hi im getting a 1jz installed in my mk3 supra and i was wondering if i should keep the hydro clutch fan on it or should i try somthing else?:1zhelp:
hydro clutch fan
- Thread starter driftking786
- Start date
from what i've searched for. Keep it. I've felt the power of it first hand from JoeyDaze it sure does pull alot of air. I felt it near the windsheild with the hood open like if my hand was near the blade.
driftking786 said:
Keep the Hydro fan. I have it and I love it. I had twin Electrics in my car prior to the current ones and the Hydro fan wins hands down.
I have driven up some really long uphill mountain roads in a lot of heat and never had any temperature spikes whatsoever. It gives me the confidence I never had with my 7m powered car.
Yea keep it.
If you dont want to increase your cooling efficiency with the 2JZ water pump that occupys the area with more pumpage.
keep it if you dont want the horse power gain of having an extra power steering sucking power and response from your engine.
keep it if you think you can goto toyota the next day and simply replace it when the 16 year old thing breaks down.
just keep it until it blows up and replace it with a single E-fan that pulls the same CFM as MAX speed hydrofan 3100 CFMs there is one E-fan by itself that can replace the hydro fan is the same diameter and same CFM almost (2997) Perma Cool summit sells them cheap and only draws 10 amps
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=PRM-19115&N=700+115&autoview=sku i also used the perma cool external 175 degree switch to turn it on no need of a relay.
even the twin fal fans suck well dont suck thats there problem all the rest only pull about 2500 cfm max with 2 fans and drawing over 2x amps what this little one does!
If you dont want to increase your cooling efficiency with the 2JZ water pump that occupys the area with more pumpage.
keep it if you dont want the horse power gain of having an extra power steering sucking power and response from your engine.
keep it if you think you can goto toyota the next day and simply replace it when the 16 year old thing breaks down.
just keep it until it blows up and replace it with a single E-fan that pulls the same CFM as MAX speed hydrofan 3100 CFMs there is one E-fan by itself that can replace the hydro fan is the same diameter and same CFM almost (2997) Perma Cool summit sells them cheap and only draws 10 amps
http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=PRM-19115&N=700+115&autoview=sku i also used the perma cool external 175 degree switch to turn it on no need of a relay.
even the twin fal fans suck well dont suck thats there problem all the rest only pull about 2500 cfm max with 2 fans and drawing over 2x amps what this little one does!
And I am planning to transfer it to my 2jz block as well......thats how efficient I find it to be. If it was that bad, Toyota would have dumped it and not have used it in the newer Camrys and Aristos.....
No, just the bottom end Joe. I think it will work well with the K26 setup I am going with.(1.5)OneJoeZee said:
thaks alot guys really so thanks:love:
and also anyone want stuff from the front clip i might not need let me know.
also old stuff from 7mge
and also anyone want stuff from the front clip i might not need let me know.
also old stuff from 7mge
Evilempire1.3JZ-GTE said:
Wouldn't the extra amperage draw on the alternator take just as much horsepower as the extra hydro pump? I would actually assume that the hydro pump would be more efficient then converting mechanical -> electrical - > mechanical energy.
annoyingrob said:
a 100 amp alternator always generates voltage thats why there is a voltage regulator any extra shit is shunt to ground so how is the alternator going to use more amperage then it was rated for? you see it does not matter how much of a load is on a alternator because there is no ecitation limitation or regulateion based on load
if you have a 100 amp alternator and it is rated for that current at a certain rpm peak then it makes a 100 amps if your car only uses 50% of the energy generated by your alternator the rest of the extra 50% is shunted to ground through the regulator so dont matter what your alternator is going to use what it generates because your car doesnt make less or more mechanical energy that is constant based on the rpm well your alternator doesnt remove or add windings based on the load ? if an electric fan or defroster comes on in your car you dont see magical fairys going inside your alternator to add windings and make more power ?
the alternator makes more the plenty of energy and some gets wasted so just use what it uses and makes already to keep your car cool.
i work on locomotives they are more advanced the way a locomotive works is it haves 4000 hp generated by using on a gp locomotive 4 traction motors sd locomotive uses 6 traction motors on the emd models and the you have A/C motors and D/C motor on locomotives
they wat the motors are turned is them main generator creates a dc voltage generated from the mechanical energy produced by the engine it is regulated by 2 systems 1 is the engine rpm if you throttle 8 max speed then engine on a locomotive is max speed also excitation is at maximum the engine max speed is 800 rpm!
but in notch 1 that is low speed the engine turns like 200 rpms but is the engine speed is controled by the throttle the excitation that the generator produces is regulated by a computer the same as hybred cars! So it can verry the generator to make sure if the system is not running good it makes sure the generator does not stall the engine!
