Confused

[suprachick22]

Ok so i know i'm probably going to get a ton of OMGs on this but i am way confused becase everywhere i have been reading and looking has said something different. what is the difference between a 1jz motor and a 7m? i have tried googling it and i get so many screwed up things now i am way confused. any help on where i can go to figure it all out will be much grateful. and yes i have gone through the forums but not much help either that i can seem to find

thanks
Suprachick22

 

[cartel1_950]

besides the obvious?? or just the basic differneces?

7m is 3.0 single turbo dohc
1jz is 2.5 twin turob dohc

 

[suprachick22]

the only main consistant thing has been that and what you can and can not do with them. but as for anything else its all been different. like what is better what is more powerful. i have learned that the 1jz is harder to find and is rare on parts. but as for the diff i havent the slighest clue. everything i've read has been contrudicting.

 

[ForcedTorque]

1JZ has the 7M beat hands down in the reliability department. But, if the 7M is built properly, it can be just as reliable.

7M has the better torque, due to the extra 1/2 liter of motor (3.0-2.5). Don't be fooled by the "Twin Turbo". When you want to build it for power, you'll ditch the tiny twins and get a big single. As for power, there are plenty of examples of a 500 -850 rwhp 7M. There are few 1JZ's pushing even 500, unless they are the 1.5JZ (2JZ bottom end/1JZ head). 7M guys bash the 1JZ as a torqueless wonder, but everyone with a 1JZ seems to love it. I've never once heard of anyone swapping back in the 7M after going 1JZ. Opinions on this swap are like a rear orifice, everybody has one, and a lot of the talk is purely due to people backing what they have.

Check with Driftmotion!!!!!!!! They have been doing swaps for the community for a long time.

 

[zambini]

it's also noteworthy that 7m's are domestic market and are a dime a dosen, while 1jz's never came to the states in production models... so everything 1j has to be jdm tyte which means mo 'spensive and harder to find, unless you find someone on the forums or someone locally that already has 1j stuff stockpiled. aftermarket domestic support is growing, and the number of swaps are growing as well.. 1jz's are gaining popularity as a whole. if you want to swap a 1jz into a smkiii supra you have to source a bellhousing and lengthen your harness, among other accessory-related stuff, but thats where my knowledge base runs out of steam.

 

[cjsupra90]

Forcedtorque stated it pretty well. Each have there area of merit and faults. About the only true simularity between the two engines is they both have 6 cylinders, 24 valves and two cams oh and they were both made by toyota. Basically when it comes to choosing between swapping to a 1JZ or staying with the 7m, you should ask yourself, "do I want low end torque or high end power?" If its the off the line torque (my personal favorite) then stay with the 7m but if you want the high end power then swapping to the 1JZ might be a better choice but displacement is still a limiting factor to keep in mind here.

 

[Turbo Drifter]

Stock for stock the 1jz makes more power and is funner to drive. The 1jz can make more power unopened than the 7M. The 7M being a longer stroke and larger displacement engine will have better off boost power and bit more torque. The 1jz still makes great torque and power though with minimal mods.

The 7m and 1jz share no parts the 1jz is a totally different engine.

The 1jz is the older brother to the 2jz found in the MKIV Supra.

Jeremy

 

[ForcedTorque]

I think the best advise would be that if you want 350-400rwhp, either motor is will get you there. If you want more, you want to either stay 7M or go 2JZ. I will never bad mouth the 1JZ, unless I am picking on a buddy. I just don't see the benefit of it other than it has a better head gasket. I just don't know of any HIGH HP 1JZ's. I think Jay (Suprahero) had a little over 500 out of his before he went 1.5 JZ. That was a fun ride, I won't lie.

 

[lewis15498]

Go to the light blue control pannel, click on articles (to the right of "User CP") These are written up and only posted after the mods review them. You wont find BS there, but you will find articles about both motors in detail. If one motor was all around better most of us would have it, but thats not the case. They both have alot to offer, so read up, educate yourself and make your own decision, thats the one that counts.

 

[GrimJack]

I'll expand a bit on this.

Toyota built the M series engine many, many years before the Supra, and back then it was a smaller bore and a smaller stroke, making it smaller displacement. Over the years they increased both to make for a larger displacement engine. Eventually, they started to run out of room - the space between the cylinders was getting awfully thin, and lengthening the stroke even more was going to start causing other problems, so they retired the venerable 7M.

It was replaced in Japan with the J series engine, the first of which was the 1JZ, a 2.5L inline 6 fitted with two small turbos. This was available in later model Supras - but given the USA's addiction to displacement, it was never released for the North American market. When designing this engine, they 'fixed' all the 'problems' they had started to run into with the M-series engine - made the bore significantly larger, and spread out the cylinders to give them more space to work with in the future, among other things.

