MAFTPRO problems. HELP!

[Fletch124]

1. Idle is just right sometimes and then suddenly it gets very rich and sometimes dies. On start up AFRs are around 10-11 and slowly climb to 14.7-15.0.

2. Cruise is very rich, 10-11AFR. Really sucks for drivability.

3. Currently I have the AFR tracking set to 11.5AFR, All the rest of the parameters in User Tune Hi, Mid, and Low are all at 0%.

4. I dont know what parameters to start tuning with, Hi, Mid, or Low?

5. In Ve Table I have no idea as to what the numbers on the left are for "320, 300, 280.."

6. Boost is extremely rich, 10.0/<.

7. My gauges; Boost and Wideband and maybe TPS are off from whats said on the screen from the gauge.

Mods - MP-70, 550s, 255lph MkiV pump, AFPR, AEM UEGO, Exhaust, Internals, Custom Downpipe, Spec Stage 3, FIPK, Lex AFM still on intake pipe but disconnected.

Here are my current settings

Version 5.03
Vehicle select &#8211; 0
# of cylinders &#8211; 6
Displacement &#8211; 3.0
Airfl mode &#8211; Speed density
Map source &#8211; Gm 3 Bar
Load Srce &#8211;Use MAP
Baro mode &#8211; Sealevel
F-out mode &#8211; Supra mkiii
V-out1 mode &#8211; Set max setting
V-out2 mode &#8211; Set max setting
AFR source &#8211; 5v aem gauge
F-in m ode &#8211; Supra mkiii
Aux 1 mode &#8211; Aux trig off
Flowerr mde &#8211; Sd/maf


Setup
Mainscale - 0.0
V-out1 Max &#8211; 2.500
V-out2 Max &#8211; 3.600
Aftermarket &#8211; 0.0
Lo Load Pt &#8211; 36.4
M:I Load Pt &#8211; 100.1
Hi load Pt &#8211; 143
F out Max &#8211; 0
Tm base &#8211; 0
Tm correct &#8211; 1.27
Af Trdelay &#8211; 0
Fe Smooth &#8211; 30
Use Ve Table #1
Spkbase &#8211; 15.0

AFR tracking
Min TPS &#8211; 2.500
Min RPM &#8211; 2400
Min load &#8211; 331.5
Lean Lim% - 10.0
Rich Lim% - 10.0
Gain &#8211; 5.2
2000R &#8211; 11.5
3000R &#8211; 11.5
4000R &#8211; 11.5
5000R &#8211; 11.5
6000R &#8211; 11.5
7000R &#8211; 11.5
8000R &#8211; 11.5
Aux % - 0


Air Temp
ALL SET TO 0%


Aux Trig
ALL SET TO 0%


AF User Tune Hi, Mid, Low All set to 0%


Tune Response
TPS enrich - 0.50
TPS Decay &#8211; 0.70
TB Size &#8211; 7
TPS Mapmax &#8211; 104.0
MAP Enrich &#8211; 0.40
Bst Enrich &#8211; 0.10
MAP TPSmin &#8211; 0.400
MAP RPMmin &#8211; 2560
MAFlim TPS - 0.000
MAF Limit &#8211; 0.0
MAF /Krpm &#8211; 0.0
Lim MinRPM &#8211; 0
Lim Time &#8211; 0.0


Spark WOT
2000RPM &#8211; 15%
2500RPM &#8211; 15%
3000RPM &#8211; 15%
3500RPM &#8211; 15%
4000RPM &#8211; 15%
4500RPM &#8211; 15%
5000RPM &#8211; 15%
5500RPM &#8211; 15%
6000RPM &#8211; 15%
6500RPM &#8211; 15%
7000RPM &#8211; 15%
7500RPM &#8211; 15%
8000RPM &#8211; 15%

Spark Aux
2000RPM &#8211; 15%
2500RPM &#8211; 15%
3000RPM &#8211; 15%
3500RPM &#8211; 15%
4000RPM &#8211; 15%
4500RPM &#8211; 15%
5000RPM &#8211; 15%
5500RPM &#8211; 15%
6000RPM &#8211; 15%
6500RPM &#8211; 15%
7000RPM &#8211; 15%
7500RPM &#8211; 15%
8000RPM &#8211; 15%

 

[mhopemk3]

I would turn off PT tracking, get a decent tune first then switch over to PT tracking. All cars are different but after disabling PT tracking I would pull maybe 10% mainscale then start pulling from your low, mid and high tunes.

