It's getting old fast, oil in air filter now!

[AjWit]

EDIT: Pictures on page 2.

Please read this, i'm sooo pissed at my car right now.

As you are probably aware from my last 5 posts, i took three weeks doing my HG job w/ arp's so that it was done right, head machined and hot tanked(cleaned), then assembled with viton valve stem seals. Started up on first try when complete.

Been having real oil issues since i finished it, all relating to the turbo. The oil line on the turbo was leaking at the flange where it meets the turbo, i fixed the leak, all better. Not! The next day i'm driving under normal conditions, shifting at 3500. In third, around 3000 rpm's, i lose all boost and then a HUGE white smoke cloud appers behind my car on the highway. The turbo was just burning oil like no other, then i noticed oil in my air filter. I said screw this, swapped turbo's with another spare ct-26 from an 89(different wastegate), cleaned out the accordian, afm, and filter, then drove it around for a day, all is well.

Today i go outside to start it and as soon as it warmed up, in like a minute, the smoke show continued. I turn it off, borrow a friends truck to drive to work, come home a few hours later. Start it, no smoke(or very little), drive it around the block once, OK, the second time around, SMOKE EVERYWHERE! No boost. Make it around the corner home, turn off. Pop hood and boy am i pissed again, the subframe area under the air filter looks like a black swimming pool! The turbo's compressor side has oil covering the entire outside of it, no wonder the damn thing smokes. So thats two turbo's in maybe three days.

All the lines are connected properly, i even bought new hardware, no oil leaks, no coolant leaks under the car. But my accordian, afm, and filter and all acting as a stream for the oil to roll down and puddle under the filter, i'm getting so sick of this car you have no idea. If i showed you a picture you're mouth may drop as to how much oil came out on a less than a mile drive around my neighborhood. Any help or past experiences?, i NEED this car fixed like last week! Please help and thank you for reading.

 

[supraman666]

check the shaft in the turbo for lateral play there should be none there should be a little play if you push and pull straight in and out but not alot if so your berrings are shot replace or rebuild turbo. also check the lowest ic pipe for oil build up i got like half a quart from there when my turbo went. if all that is good check the hoses that come off valve covers into intake pipes it may be coming from there too.

 

[AjWit]

If there was too much oil in the system, like 6-7 quarts, would the excess be pushed through those hoses and back to the accordian, because when my car was been leaking and burning oil i have been adding more, its possible that theres too much i guess. Also, if i try to go WOT at lower rpm's the car stutters, literally it will jerk and then fix itself if i leave the pedal down under a load. The turbo had very minimal side to side play and no in and out play. My last turbo was also the same way, except that one i think actually went, i went from 6psi to 0(not vacuum but 0), and then the white smoke ensued. This one builds boost, but will shoot a little smoke once it spools up. No boost controller in the car either, all stock besides the IC upper hard pipes and an aftermarket BOV.

 

[jdub]

Are you sure the turbo oil feed or return is not leaking?

Where exactly is the oil level on the dipstick?

A quart over the full mark is what I run on a normal basis. There would have to be way over that to cause a problem.

Suggest you check engine codes too.

 

[supraman666]

you said it was coming from the inside if the intake hose right? if it is, it isnt goin to be a feed or return line its contained to the turbo and intake system. drain the oil get a thicker weight and put the recomended amount in. if the oil still comes out try another turbo if available.i had the same problem with to much oil in the engine i had a leak kept adding the dip stick was all fucked up so didnt know actual amount. i ended up with 9 quarts of oil in the pan not including what was in the ic and hoses.

 

[AjWit]

I'll try draing and re filling with 5 quarts i guess, use a 5W-30 this time. Would any of the oil problems explain why it sputters under WOT while going up a hill? That still concerns me.

 

[dumbo]

check the shaft in the turbo for lateral play there should be none there should be a little play if you push and pull straight in and out but not alot if so your berrings are shot replace or rebuild turbo. also check the lowest ic pipe for oil build up i got like half a quart from there when my turbo went. if all that is good check the hoses that come off valve covers into intake pipes it may be coming from there too.

Pretty sure it's no axial play, minium radial play.

How are you getting engine oil in the AFM, that blows my mind. As jdub stated, I would be looking at the oil feed/return lines. The turbo I bet has nothing to do with it. Infact I would do everything jdub stated Boost leak somewhere...:hsugh: And whats with the white smoke?

 

[jdub]

you said it was coming from the inside if the intake hose right? if it is, it isnt goin to be a feed or return line its contained to the turbo and intake system. drain the oil get a thicker weight and put the recomended amount in. if the oil still comes out try another turbo if available.i had the same problem with to much oil in the engine i had a leak kept adding the dip stick was all fucked up so didnt know actual amount. i ended up with 9 quarts of oil in the pan not including what was in the ic and hoses.