If you understand that then right away you will know that UNLESS you have a LOCOMOTIVE or a HYBRED car you do not have excitation limitation to prevent your alternator or generator from stalling your engine!
that means our conventional cars generate the same amount of energy at the same engine rpm! at the alternator and does not depend on the cars load!
unless you overload your alternator if you do that you just drain your car to the point the battery goes dead and your car dies! do you understand this now ?
So its B/S that a electrical fan drains more hp because the alternator will drain the same amount of power dont mater what is hooked up to if you dont believe me do this test remove the thick cable offf your alternator dyno your car! dyno it with it hooked up you will have the same hp to the wheels. dont do this to long it will fry your regulator because it is driveing 100% of the generated energy to ground.
and no even a clutch fan is more effecient then a hydrofan for one thing you have a smaller waterpump housing with an extra powersteering pump hooked up on the back of it instead of one bigger easierflowing 2jz cooling system
and if you look at the hyrdo pump it is another power steering pump sucking hp out of your car just to pump power steering fluid through 15ft of piping that weighs a shit load plus the weight of your reservoir just to pump the fluid through a driveterain that propels a blade around and it does not vary it haves 2 speeds either always on which you dont need when your car is moving and max which is only uses when your stopped at a light or parked only but your engine gets even hotter when you turn your car off and it pools your engine heat soaks
witha electric fan it is only on when your car is parked or stopped! also it turns on after you turn your car off if hooked up right preventing heat soak and cooling and blowing air into your engine bay right after you turn your car off!
my electric fane weighs around 4-5lbs max
if you take out your hydro fan ecu, hydrofan assembly, hydrofan plumbing your hydro fan wiring, hydro fane resivors filled up to correct level. hydro fan water pump compair the water pumping capacity and weight between the 1jz/2jz you will find that by going to the e-fan and bigger cooling 2jz waterpump your car runs about 20X better and more responsive.
my car runs just as cool if not cooler then the hydrofan but i have maybe 20 more hp and 20+ less lbs and a cleaner engine bay from it.
also remember again! the e-fan only runs when you need it when stopped at a light or after you park and turn your car off to prevent heat soak the hydro fan does not do that it runs all the time even when its on max it uses the same power as low the diffrence on the speed is it just uses the selenoid to divert more of the hydrofan pump fluid toward the fan.
so if you pack ice in the engine bay and hit the drag strip your electric fan is off when you race down the 1/4 mile there is no efan on there is nothing but raw engine hp and turbos and you running down the road your not running all that extra shit in your engine bay!
only someone dumb wouldnt see the benifit of going to e-fan setup. most newer cars use them unless they are a verry cheap car then they use clutch mechanical fan but 90%+ of the newer cars use them and they work fine & are more efficient.
argueing tranfering mechanical energy is more efficent by fluid instead of by wire is stupid think about it if thats true then you believe the below theory lol VVV
" I beleive mechanical energy transfered through plumbing is better then useing wires and electric fans, in fact why do nuclear power plants use the steam generated at there plant to turn the generator at there plant ? they might as well installl thousands of miles of pipes to our houses and use the nuclear energy to generate that steam and send it all the way to our houses where we will each have a generator at our house instead of at the plant."
sorry i dont "HATE" but it gets old explaing the benifits of electric fans to cool radiators instead of pump hydrolic/ fan hydrolic ones. the fact a 7m is mechanical/electric factory and most new cars are electric only.
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Evilempire1.3JZ-GTE said:
Check this out: This is what I am talking about can happen
http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29423
suprastanger507mgte said:
I dont know why he used that fuse instead of using the 20 amp CDF fuse built for an electric fan already in the supra he must have failed to chaif wrap or shorted the wire somewhere.