I wouldn't mess with VE tables at this point.

Why would you think your guages and or TPS are off?

 

[Zumtizzle]

Sounds like you need a tune on a dyno.

Sure it's setup for 550's?

 

[sneakypete]

if you have no idea what your doing, then go and get it tuned professionally. read up in the piggyback section if you think you can figure it out. its pretty basic if you have a laptop, and the maftpro is hooked up to a wideband

 

[Fletch124]

I would turn off PT tracking, get a decent tune first then switch over to PT tracking. All cars are different but after disabling PT tracking I would pull maybe 10% mainscale then start pulling from your low, mid and high tunes.

I wouldn't mess with VE tables at this point.

Why would you think your guages and or TPS are off?

Ok I will search up on how to turn off PT tracking. Ok so low, mid, then high. There is a .3-.4AFR difference my UEGO and the MAFT.

Sounds like you need a tune on a dyno.

Sure it's setup for 550's?

How do I set it up for 550s then? Closest dyno is in Sac.

if you have no idea what your doing, then go and get it tuned professionally. read up in the piggyback section if you think you can figure it out. its pretty basic if you have a laptop, and the maftpro is hooked up to a wideband

I understand tuning im just not sure what tables to start tuning with. Yup Im running my old Dell in the car.

 

[americanjebus]

Change these values they should help.

Version 5.03
Vehicle select &#8211; 0
# of cylinders &#8211; 6
Displacement &#8211; 3.0
Airfl mode &#8211; Speed density
Map source &#8211; Gm 3 Bar
Load Srce &#8211;Use MAP
Baro mode &#8211; Sealevel <-Read @ key on
F-out mode &#8211; Supra mkiii
V-out1 mode &#8211; Set max setting <-use setpoint
V-out2 mode &#8211; Set max setting <- use setpoint
AFR source &#8211; 5v aem gauge
F-in m ode &#8211; Supra mkiii
Aux 1 mode &#8211; Aux trig off
Flowerr mde &#8211; Sd/maf

Setup
Mainscale - 0.0 <- You need to adjust this for the extra fuel that is being added to your system. Read this your answer should be ~ -4.5 with 38psi on 550's.

To calculate mainscale: taken from fullthrottletech.
"If you are using an adjustable fuel pressure regulator (which you should at this point) follow this formula to see what fuel pressure to use and based on that, how much of the maincale you should reduce...

Firsts:
Divide the new fuel pressure by the old Fuel pressure and then get the square root of that.

Second:
Multiply that square root (results from the first step) by the injector size that you have, and that will give you the new injector flow for that size injector at the new fuel pressure.
Here is an example:
28psi/43.5psi = 0.64367
now get the squareroot of 0.64367 which is = 0.802290
now multiply that result by the injector size
0.802290 x 720cc = 577cc

So at your new fuel pressure of 28psi the 720cc injectors are flowing at 577cc.
This means that at that fuel pressure of 28psi the 577cc are flowing about 31&#37; more than the stockers (440cc) which would allow you to bring the maincale somewhere in the area of -30%."


To turn off the PTT go into the PTT settings and change all the TPS values to zero. The way it works is the PTT is engaged at tps voltages less than the ones entered. So if you entered 2.0v, so positions that make less than 2.0v engage the PTT. Zero makes it so it will never turn on.

If the values dont match up between the guages and the maftpro you have grounding issues. Noise per say in the grounds, relocate you aem ground to be on the same sources as the maftpro but NOT on the exact same lug.

Hope this helps some. Main thing is to shut off PTT.


*VE TABLE
The table is set up in KPA vs rpm. The numbers on the left hand side are KPA values. 100kpa = 14.7 or atmospheric pressure that is when your manifold is transitioning from vacuum to positive pressure or 0 psi on your boost guage. 200 kpa ~ 14.7 psi of boost.

Drive around with the VE table open and hit CTR-L, this engages ALDL data tracing and will highlight the area of the VE table being utilized. that way you know what part of the table is doing what.

 

[Fletch124]

Change these values they should help.

