eFFeT's Swedish Powered Supra MKIII

[effet]

Oh, thats not bad. I was thinking it was going to be down in the front bumper just by seeing the intercooler with the mount on it. I didn't look carefully enough in other pictures. Have you run it?

I've run it with the new stand alone engine managment system but not with the new intake or any boost. I'm afraid that the whole intake will implode the first time I start the car. :cry:

And I don't think I'm gonna make the deadline becouse I'm going to Turkey for two weeks now :icon_bigg.

 

[Amontgomery]

For the actual intake forming did you use dry fibre with resin applied after or did you start with pre soaked fibre then lay it on? It looks dry from the picture but I can never be sure.

You could test it before you run it to make sure it wont shatter and suck into the cylinder. How much boost are you planning to run? Lets say 1 bar or 14-15psi whichever you prefer. Would it not also be logical to assume that that will be the pressure on one square inch? Fab up a support to hold a weight above a one inch square piece of metal so that it moves vertically and won't fall over. On that one inch square, add weight until you reach your desired psi. Make a replica exactly as you made your originals. Place your replica(plenum because it will have the most stress because of it's size) under the weight and drop it from an inch or two. Keep dropping the weight from further distances or adding more weight until you get the plenum to crack. In theory that would give you an idea of the structural integrity of your part. If it can stand up to 30lbs dropped from 2 inches it should have no problem withstanding whatever boost you run through it.

You may come up with another way of testing integrity that is better and more accurate than this but it should get you rolling in the right direction. If you can drop or try to destroy a replica of your product you should get an idea of what force is reqired.

 

[effet]

I've not started to cast the plenum yet. I'm still trying to shape the mould as I want it.

I've tested the prototype runner with one layer of carbon fiber to 10 bar pressure (147 psi) and nothing happened. And I have 4 layers on the ones I'm going to use. So I think they are going go hold. :icon_bigg

I'm thinking about testing the plenum some what the same way and also test it for vacuum before I test it in the car. The pulses from the engine may add some extra strain on the plenum but I can't figure out any way to simulate this without testing it on the car. So the first time I run it I'm going to put a net between the head and the intake so any bits and pieces doesn't go in to the engine.

I'm going to run it at around 1,7 bar (25 psi) boost. I want to hit 2 bar (30psi) at the end of the summer with some water/methanol injection also... but thats a later project. :icon_bigg

 

[Amontgomery]

If you have run the true twin turbo setup you have, could you tell me how they spool up if you were comparing them to a stock ct26 and then to something bigger? I have been wondering because I will end up with a bunch of stock ct26s laying around my house and have access to a plasma cutter and perhaps a TIG eventually and would like to play around with the idea of doing a true twin turbo with stock turbos just for educational purposes.

I would think that it spools up better than a bigger single just because of the smaller size but slower than stock because instead of 2997cc pushing each turbo, it would be half of the displacement to get the turbine spinning. I would really like to know exactly what it drives like.

 

[bigaaron]

The dual Walbro pumps is just temporary, when I get more time and money I've been thinking about building something like this:

And under 1 bar MAP I just run one Walbro pump and one Borsch pump and over 1 bar MAP it switches on the other 2 as well. This way I don't add so much heat to the fuel... maybe... I don't know :icon_bigg

The switching on and off fuel pumps may give pressure changes in the fuel rail but they will be compensated in the EMS by adjusting the injector time opening.

That is basically like a surge tank used in lots of different racing applications. You use a high volume low pressure pump to feed the surge tank, and a high pressure pump from the surge tank to the fuel rail. I would just use a high volume fuel pump designed for a carbureted engine, one that is self regulated. The surge tank is smaller and usually cylindrical with a tapered bottom outlet. That way you are less likely to have problems loosing fuel pressure because of fuel sloshing to the rear or side of the tank like it does at extreme angles or high g loads.

Awesome project by the way!!!

