No Start, Have spark, fuel, and air, codes 22,24,32,51

[TomFraser]

My supra was hard to start one morning, but eventually started

As I was driving I noticed that sudden movement of the throttle caused it to almost stall. When I got to the end of the street it stalled and would not start.

It cranks, and does not even sound like it is trying to start.

I normally would attempt diagnosis for a while by myself but here is a picture of my neighborhood:

And it is still raining!

The supra is luckily not in the water.

I have codes:

22: Water Temp Signal Sensor (Old connector broke, ordered a new one)
24: Air Temp Sensor signal problem (No idea why I have this)
32: AFM Signal (Due to maft pro)
51: No "IDL" or "NSW" signal to ECU (I have no idea why I have this code) TPS is giving valid signal to maft pro and AVCR, so I do not know why I have this code.

I tested spark by pulling the wire of and seeing spark
I tested fuel by looking at the fuel pressure gauge on the AFPR.
I tested air through the use of common sense

I have no fuses blown
I have wired the CPS directly removing the old connector and soldering wires to each other

I have made sure timing is correct by lining up Cams and crank with TDC, and installing CPS per TSRM instructions. It is still installed correctly.

I do not know what to check next, does anyone else have any ideas?

 

[jetjock]

You have all those codes yet are out of ideas? Fix the 32 and 22. Things will much improve. Fix the 51 after that. It's likely the TPS. Your maft pro and avcr do not display the signal involved. Btw why the maft pro if you're NA?

Looks normal for Lakeville to me

 

[TomFraser]

I'm turbo...

Code 22 will be fixed when the connector comes into toyota (Friday)
Code 32 is because maft pro boots after the ECU boots
Code 24 is because AFM has that sensor and is gone.

Would any of those codes cause a no start anyways?

Can code 51 cause a no start. What else should I look at?

I was going by the maft pro TPS voltage output, and the AVCR's throttle percentage gauge. I guess it's a different signal? It is calibrated to spec.

 

[jetjock]

If you're turbo code 32 does not involve the AFM.

Code 22 is causing the ECU to think your coolant is hot. Therefore it will not provide starting and warm up enrichment when the engine is cold.

Code 24 will also prevent (to some extent) starting and warm up enrichment. That one probably is caused by the maft pro.

Code 51 (assuming it's TPS related) will prevent idle speed control. It also prevents the engine from running properly in Fail Safe mode when the AFM signal is bad. It will not prevent the engine from starting.

Of those 22 will make the engine hardest to start, at least when cold. Yes, the code 51 signal is different. You need to check the idle switch part of the TPS...

 

[TomFraser]

OK... I'll wait for the new sensor and connector to come in and see if that helps.

If the TPS is calibrated according to spec (I also found a guide somewhere on this site) am I looking at a new TPS?

Should I hear it stumbling or at least trying to start even with those codes, or is there anything else I can look at while waiting on my order from toyota.

I should mention my mod list contains:
Maft pro
60-1 CT26
550cc injectors / walbro 255 FP / Aeromotive AFPR with J-tube drilled, dampener bypassed


Thanks for taking the time to help, I'm glad you saw this thread

Tom

 

[jetjock]

Code 32 on a turbo is HAC related.

If the TPS is caled then either the IDL signal is not getting to the ECU or the code is being set by one of the other causes.

*If* the CSI is working the engine should cold start but die as soon as the key is released. Even if you get it to stay running it won't idle worth crap or accelerate well until it warms up.

With that many codes there's not much else you can do until they're repaired.

You be welcome. Good luck...

 

[TomFraser]

OK... My maft pro does the work of the HAC so I'm going to worry about 51 and 22

I'll recalibrate the TPS and see if having that connector in fixes the issue.

I will post an update, and thanks for the help, I would've never thought that the coolant temp sensor could cause such problems.

 

[supraguy@aol]

Dunno if this helps, but I have the original MAFT, and started getting a stumbling, loss of power when adding throttle- situation, and it turned out to be a loose connector from the HAC line to the MAFT.

 

[TomFraser]

So I got the connector and sensor, but the starter was simply clicking and not turning, would turn every 30 or 40 times I attempted to start.

Load tested the battery, it was fine (it starts my father's V8 2UZ)

Connected a wire directly from battery to prong on starter where black and blue wire was, just clicked.

Smacked it with a hammer and it started turning for that one time.