Version 5.03
Vehicle select – 0
# of cylinders – 6
Displacement – 3.0
Airfl mode – Speed density
Map source – Gm 3 Bar
Load Srce –Use MAP
Baro mode – Sealevel <-Read @ key on
F-out mode – Supra mkiii
V-out1 mode – Set max setting <-use setpoint
V-out2 mode – Set max setting <- use setpoint
AFR source – 5v aem gauge
F-in m ode – Supra mkiii
Aux 1 mode – Aux trig off
Flowerr mde – Sd/maf

Setup
Mainscale - 0.0 <- You need to adjust this for the extra fuel that is being added to your system. Read this your answer should be ~ -4.5 with 38psi on 550's.

To calculate mainscale: taken from fullthrottletech.
"If you are using an adjustable fuel pressure regulator (which you should at this point) follow this formula to see what fuel pressure to use and based on that, how much of the maincale you should reduce...

Firsts:
Divide the new fuel pressure by the old Fuel pressure and then get the square root of that.

Second:
Multiply that square root (results from the first step) by the injector size that you have, and that will give you the new injector flow for that size injector at the new fuel pressure.
Here is an example:
28psi/43.5psi = 0.64367
now get the squareroot of 0.64367 which is = 0.802290
now multiply that result by the injector size
0.802290 x 720cc = 577cc

So at your new fuel pressure of 28psi the 720cc injectors are flowing at 577cc.
This means that at that fuel pressure of 28psi the 577cc are flowing about 31% more than the stockers (440cc) which would allow you to bring the maincale somewhere in the area of -30%."


To turn off the PTT go into the PTT settings and change all the TPS values to zero. The way it works is the PTT is engaged at tps voltages less than the ones entered. So if you entered 2.0v, so positions that make less than 2.0v engage the PTT. Zero makes it so it will never turn on.

If the values dont match up between the guages and the maftpro you have grounding issues. Noise per say in the grounds, relocate you aem ground to be on the same sources as the maftpro but NOT on the exact same lug.

Hope this helps some. Main thing is to shut off PTT.


*VE TABLE
The table is set up in KPA vs rpm. The numbers on the left hand side are KPA values. 100kpa = 14.7 or atmospheric pressure that is when your manifold is transitioning from vacuum to positive pressure or 0 psi on your boost guage. 200 kpa ~ 14.7 psi of boost.

Drive around with the VE table open and hit CTR-L, this engages ALDL data tracing and will highlight the area of the VE table being utilized. that way you know what part of the table is doing what.

There is no setting in V5.03 for to change the Vout1/2 to "Use set point". But there is "GM Map 3 bar" and most of the other settings are for MAFs.

I turned off PTT tracking and cruising AFRs got more irratic.

TurboBob on FullThrottleTech told me to start off with a mainscale of -18. So im not sure what to use for my main scale. At the moment I believe its at -15.

Thanks for the help.

 

[Fletch124]

A buddy of mine and I went out started tuning the car somewhat. We got a good WOT tune but cruising was just fine. When we were heading back getting close to his house the car started idling pretty bad and started dieing when i pushed in the clutch coming to a stop. We tuned that out a little bit thought. On the way back home cruising AFRs were erratic again.

 

[americanjebus]

How are you going about tuning this thing?

Are you emulating as you drive and adjusting your user tune tables or are you adjusting the VE table?

Are you tuning for your vf signal (aux input 1 voltage) to be 2.5v?

What is it averaging at right now? 0.0v or ~5v?

have you fixed the issue with the readouts on the laptop, maftpro, and guages not being the same?

 

[Fletch124]

How are you going about tuning this thing?

Are you emulating as you drive and adjusting your user tune tables or are you adjusting the VE table?

Are you tuning for your vf signal (aux input 1 voltage) to be 2.5v?

What is it averaging at right now? 0.0v or ~5v?

have you fixed the issue with the readouts on the laptop, maftpro, and guages not being the same?