He didn't say if it was the inside or not...he did say the outside of the turbo was covered in oil.

A thicker weight oil is not going to do squat for this...that kind of advice is an exercise in futility.

You can easily get 10 quarts in the pan before it starts to get to the level of the crank. Every oil system is different, depending on the cooler circuit, presence of a remote filter, etc...putting in the stock amount may or may not be adequate. Like I said, I fill until the oil level is at the top mark on the dipstick, then add a quart. That becomes the new "full" mark.

It sounds like you need to learn how to read a dipstick.

I'll try draing and re filling with 5 quarts i guess, use a 5W-30 this time. Would any of the oil problems explain why it sputters under WOT while going up a hill? That still concerns me.

See above on the oil...if your current fill is good, I wouldn't change it. The oil has nothing to do with the "sputter"...that's why I suggested you check codes.

 

[GrimJack]

Never seen a case *that* bad, but how much blowby does your engine have, and how are your PCV lines routed? Extreme blowby (like that caused when you've melted a piston) will blow a lot of oil into the accordion hose, some of it will get sucked back in and cause white smoke, the rest will pool out the air filter and the fans will blow it all over the place.

 

[dumbo]

But white smoke from oil just doesn't sound right:nono:

 

[jdub]

If it burns hot enough, it will produce a white smoke

 

[AjWit]

If you guys want pictures i will be happy to take and post them, oil on the dipstick looks normal, goes to about the top of the flat tip(where it meets the rest of the actual stick). There is oil, not residue, but oil on the outside of the compressor side of the turbo, not the exducer(exhaust) side. The white smoke will come from the tailpipe and from the actual turbo itself under the hood, so it really is a smoke show when the car warms up. The inside of the turbo on the intake side, the metal opening where the accordian connects to is free of oil, so it doesnt seem to be coming from there, when i took the air filter off the afm i noticed the stream of oil that was the source of my oil swimming pool below the filter.

Can someone also please give me the instructions on how to check for codes, never done it but have an idea how to. Thank you.

 

[lewis15498]

Instructions and code definitions can be found in a haynes repair manual, also available on line.
Next to the fuse box under the hood there is a a rectangular plug with a cover. open it. Using a METAL paper clip or jumper wire connect pins labeled E1 and TE1. Turn your key to the on position but dont start the car. your check engine light will blink intermitttently if there is no problem. if there are codes it will blink the codes in the following format.
* =blink
_ =pause

***_**_ _ ****_****_ _ _

This example would mean codes 32 and 44
When the sequence is complete it will repeat itself.

 

[IJ.]

Any PCV mods?

9 Qt's is just below the crank I think 10 would be dipping.

 

[jdub]

http://www.cygnusx1.net/supra/TechTips/engine_error_codes.aspx

 

[AjWit]

Thank you for the instructions, i'll do that now. In the mean time, check out some pics i took. These are all current and with the newer of the two turbo's that i have.

I actually think this is a possilility, whenever i had the oil leak before, it somehow blew oil everywhere under my hood, i'm thinking that the air filter pulled a good bit of it towards it and thats why i have a oiled air filter and oil around the air filter. I am also thinking that the oil in the afm and accordian are from being sucked through the air filter, then when the turbo sucks it in it gets burned off and thus the smoke from the turbo and the tailpipe.

This is where my oil pressure gauge sits after the car has been on and revved up multiple times, it rises when you rev it to about the first line, but then goes back down to this.

This would be the afm and removed air filter area, lots of sitting oil, and some left in the afm.

Just a under the hood pic, so you can see what i have in there.

video of the tailpipe smoke right after start up, car wasn't even warmed up yet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-VJhgdY6Mo&feature=channel_page

 

[dumbo]

Ok, that looks blue to me, least its not coolant. With that much oil you'd think you could literally see it streaming out. As for your oil pressure as long as it goes up when you rev it I wouldn't worry to much. Specs are in the TSRM.

EDIT: Whats that little filter/breather for? Vented BOV, stock ECU?

 

[AjWit]

I checked for codes, this is the only one i got.
Code 14 Ignition:
Diagnosis
No "IGF" signal to ECU "A" times in succession.
A = 6-8 (7M-GE)
A= 3 (7M-GTE)

Trouble Area
Igniter and ignition coil circuit
Igniter and ignition coil
ECU
-------------------------------------------

I'm sorry guys, but what does this mean and how can i fix it.

Dumbo: I do have an open vented BOV and that breather is actually a plug, i put the filter over top so it looks better.

 

[IJ.]

So the engine is sucking a SHITLOAD of pirate air through the little filter.... :nono:

 

[jetjock]

Arrrr! No wait...he said it was a plug with a filter on it