Got the bottom bolt out of the starter, top I have loose, and have a socket with extensions on the actual bolt, but cannot get a wrench on the nut on the other side. Any specific help, I searched but could not find any specific ideas. My arms are too big to get at it from the front. I can get my fingers on the nut from the bottom, but don't have the finger strength to hold it while I ratchet the bolt out.

I have work today, but will finish this mess up tomorrow.

 

[supra90turbo]

If you need a hand with this, I can come by this weekend, Tom. I have a spare everything including new(ish) starter (assuming you're 5spd)

 

[TomFraser]

I'm hoping to have the job done tomorrow, Is there a difference between auto and manual starters, and how can I tell when it is out of the car. The reman I have came with an older supra as a bonus so I'm not sure which it is, I thought they were the same.

I'm auto as of now.

I really appreciate the offer, If I can't do it tomorrow I may just take it up

I may also take up an offer for help later on (when the weather is warmer), when I'm swapping my auto for an R154, I cannot wait until I have the time and money to do that If you know anyone with an R154 around here that would be even better too.

Hopefully this summer a few of us Massachusetts owners can get together.

 

[JPsToyota]

I just replaced a starter with a similar problem off of a 1JZ, solenoid would click but the starter wouldn't turn. Took the starter off and put a remanufactured one on, then started going through the old one. The old starter was absolutely filthy and full of junk in the electrical top portion, I'm confident that after I clean all the electrical up and give it a once over that it will probably work fine.

Just a heads up.

 

[TomFraser]

So I ended up getting the top bolt off simply by holding the nut with my fingers as I ratcheted the bolt out.

I put the reman starter in and installed the bottom bolt and nut. (They are very tight). I then ran twelve volts across the black and blue wire terminal expecting to hear starting, and instead got nothing. Everything is hooked up except the top bolt is not tight (don't want to tighten until I'm sure everything is good).

I take my wire and connect it to the 12v battery, and get nothing. No click, no starting. I do get a big arc from the wire to the battery so I'm pretty sure ground and 12v are fine. In this case could not having the top bolt on the starter tight cause a no start?

 

[TomFraser]

Bought a new starter, pre 89 so not threaded holes, but to simplify things I JBwelded the nuts to the starter so it is exactly the same thing, and 70 dollars cheaper than a 89+ starter

Stil cannot start, replaced coolant sensor,

My only code is 51, the others I fixed through tutorials on maft pro.

My car does not even "try" to start, no stumbling, NOTHING, just cranking. I think it is important to say that it was driving fine, then all the sudden began to get incredibly rich when I put the pedal down, and when I came to a stop stalled out. I think this is key to figuring out the issue.

Can the TPS actually cause that? I'm in need of another one, and am looking to get one now.

How can I test that the injectors are firing (a voltmeter on the connector looking for 12v?)

What else can I check?

Timing is dead on (redid everything)
Have Fuel pressure
have spark (pulled each plug)
CPS gives RPM signal, so I know it is working
ECU has power
No fuses blown

After replacing the TPS what else can I check?

I appreciate any time people help me to finding the issue.

 

[TomFraser]

I pulled each spark plug, and they all seemed normal, what else can I check?

 

[TomFraser]

When messing with timing (moving CPS) I can get it to stumble, but not start, I redid timing and all it does is stumble, it wants to start, but something is missing. Does anyone have any other ideas? My TPS will be coming in soon.

 

[Sawbladz]

Can you link me to these tutorials. My code list reads a lot like yours with my fresh MAFT-Pro install. I have:

5 1 I think mine might be the A/C since I removed the compressor. No idea on this one though.
5 2 - I plan on doing the knock sensor rewire. I know my knock sensors are good.
2 4 - Tutorial for MAFT-Pro?
3 2 - Tutorial for MAFT-Pro?

 

[jetjock]

^ 51 is going to be TPS, AC switch on in diag mode, or neutral switch off (if auto) in diag mode. It's not because you removed the compressor. The ECU has no way of determining if one is installed...

 

[Sawbladz]

Ok, I will verify that I had my AC off when I pulled the codes and then I will set about fixing the TPS issue if it is still there. I think I am going to go clear the codes and see what all comes back.

 

[jetjock]

Clearing is always wise but just so you know it doesn't apply to 51 because that code doesn't get set in memory. Put another way it's self clearing. Doing it for the other codes is good though. Keep in mind some won't come back right away because certain engine parameters must be met first. 52 is an example of that. It's also unique in that once set it will keep the MIL on until the next key cycle even if the condition that caused it returns to normal.