Im using just the AF User tables at the moment. VE tables are honestly a little bit intimidating. But once learned about the (CRTL+L) its not as much anymore. But I haven't messed with them at all. But using the VE tables really is not going to work well cause I ran into another problem. We would go out drive around and tune the car pretty well. And yes im emulating when driving. Stop somewhere and shut the computer down. Well when we came back out it was like all of our tune was gone but the parameters were the same as when we saved them. I decided that I was going to just look into the AF User tunes in the box and I found a big problem! A few of the parameters were set to 62.5&#37;! But the computer shows the parameters how we set it. So now we are just using the box to tune the car. It actually idles, cruises, and boosts! I cleaned up the battery cables connectors and changed the wideband ground to another bolt on the steering column. AFRs between the computer are off even more, a whole 1.0AFR now. I need to change that to the same ground again.

Thanks for all the help! I was getting so frustrated I was honestly thinking about just getting bigger injectors and going back to the Lex AFM.

Oh and I set the fuel pressure to ~38PSI and the main scale to -4.5%. Works a bit better now. How much vacuum is that line running to the regulator supposed to pulling at idle? Cause Im getting BARELY any at all.

At full boost, I can only ask the car for 13psi at the most with my Profec B; Im in the low 10AFRs at full boost. My DSM buddy that has been tuning cars for quite a long times says thats a pretty safe tune since im only on 91. I think its a little on the rich side but im better safe than sorry.

 

[americanjebus]

Where is your maftpro grounded too? Ground the wideband to the same place as the pro, preferably that long metal bar behind the dash, you have to take out the glove box to get to it.

Where are you getting the power for your laptop? Are you using a cig light adapter or battery, try to use battery at all times for tuning. Also double check your xdf files that your tunerpro is using and make sure they are the exact same version as the software version of the pro.

I had the same issue at first with the tune being lost when i changed stuff with the laptop. My suggestion is create a completely new bin from scratch. Go over all the tables including the air temp corrections which for some reason is at 64&#37; across the board, and reset them to zero. Save this bin. Then emulate with the pro, make sure to use the arrow that says Download to tuner pro. Go to save changes and now you have a base. Remember that you download from the pro to your computer and upload from your computer to your pro. I got them backwards at first and made things 10x more frustrating.

After doing that your pro and laptop should be on the same page.

 

[Fletch124]

Where is your maftpro grounded too? Ground the wideband to the same place as the pro, preferably that long metal bar behind the dash, you have to take out the glove box to get to it.

Where are you getting the power for your laptop? Are you using a cig light adapter or battery, try to use battery at all times for tuning. Also double check your xdf files that your tunerpro is using and make sure they are the exact same version as the software version of the pro.

I had the same issue at first with the tune being lost when i changed stuff with the laptop. My suggestion is create a completely new bin from scratch. Go over all the tables including the air temp corrections which for some reason is at 64% across the board, and reset them to zero. Save this bin. Then emulate with the pro, make sure to use the arrow that says Download to tuner pro. Go to save changes and now you have a base. Remember that you download from the pro to your computer and upload from your computer to your pro. I got them backwards at first and made things 10x more frustrating.

After doing that your pro and laptop should be on the same page.

For the MAFTPRO ground; its spliced into the ECU harness and through a kill switch. I thought the MAFTPRO wideband ground had to be in the same place as the wideband ground? Should I ground all of them to the same place?

Got the car cruising pretty good earlier. Then on the way home from work cruising was so rich the car would kick back and forth sometimes.

What do you think about flashing to an earlier update than 5.03?

When I was using the laptop I have to use an AC inverter, the battery is so shot in the notebook that after being unplugged for 4 seconds it dies.

I turned off AFR Tracking too by turning the TPS values to 0. This made the car cruise a little bit better.

Seems like the car is always locked in closed loop(MAFTPRO controlled). Its getting to the point where I just want to turn off the Low and Mid tables so the car cruises and doesnt waste a ridiculous amount of fuel if thats even possible.

 

[americanjebus]

That kill switch may be causing your trouble. Make sure the wideband and maftpro are grounded to the same place but not the same lug if that makes sense.

I run 4.8 with no issues and it works awesome, no experience with 5.03, i'd try 4.8.

Also running your laptop with the AC inverter is going to mess things up. Many people have had this issue and it throws off all the data being read by the laptop for some god forsaken reason.

Your car wont be totally maftpro controlled at the low or mid regions unless your stock o2 sensor is unplugged. Right now your changes to those tables are fighting the stock tune and your stock tune is pulling things out of whack. What is your output for aux 1 voltage? Is it pegged at 0.0 volts or high up past 4.4v? Use the sensor monitor on your maftpro to look at this value so your not messing things up with the ac adaptor for your laptop.