 

[effet]

If you have run the true twin turbo setup you have, could you tell me how they spool up if you were comparing them to a stock ct26 and then to something bigger? I have been wondering because I will end up with a bunch of stock ct26s laying around my house and have access to a plasma cutter and perhaps a TIG eventually and would like to play around with the idea of doing a true twin turbo with stock turbos just for educational purposes.

I would think that it spools up better than a bigger single just because of the smaller size but slower than stock because instead of 2997cc pushing each turbo, it would be half of the displacement to get the turbine spinning. I would really like to know exactly what it drives like.

I hwill! :icon_bigg Gonna make some videos when I get it running, then you'll see.

If you are going to build a twin setup for good response I would use a pair of smaller turbos. The CT26 starts to make boost at around 2500 rpm on a 3.0 l engine, with 1.5 l to each turbo you have to rev twice as much to get boost. This means you will not have full boost until you pass 5000 rpm.
The turbos I'm using is from a 1.8-2.0 l engine.

Have you done any calculations on a compressor map?

Comp. map for TD05-14B that I'm using:

Note that this is for VE 100% on the engine.

 

[effet]

That is basically like a surge tank used in lots of different racing applications. You use a high volume low pressure pump to feed the surge tank, and a high pressure pump from the surge tank to the fuel rail. I would just use a high volume fuel pump designed for a carbureted engine, one that is self regulated. The surge tank is smaller and usually cylindrical with a tapered bottom outlet. That way you are less likely to have problems loosing fuel pressure because of fuel sloshing to the rear or side of the tank like it does at extreme angles or high g loads.

Awesome project by the way!!!

Ok... gonna look in to that later. Thanks for the tip. :icon_bigg

 

[tlo86]

where is your radiator going tofit?

 

[Amontgomery]

I hadn't really looked to much into the actual dynamics of the system, I was just beating the idea around in my head. I am trying to think of a set of turbos that will come to full boost slow enough that I would be able to make power up to redline as well as come to some boost relatively quickly to let the car have some low rpm pull.

I was also toying with the idea of Mitsubishi turbos, like the one off of the old Gen 1 GSX Eclipse. Since they are made to come to full boost relatively quick with a small engine they might be better suited for a true twin setup.

 

[effet]

where is your radiator going tofit?

I had to move it back 5 cm to fit the intercooler and 5 cm to the left to fit the water/oil cooler. But it's tight! :icon_bigg

 

[effet]

Home made :icon_bigg. And my welding is getting better.

 

[effet]

Found some old pics when a friend helped me make my flywheel.:icon_bigg

 

[miekedmr]

that's some real quality work. (the intake manifold especially.) very impressive.

 

[effet]

Now the mould for the plenum is finished:

 

[Amontgomery]

Did you decide on the shape by hand or did you have some kind of computer program to help you decide on the shape and dimensions?

 

[effet]

Did you decide on the shape by hand or did you have some kind of computer program to help you decide on the shape and dimensions?

I don't have access to any flow calculating program so I just used some what the same principle as I did on the runners. Gradually increase the area from a circular shape to an oval shape.
It just remains to see if the flow is even in to all cylinders...:icon_razz

 

[Amontgomery]

I would think that forced induction would help minimize the differences. But the air should follow the same principles as in an NA setup.

 

[effet]

I would think that forced induction would help minimize the differences. But the air should follow the same principles as in an NA setup.

The forced induction will not even out the differences. If one runner flows better then the other runners will result to that cylinder will have a better volume efficiency then the others. And if I'm close to the knock limit and one cylinder is running a little bit leaner then the other ones, its a high chance that it will start to knock.

 

[Amontgomery]

Anyway to run an O2 sensor(wideband) on each cylinder to detect the A/F ratio before that happens?

 

[Poodles]

easier to put pyrometers in each one (and a hell of a lot cheaper, not to mention the fact that the O2's won't last long that close to the valve)