I have always recomended using the factory fuse instead of the provided one.
Evilempire1.3JZ-GTE said:
Dude, I wasn't arguing anything, I asked a freaking question.
But, I'm not quite understanding this whole electrical concept you're trying to explain here. It would seem to me, that if you had nothing hooked up to an alternator, you would have an infinite resistance across the coils. You wouldn't generate a magnetic field in the coils due to the infinite resistance. No magnetic field means no mechanical resistance on the pully.
Flip that around, hooking up an E-fan to an electrical system would lessen the apperant resistance of the whole electrical system, causing a larger current flow (larger current draw on the electrical system if you will), which would cause a larger magnetic field to be generated inside the windings of the alternator, creating more of a drag on the pully.
I'm not arguing your point that an E-fan would be more or less efficient, I don't know, that's why I ASKED. I AM nowever arguing against your point saying that an alternator does not prvide more or less load on the engine depending on electrical loads. it DOES. You even said in your example how the generator on the locomotive could stall the diesel motor. If the diesel motor is running low speeds, and you demand a higher speed out of the train, you threaten to stall the engine, which is precicely why you have the computer countermeasures in place to prevent that from happening. If the generator you are using to power the wheels did not change it's apperant load on the diesel motor, you could keep the diesel motor at a constant (low) speed no matter how fast the train is moving. The very fact that you have to increase the speed of the diesel motor (to generate more electricity) PROVES that mechanical load is dependant electrical load.
annoyingrob said:
Diesel locomotive haves variable excitation control computers while govenor valves control the engine rpm notch 1-8 8 speed govenor valve control. I was saying they are completly diffrent because unlike a locomotive it verrys the load on the generator a car alternator produces the same amount of power dont mater what the load is it produces verrying voltage based on the engine rpms the load on an alternator is fixed at the same rate because a regulator filters the a/c voltage and excese voltage to the ground of your car. If you put a huge load on your alternator it doesnt freeze your engine it just dims all the other electrical on your car because the alternator will still produce its same fixed power based on the engine rpms and it will start to drain your battery thats all. there is no excitation computer inside of a convention car alternator but there is one inside of hybred cars because it uses the power to move the whole car so it needs to control the excitation to make them so efficient because if you dont have a computer and just a plain voltage regulater with the hybred car electric generator/motor on 100% of the time your wasting all the extra voltage to ground and no getting optimum performance out of it when you need it to drive or move the car.
A e-fan uses less then 9% of what the alternator makes to run it and i pulls nearly the same amount of air as max speed on the hydrofan the e-fan uses less power of your car then the headlights or the rear window defroster or a hooked up 1000 wat stereo system
if you dont believe me dyno a car with headlights on then do the same with them off the alternotor will not drop your car hp when your headlights are on because it uses the same amount of mechanical force to make the same amount of electrical force because a car uses DC and the alternator produces AC with varying frequency and voltage based on rpms the regulator is always running and putting the same load on the alternator.
The electric fan almost haves no load on the car it does not run unless stopped at a light racing up hill extreme death valley temps or after the engine is shut down for 2-3 min to prevent heat soak
people dont realize you do not need a fan running 100% of the time lol you only need it after you park your car to run to prevent heat soak it cools your cooling system and your engine after you turn your car off extending the life of your engine.
when you are driving down the road 20+ mph at low engine rpms you need no fan at all! so why have 2 power steering systems running off of your engine all the time also the hydro fan takes away from the cooling system compaired to the 2JZ water pump.
If anything just use a clutch fan the pully already turns so if the fan runs all the time have it varry on engine rpms directly not have 2 speed control ecu an extra resivior all the pluming extra moving parts added steering lines added fluid cooler so on relays wires it get stupid to take more power from an engine the just having a simple soarer clutch fan as the main cooling system thats all.
Infact thers is so much more response less estra weight i wish someone would post dyno results but with the electric fan off because when your cruising your supra at higher speeds you get so much cool air in through the front the e-fan wouldnt be on so subtract the weight of nearly all the hydro fan crap and put no load on your alternator when your going down the road and add it up.
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