Best recommendation, get everything reading the same data first. Take care of those inconsistencies and move on from there.

 

[Fletch124]

That kill switch may be causing your trouble. Make sure the wideband and maftpro are grounded to the same place but not the same lug if that makes sense.

I run 4.8 with no issues and it works awesome, no experience with 5.03, i'd try 4.8.

Also running your laptop with the AC inverter is going to mess things up. Many people have had this issue and it throws off all the data being read by the laptop for some god forsaken reason.

Your car wont be totally maftpro controlled at the low or mid regions unless your stock o2 sensor is unplugged. Right now your changes to those tables are fighting the stock tune and your stock tune is pulling things out of whack. What is your output for aux 1 voltage? Is it pegged at 0.0 volts or high up past 4.4v? Use the sensor monitor on your maftpro to look at this value so your not messing things up with the ac adaptor for your laptop.

Best recommendation, get everything reading the same data first. Take care of those inconsistencies and move on from there.

By not the same lug you mean forsay a beam of metal with 2 bolts 1" from each other, wideband ground on one and the maftpro ground on the other?

Aux1 voltage is pegged 0.00V.

Ill fix the grounds now and reflash to 4.8.

 

[Fletch124]

I cant get the gauges and the computer to line up. I even tried grounding it all straight to the battery. Didnt improve anything.

Aux1 voltage is at 0.00 sometimes, then others its flickering between .8x-.9x and sometimes in 1.xx.

I reflashed to 4.8 aswell.

Accelerating AFRs are awesome, they stay between 14.6-15.2AFR. But once I get to my cruising speed AFRS jump from 12s-16sAFRs, then sometimes its ok it will hang around 14.6-15.2AFR.

This is getting so frustrating.

 

[americanjebus]

By not the same lug you mean forsay a beam of metal with 2 bolts 1" from each other, wideband ground on one and the maftpro ground on the other?

Aux1 voltage is pegged 0.00V.

Ill fix the grounds now and reflash to 4.8.

thats exactly what i mean by the grounds.

aux1 voltage at 0.0 means your ecu is trying to pull the maximum amount of fuel possible wherever it is at anything less than 2.0v. Try bumping the mainscale down further in the negatives a little bit at a time until this voltage bumps up a tiney bit again. Watch this voltage at idle, cruise, PT accel and WOT. First priority to keep the voltage from not going over 2.5 volts at WOT and the rest will follow. By taking more fuel from your mainscale the pro will remove fuel from the entire map and get you closer to an even tune to start from. once your getting values ~1-3 volts in most of those ranges your tune adjustments will actually do something vs just fight the stock ECU.
You can only do so much with the mainscale to actually get the aux 1 voltage anywhere near where you want it ~ 2.5 volts you have to go over the VE table. User tunes wont help this part but will still be effective once you get your mainscale some where to the point it makes your fuel map easier to tune.

the fluctuating AFR's are normal to an extent. The AFRs should level out when under load but of course when your driving the engine is not under load at all times, (IE you let off when you hit your cruising speed a bit and press a tiney bit more) this will cause the afrs to jump anywhere from 12-16, mine does this. Usually i'm happy when the AFR's just hover around 14-15 and when i let off even a bit on the gas the unburnt stuff will richen up my guage to as far as 11.

This takes time, your getting there.

 

[Fletch124]

thats exactly what i mean by the grounds.

aux1 voltage at 0.0 means your ecu is trying to pull the maximum amount of fuel possible wherever it is at anything less than 2.0v. Try bumping the mainscale down further in the negatives a little bit at a time until this voltage bumps up a tiney bit again. Watch this voltage at idle, cruise, PT accel and WOT. First priority to keep the voltage from not going over 2.5 volts at WOT and the rest will follow. By taking more fuel from your mainscale the pro will remove fuel from the entire map and get you closer to an even tune to start from. once your getting values ~1-3 volts in most of those ranges your tune adjustments will actually do something vs just fight the stock ECU.
You can only do so much with the mainscale to actually get the aux 1 voltage anywhere near where you want it ~ 2.5 volts you have to go over the VE table. User tunes wont help this part but will still be effective once you get your mainscale some where to the point it makes your fuel map easier to tune.

the fluctuating AFR's are normal to an extent. The AFRs should level out when under load but of course when your driving the engine is not under load at all times, (IE you let off when you hit your cruising speed a bit and press a tiney bit more) this will cause the afrs to jump anywhere from 12-16, mine does this. Usually i'm happy when the AFR's just hover around 14-15 and when i let off even a bit on the gas the unburnt stuff will richen up my guage to as far as 11.

