Metal Head Gasket Experience

[NADude98]

Hi all,
I am looking for your experience with the MHG upgrade. What I need in particular is for experience with putting on a MHG without doing anything to the block. IE, is this something I should not do. The head has been worked on, milled etc. However I put on a stock HG and ARP head studs torqued to 85 ft. lbs. and apparently have a BHG already. So I am just trying to find out if I can get by with putting on a MHG and not have to mill the block or anything. Also what MHG would everyone recommend.

Thanks,

 

[TurboFreak]

Hi all,
I am looking for your experience with the MHG upgrade. What I need in particular is for experience with putting on a MHG without doing anything to the block. IE, is this something I should not do. The head has been worked on, milled etc. However I put on a stock HG and ARP head studs torqued to 85 ft. lbs. and apparently have a BHG already. So I am just trying to find out if I can get by with putting on a MHG and not have to mill the block or anything. Also what MHG would everyone recommend.

Thanks,

Same exact thing JUST happened to me. ARP's and stock HG then 2000 miles later (aka today) the gasket blew again. I think I'm going with a cometic this time. I am also not touching the block except for making sure it is reallllllly clean. I had a cometic and ARP's put on my old blue one and just had the head milled and it's still running strong 25k miles later...

 

[thebuddrik]

there are a lot of people on here that are gonna burn us but on my first car i put ARPs and MHG with head milled and no block work. it lasted about 5k miles then i got rear ended. i just did the same thing with my current car. just make sure it is CLEAN and FLAT and i went and retorqued it after 100 miles for good measure.
i know that is not the right way but i dont have the time and money to pull the block and do a full rebuild.

 

[MKIIINA]

both my brother and I are running on MHG and ARPs for a few years at slightly elevated boost levels (~12 and 20 psi respectively) without issue.

that said we are running hks 1.2 mm gaskets, copper sprayed, no retorque and LAPPED THE BLOCK while it was in the car. in a perfect world you would do that out of the car. check your block and head for cracks. what did you torque the head to last time?

 

[Shytheed Dumas]

I hate to be a naysayer, but strictly from a common sense perspective, consider the following:

1. Your stock HG job failed
2. You plan on the same route (machined head, cleaned block only) with a finicky MHG
3. You expect the MHG to somehow fix what went wrong with a more forgiving stocker

It doesn't add up. Find out where you went wrong when you put the composite HG down first. Then you might consider a MHG without milling the block, but keep in mind that the manufacturers of said metal head gaskets give maximum RA's for a reason; they have really smart engineers working for them and don't just pull them out of mid-air.

 

[MKIIINA]

I hate to be a naysayer, but strictly from a common sense perspective, consider the following:

1. Your stock HG job failed
2. You plan on the same route (machined head, cleaned block only) with a finicky MHG
3. You expect the MHG to somehow fix what went wrong with a more forgiving stocker

It doesn't add up. Find out where you went wrong when you put the composite HG down first. Then you might consider a MHG without milling the block, but keep in mind that the manufacturers of said metal head gaskets give maximum RA's for a reason; they have really smart engineers working for them and don't just pull them out of mid-air.

agreed, something caused this last hg to fail a MHG will not make things any easier.

 

[SupraOfDoom]

Do it right the first time... or in your case the second time.

 

[Kckazdude]

1. Your stock HG job failed
2. You plan on the same route (machined head, cleaned block only) with a finicky MHG
3. You expect the MHG to somehow fix what went wrong with a more forgiving stocker

I couldnt agree more with this post. You cant really expect a change doing the same thing.

 

[TurboFreak]

Really? So everyone that has gotten a blown headgasket should pull the engine just to get the block resurfaced?

...and that's why I'm getting away from supra's.

 

[werewolves182]

Really? So everyone that has gotten a blown headgasket should pull the engine just to get the block resurfaced?

...and that's why I'm getting away from supra's.

Sell your supra and buy mine :naughty:. Ill give you a good deal...

 

[SupraOfDoom]

Really? So everyone that has gotten a blown headgasket should pull the engine just to get the block resurfaced?

...and that's why I'm getting away from supra's.

Not everyone.. this is why you measure to see if you need too resurface. But if you do need to, your going to probably have to pull the engine anyway...

 

[Shytheed Dumas]

Really? So everyone that has gotten a blown headgasket should pull the engine just to get the block resurfaced?

...and that's why I'm getting away from supra's.

Not at all...

Anyone who has screwed up a stock HG repair should first determine where they went wrong, and then make sure they don't repeat the error.

Anyone using a MHG should take pains to meet the intentionally set manufacturer's RA specs.

Anybody not willing to do either of the above should get away from Supras.

 

[dugums]

Did you guys retorque the ARP's?

Mine backed out twice.

 

[mazzer]

Really? So everyone that has gotten a blown headgasket should pull the engine just to get the block resurfaced?

...and that's why I'm getting away from supra's.

i pulled my engine,and done it right. :dunno:


go buy a honda, if you want cheap.. without money, you're in the wrong hobby.

 

[fonz87]

what do you guys torque your arp bolts to ?? I m hearing 75 ... then 80... i also heard 90

What to torque to a 1.2 MHG ??

Does it matter what the metal size of the headgasket.. like 1.2 or 2.0 mm .. different torques for them ???

 

[dugums]

what do you guys torque your arp bolts to ?? I m hearing 75 ... then 80... i also heard 90

What to torque to a 1.2 MHG ??

Does it matter what the metal size of the headgasket.. like 1.2 or 2.0 mm .. different torques for them ???

Torque spec is based on what bolt or stud you are using. ARP studs and bolts have different torque specs. ARP bolts on our aluminum head should be torqued to 75 lb/feet.

They should be torqued incrementally (instructions included on ARP's site). They should also be retorqued after some heat cycles (also according to the ARP website). Though the ARP site says nothing about retightening more than once, a couple of mine needed a second retightening. They have been fine since then.

 

[7thousandpiecesMGTE]

Really? So everyone that has gotten a blown headgasket should pull the engine just to get the block resurfaced?

...and that's why I'm getting away from supra's.

Please tell me you are joking... there are very few supras in the Bel Air Area!
If you do... you will be back, they AlWAYS come back:biglaugh:.


Anyway, I will post my experience with a MHG:

Car is at toyota, shaved deck AND shaved new head + 1.2mm greddy MHG+ ARP.

Toyota torqued it to 72lbs. At idle all was well but when the turbo spooled and produced boost she started leaking externally! I was baffled, they claimed to have three guys putting the head back on to do it properly, I know they checked the surfaces (not to mention I know for a fact both were done correctly), and the MHG was new. They tore it down checked everything again and apparently found no issues, but when they put it back together they called ARP who told them "90lbs". So this time toyota torqued it to 95lbs for good measure. But now she boosts with no leaks.

I flinched at "95lbs". At what point is it too much? and what would give first, the threads in the block? Just curious if I should be nervous or not....

 

[IJ.]

I flinched at "95lbs". At what point is it too much? and what would give first, the threads in the block? Just curious if I should be nervous or not....

The head.....

 

[NADude98]

both my brother and I are running on MHG and ARPs for a few years at slightly elevated boost levels (~12 and 20 psi respectively) without issue.

that said we are running hks 1.2 mm gaskets, copper sprayed, no retorque and LAPPED THE BLOCK while it was in the car. in a perfect world you would do that out of the car. check your block and head for cracks. what did you torque the head to last time?

The head was torqued to 85 ft. lbs. and I was running about 15 psi of boost

 

[chopstickz]

oh god at the very least use copper spray