or moves the lower mounting point up depending on how you look at it) you just thread the shock body further down into the mount

How much did those cost you?

Edit: best pics of the difference between fully and partial thread I could find

http://www.jdm-option.com/eng/pr_CUSCO/suspension.html

 

[IJ.]

That's the point of the full sleeve, it lowers the full shock down (or moves the lower mounting point up depending on how you look at it) you just thread the shock body further down into the mount

How much did those cost you?

You're confusing adjustable spring seats and adjustable bodies, If the shock has enough stroke to go from Slammed on the Bump Stops and Monster Truck High I don't see why you'd be concerned, it's not like the Valving is different from one end of the shock to the other?

Mine cost me way too much as I let them do all the work, from memory the fronts were built on Mk3 VW Golf bodies then revolved to suit my spring rate.

In hindsight I should have done 90% of the conversion myself and saved a LOT as the parts weren't that expensive....

 

[yhatzee89]

You're confusing adjustable spring seats and adjustable bodies, If the shock has enough stroke to go from Slammed on the Bump Stops and Monster Truck High I don't see why you'd be concerned, it's not like the Valving is different from one end of the shock to the other?

Ah yes! That was the difference I was trying to convey. I was concerned with it because I had read that the Illumina-IIs were more prone to failure when paired with lowering springs due to being partially compressed all the time, losing some of the travel and blowing out, but you think a set of quality bumpstops would help avoid this?

I edited my above post to show the site I found the "fully threaded" coilovers

Mine cost me way too much as I let them do all the work, from memory the fronts were built on Mk3 VW Golf bodies then revolved to suit my spring rate.

In hindsight I should have done 90% of the conversion myself and saved a LOT as the parts weren't that expensive....

Hindsight is 20/20 after all... Would you have simply gone generic coilover springs with your preferred rates?

 

[IJ.]

My "guess" is the IL2's blowing out is more to do with stock or missing bumpstops and crashing the Pistons into the bottom of the Shock Tube, this happened to one of my original Koni's....

I'd still have used the parts I ended up with just as I said done the bulk of the work myself it would have been better/lighter/cheaper that way..

 

[yhatzee89]

IJ after much deliberation and researching in the direction you pointed me, I've come to the conclusion that I'm gonna not bother with the TTR/JZA70 factory spring and just jump straight to a set of coilover springs and a good quality sleeve kit on a set of new TEMS shocks. If I ever find a set of threaded lower mounts I may revisit the idea, but this setup I think will be ideal for me otherwise, just need to find a set of really good bump stops to ease my mind and I think I'll be set. Thanks for the insight.