This takes time, your getting there.

Ok i will try pulling more fuel from the mainscale and playing it more.

Things that really frustrates me is sometimes it works awesome, then others its like im back in square 1. For example today after work I was heading to my friends house and the AFRs were really clean, 14.7-15.2AFR cruising at 75mph on the freeway the whole way, but at just about every single light to car would die when i was coming to a stop and stepped on the clutch(AFRs were pegged rich so obviously it was drowning the motor) and I had to rev it a few times to get it to actually climb back to idling AFRs(mid14-mid15), then earlier today it would idle great then after idling for a bit it would start richening up and drown it self again. On the way home on the freeway doing the same speed my AFRs were jumping from 10.0-mid12AFR. It really cant decide whether it wants to stay in closed or open loop.

My AFRs even out very nicely when its under throttle(14.7-15.2AFR) absolutely every single time im on the gas, makes me half way tempted to always stay in it just so the wideband will keep me happy from seeing erratic AFRs.

Ohh and just to remind you I did turn off AFR tracking, and PTT tracking by turning all the values to 0&#37; on the TPS scales.

I completely rewired my wideband today so it has its own dedicated "lug" ground, the MAFTPRO/wideband ground, and the MAFTPRO ground are all within ~1" of each other on their own bolt on the steering column. Gauges still dont line up with the computer. Maybe reinstalling the software might help?

 

[americanjebus]

Wow, even i'm starting to get frustrated with your car, heh.

Is the laptop getting data similar to your pro yet? If you can try to create a bin folder and log a drive from idle to cruise to WOT to decell maybe i can comb through it. Save the .adl file/s with it.

just hit f4 -> select log file for record or play, create a new one and save that so i can take a look at it. I need the bin so i can check out if your settings are all in order. Maybe i can just adjust the main settings and send it back to you so you at least have a baseline to keep your car running right.

If that doesnt work, something else is wrong. How did you do your wiring; clips, crimps, or solder?

 

[Fletch124]

Wow, even i'm starting to get frustrated with your car, heh.

Is the laptop getting data similar to your pro yet? If you can try to create a bin folder and log a drive from idle to cruise to WOT to decell maybe i can comb through it. Save the .adl file/s with it.

just hit f4 -> select log file for record or play, create a new one and save that so i can take a look at it. I need the bin so i can check out if your settings are all in order. Maybe i can just adjust the main settings and send it back to you so you at least have a baseline to keep your car running right.

If that doesnt work, something else is wrong. How did you do your wiring; clips, crimps, or solder?

I played with the mainscale some more today. It cruises fine most of the time, then sometimes it will richen up and stick around 10-11AFR, I usually get so frustrated by looking at it and the car bucking back and forth I just downshift and step on it. After that it usually starts being a little nicer during cruising.

No my computer still isnt happy with the MAFTPRO, funny thing is though that the values on Sensor Monitor are actually exactly the same as the gauges or very close. Reinstall software? And Im going to buy a new battery for it soon because the battery thats in it now will die after being unplugged for more than a few seconds. Im pretty sure the AFR is really close, but the boost gauge is off. The only time its correct is when the car is off, both say 0. Once running they have their differences.

I soldered, and wrapped every connection with electrical tape.

 

[americanjebus]

I'd just reinstall tunerpro and start from scratch with your xdf and aldl files.

If your boost guage is the only one being funky then its probably the gauge itself that is having problems, a shitty vacuum connection in the bay in or around the area you have your boost gauge and MAP sensor tapped in could be causing some of these problems.

Until you can log your data or identify exactly why its adding so much fuel in random pulses there isnt much we can do. Try just downloading all of your settings into a bin file even w/ the ac adapter and post them up to see if we can narrow down any other issues that may be causing trouble.