Lemon Racer Intro

btgalush

New Member
Mar 27, 2011
4
0
0
San Mateo
Hello,

I am a GPS software engineer who races a MKIII turbo in 24 hour of Lemons series. I have been carefully watching PI's disassembly thread and building boards, but would like to get more involved in the software development.

To date we have torn out the interior of our Supra, added a roll cage, cut the springs for stiffness, and put in a Momo wheel and com system. We lost a head gasket on our 7MGTE last race, and will be doing some engine work to prepare for the next race.

Below photos are day of Thunderhill Arse-Sweat-Apalooza and use using the lift and scales to figure out the cg so we knew how much to cut the springs.
cgPhoto.jpgarriveThunderhill.jpg
 

Turbo Habanero

New Member
Apr 28, 2009
4,229
0
0
36
Tucson,AZ
you just cut stock springs? In the second photo the car looks stock ride height

Wouldn't it better to spend money on coilovers on a race car?
Or even just spend $200 on some good springs..

Anyhow welcome to SM
 

btgalush

New Member
Mar 27, 2011
4
0
0
San Mateo
$200 is where the problem lies, the rules for 24 hours of Lemons is that the car plus anything that makes it go faster (including suspension) has to be less than $500, it is hard enough to find and get a MKIII supra running for $500, much less have money left over for springs and dampers. The other issue is even if you can get cheap springs they usually won't fit the stock dampers which means new dampers and really blows the budget. So the theory goes the cut springs get us a stiffer spring by reducing the number of active coils and lower ride height, both of which are things we want for the track. And since we are just cutting (with a neighbors vertical band saw to avoid ruining the temper of the springs) it is a $0 mod as far as the rules are concerned.

The ride height is slightly lowered, but your right we are close to stock ride height for two reasons. One we had to put some spacers in the front to maintain spring capture at full droop, and so we had some suspension travel and weren't on the stock bump stops. This is not ideal, but it was scrap aluminum that a friend in a shop nearby turned down for us. We actually run front springs/shocks in the rear as well which are also cut so get the higher damping and spring rate of the front shocks/springs. We have the spring rate data of both the rear and front springs and we can get them up on the forum for those who are interested. Lastly the wheel wells look vacant because we run tires that are about an inch smaller diameter than stock. This gives us tighter gear ratios, better acceleration and less sidewall. We still have plenty of gearbox since at 100mph (which is close to our top speed at Thunderhill) we are nearing redline in 4th gear. This is a "$0" mod since tires and wheels are not included in the $500 budget.

Despite being a bunch of non-mechanical engineers we get some help from a close friend that works for 3R Racing (Denver) and has a masters in racing. He brings a lot of the race theory to the puzzle that we implement.

Official 24 hours of Lemons rules here:
http://www.24hoursoflemons.com/pricesandrules.aspx


PI yes our team would really like to help on the application SW side. Since Lemon's is an endurance race we have 4 drivers and 3 out of the 4 are SW engineers and the last is a rocket builder. We have good experience and tool access for doing PC development in C, C++, and C#. We also have quite a bit of embedded experience and iOS knowledge if we ever want to port over to iOS devices, although the PC is a much easier place to start. 2 of us do a lot of GUI work, and the third has web language experience.

I PMed JonS requesting GUI assembla access so hopefully we can help out.
 

Turbo Habanero

New Member
Apr 28, 2009
4,229
0
0
36
Tucson,AZ
btgalush;1752909 said:
$200 is where the problem lies, the rules for 24 hours of Lemons is that the car plus anything that makes it go faster (including suspension) has to be less than $500, it is hard enough to find and get a MKIII supra running for $500, much less have money left over for springs and dampers. The other issue is even if you can get cheap springs they usually won't fit the stock dampers which means new dampers and really blows the budget. So the theory goes the cut springs get us a stiffer spring by reducing the number of active coils and lower ride height, both of which are things we want for the track. And since we are just cutting (with a neighbors vertical band saw to avoid ruining the temper of the springs) it is a $0 mod as far as the rules are concerned.

The ride height is slightly lowered, but your right we are close to stock ride height for two reasons. One we had to put some spacers in the front to maintain spring capture at full droop, and so we had some suspension travel and weren't on the stock bump stops. This is not ideal, but it was scrap aluminum that a friend in a shop nearby turned down for us. We actually run front springs/shocks in the rear as well which are also cut so get the higher damping and spring rate of the front shocks/springs. We have the spring rate data of both the rear and front springs and we can get them up on the forum for those who are interested. Lastly the wheel wells look vacant because we run tires that are about an inch smaller diameter than stock. This gives us tighter gear ratios, better acceleration and less sidewall. We still have plenty of gearbox since at 100mph (which is close to our top speed at Thunderhill) we are nearing redline in 4th gear. This is a "$0" mod since tires and wheels are not included in the $500 budget.

Despite being a bunch of non-mechanical engineers we get some help from a close friend that works for 3R Racing (Denver) and has a masters in racing. He brings a lot of the race theory to the puzzle that we implement.

Official 24 hours of Lemons rules here:
http://www.24hoursoflemons.com/pricesandrules.aspx


PI yes our team would really like to help on the application SW side. Since Lemon's is an endurance race we have 4 drivers and 3 out of the 4 are SW engineers and the last is a rocket builder. We have good experience and tool access for doing PC development in C, C++, and C#. We also have quite a bit of embedded experience and iOS knowledge if we ever want to port over to iOS devices, although the PC is a much easier place to start. 2 of us do a lot of GUI work, and the third has web language experience.

I PMed JonS requesting GUI assembla access so hopefully we can help out.

How exactly do they come up with a set cost of mods for the $500 limit? How do they know what you spent I.E getting parts from junk yards or used how does that work?
 

91Supra313

New Member
Jul 30, 2009
1,062
0
0
Clarksville TN
Hey man, I have some lowering springs just sitting in the basement. I hooked up one of our other Lemon's racers with some shocks dirt cheap. $75 for the whole set. Let me know if you are interested. hks88supra@yahoo.com since I am rarely on here anymore.
 
lemons is awesome. Check out my lemons car!

IMG_1301%5B1%5D.JPG


and

HZ3BR.jpg
 

te72

Classifieds Moderator
Staff member
Mar 26, 2006
6,610
7
38
41
WHYoming
There was another member on here doing the Lemons thing, or possibly the Grassroots $20xx challenge, I forget which. Either way, his car turned out pretty nicely. Good luck, and feel free to post up progress along the way! :)
 

btgalush

New Member
Mar 27, 2011
4
0
0
San Mateo
To answer how they determine if you are over the $500, there is a BS panel that judges your car. The key input parameters are: what you put on the bribe table, how serious is your theme (do you have a giant car length space shuttle on top of your car?), does it look stock, and how shiny is it. Then depending on your judge (they vary widely) you will get between zero and a million penalty laps, and placed in class A-C, where A is the fastest (MkIII supra) and C is the slowest (original Mini). There are class winners in addition to the overall winner.

Now obviously the judges can't see things like forged pistons, but there are equalizers for that too. If your a dick and really fast at noon on the second day all the teams vote for the peoples curse and if there are enough votes your car is crushed on the spot, usually via a front loader, but sometimes an excavator. You do have 30 minutes to remove valuables...so that's a consolation. The other equalizer is that the organizers can buy your car for $500 at the end of the race if they think you are blatantly cheating.

Pictures of bribe table and another 7MGE supra with space shuttle attached.
spaceshuttle.jpgbribeTable.JPG