Cryogenic Treatment of Engine Parts

SupraMario

SupraMario

I think it was the google
Mar 30, 2005
3,467
6
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38
The Farm
I had a friend that, his uncle had a vette, and did this, vette was producing like 800+ hp. so must help some, its pricey tho.
 
Asterix

Asterix

Lurker of Power
Mar 31, 2005
469
36
28
Vienna, VA
It took me a while to find good information about this. The Machinery's Handbook (#26) (Industrial Press, 2000) says this:

Changes Resulting From Subzero Treatment. When steel is at the hardening temperature it contains a solid solution of carbon and iron known as austenite. When the steel is hardened by sudden cooling, most of the austenite, which is relatively soft, tough, and ductile even at room temperatures, is transformed into martensite, a hard and strong constituent. If all the austenite were changed to martensite upon reaching room temperature, this process would be an ideal hardening operation, but many steels retain some austenite. In general, the higher the carbon and alloy contents and the higher the hardening temperature, the greater the tendency to retain austenite. When steel is cooled to subzero temperatures, the stability of the retained austenite is reduced so that it is more readily transformed. To obtain more complete transformation, the subzero treatment may be repeated. The ultimate transformation of austenite to martensite may take place in carbon steel without the aid of subzero treatment, but this natural transformation might require 6 months or longer, whereas by refrigeration this change occurs in a few hours.
Click to expand...

I doubt the effectiveness of cryogenically treating cast iron, like brake rotors, but I'd have to check to see if cast iron, with all that carbon, is martensite or not.

So, the short answer is: yes. Cryogenic treatment of steel really does improve toughness of the material. Be sure any machining to tolerance was done after treatment as martensite is a different size than austenite.

Asterix
 
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souprat

New Member
Mar 30, 2005
649
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fairfax VA
i thought that i read on a thread here that cryo treating rotors helped with the lifespan of the rotors. couldnt find the thread though.

^^thats tight that the machinery's handbook has this. my dad got me the 27th edition for my birthday. havent had a chanc to go through it all yet.
 
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bluemax

The Family Man
Mar 30, 2005
418
0
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Orange County, CA
Cryo treatment of rotors makes the coef. of friction greater and a more wear resistant surface. I've been told by a guy who does this process on anything from shears to rotors, mostly rotors, that the rotor life will at least double. You could cryo your engine parts for wear, but I'd be careful, fatigue life may be lowered. I haven't heard anything about fatigue testing on cryo'd steel.
 
tte

tte

Breaking In - in progress
Mar 30, 2005
940
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Northern California
I should find out how much it would cost to have engine parts cryo treated and see if this is a cheaper and a good alternative to buying expensive aftermarket engine parts.

Cheers,
Roy
 
ma71supraturbo

ma71supraturbo

Supramania Contributor
Mar 30, 2005
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Redding, CA
www.geocities.com
Asterix said:
It took me a while to find good information about this. The Machinery's Handbook (#26) (Industrial Press, 2000) says this:



I doubt the effectiveness of cryogenically treating cast iron, like brake rotors, but I'd have to check to see if cast iron, with all that carbon, is martensite or not.

So, the short answer is: yes. Cryogenic treatment of steel really does improve toughness of the material. Be sure any machining to tolerance was done after treatment as martensite is a different size than austenite.

Asterix
Click to expand...


From a materials engineering standpoint, the downside is that the material becomes more brittle so rather than bend (or yeild) at its structural limit, it will be more prone to cracking. In an engine, either bending or cracking would be catastrophic and since the harder material has a higher limit, it would be "stronger." However for parts where bending is a much better outcome than cracking/breaking (say, a Navy Destroyer) it is best to leave the materials as they are.
 
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bluemax

The Family Man
Mar 30, 2005
418
0
0
Orange County, CA
If you're looking for high performance or just better performance rotors, they should be cryo'd. You can use very hard and abrasive pads with them without too much wear problems.
 
jimi87-t

jimi87-t

Active Member
Oct 12, 2005
1,126
4
38
Colorado Springs
BAN HIM!!! Haha, JK, your info is more than welcome here, IMO. You are a big help to the MKiii community. I'm glad to see you've come over to SM. But some of the members here are not able to veiw SF, so you might want to repost info over here. (even though I've done the same thing :icon_razz )

I was just going to head over there to read your post when I saw you posted the link here ( I saw it over there earlier today, but didn't have time to read it)
 
GrandLordKhorne

GrandLordKhorne

Evil Turbo Penguin...
Jan 3, 2006
20
0
0
South MA, almost RI
I have been reading this forum for a while now, long time actually, for the info, but I have had my ID over at SF for a lot longer, so I have a mental predisposition to post there… I got the ID here primarily for the search tool.

The previous was actually the first post I have made here…

Having considered the fact that some people here do not view SF, I’m considering posting a brief on the project here and in the end I will more than likely list results in both forums. After all it is my goal to further, improve and advance the community and to truly do so, I must mingle in many of the major circles that concern what I have to offer or am interested in learning.

Having said that, I will probably continue doing most of the bulk of my posting over there, for the sake of the fact that most of the info I have posted in the past is there and I like continuity…
 
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