The 1J was released in a very limited number of cars - only available in the last few years of Supra AFAIK, and of course, replaced very quickly with the 2J in the Mk4 Supra, where they lengthened the stroke again to produce another 3.0L engine. The stroke is still shorter than the older 7M engine, making an engine with a bigger bore / shorter stroke gave them less torque but more capacity to rev higher.

The question of which engine is better for what is one that will never be settled, especially on a community like this, where there are many die hards on every side of the fence.

PS: FYI, there were more engines for the Supra as well, that weren't available for the North American market - Japan also got a 2.0L inline 6 twin turbo, that was only available in the narrowbody version of the Supra - another thing that never made it to our market.

 

[suprachick22]

thank you all so very much. it helps getting stuff striaght thats not just ppls opinions and thoughts. hopefully i will learn this sight and not have to ask questions that are probably already posted. i want to get this car right and not have too many issues. i know they are bound to happen but its all good.

 

[pnutcar]

Also, 1jz parts are easy to find; you just have to know what you're looking for.

EX: my car has an isuzu timing belt and an Audi serp belt (ac crapped out)

Do your homework and you will never regret JZ!

 

[tlo86]

no engine brace bracket things for the engine/bellhousing
no blockoff plate for the mech fuel pump
they replace all engines the 7m's replacement was the jz

but doesnt someone see the link of toyota engines getting replaced by engines made in conjunction with yamaha? 3sge came out in 1986 (the 4 cyl 2jz!) just a thought...

 

[HommerSimpson]

Here is the deal... Money....if you want a nice supra with some power but reliable and you have money.. then buy one thats turn key with what ever motor in it..if you have little money and want to buy a supra and fix up Its going to cost you more then what you budget for it. It happens with anything almost. On time and under budget is not something you will hear much if at all with a supra.. If you dont know alot about cars and want to work on a supra.. this is not the car for you..

Now if you want to buy a supra and pay someone to fix it up nice for you..then you need to make sure you have someone that knows the cars working on it. And from your questions you dont have anyone near you that knows.. as to why you ask here and thats what this place is for.. and is very good about it..

Now with that being said.. tell us about you.. what you are wanting.. what you have driven before ? ever floor a car with 350 hp ? how about 400-500? You need to know that once you get up in the Higher Horsepower ..things cost more and they dont drive just like a normal car.. You have to be ready to hang on and control the car.. Can you do this ?have you in past?

bottom line how much $$$ ya wana spend ? to giggle your ass off when ya floor it the first time and go OMG whoooooooooohoooooooooo

 

[GrimJack]

no engine brace bracket things for the engine/bellhousing
no blockoff plate for the mech fuel pump
they replace all engines the 7m's replacement was the jz

but doesnt someone see the link of toyota engines getting replaced by engines made in conjunction with yamaha? 3sge came out in 1986 (the 4 cyl 2jz!) just a thought...

Yamaha has had a hand in virtually all the performance Toyota engines. They certainly helped with the 7M. Just like Lotus has had a few fingers in the Supra's suspension, too.

 

[honestabe]

Don't forget the issue of reliability also comes down to maintenance. Any motor well maintained will be reliable (well, maybe not the rotaries, lol). Ask any Supra owner, they will tell you the first thing you should do when buying a Supra is to do a ton of maintenance on it (i.e. replace all the fluids, belts, some seals) and inspect everything. The first Supra I bought I did a lot of repairs of things that the previous owner/mechanic did. Dollar for dollar, either Supra can be great. It all depends really on how good of a platform you start out with (i.e., is the 7m's headgasket replaced with a MHG and done properly, is it running perfectly with no mechanical issues, how well has it been maintained, etc...). For some people it is more cost effective to stay with the 7m than swap a 1j or 2j into.

I like both motors. If I could start all over, I would probably have a 7m right now.

 

[suprachick22]

Here is the deal... Money....if you want a nice supra with some power but reliable and you have money.. then buy one thats turn key with what ever motor in it..if you have little money and want to buy a supra and fix up Its going to cost you more then what you budget for it. It happens with anything almost. On time and under budget is not something you will hear much if at all with a supra.. If you dont know alot about cars and want to work on a supra.. this is not the car for you..

Now if you want to buy a supra and pay someone to fix it up nice for you..then you need to make sure you have someone that knows the cars working on it. And from your questions you dont have anyone near you that knows.. as to why you ask here and thats what this place is for.. and is very good about it..

Now with that being said.. tell us about you.. what you are wanting.. what you have driven before ? ever floor a car with 350 hp ? how about 400-500? You need to know that once you get up in the Higher Horsepower ..things cost more and they dont drive just like a normal car.. You have to be ready to hang on and control the car.. Can you do this ?have you in past?

bottom line how much $$$ ya wana spend ? to giggle your ass off when ya floor it the first time and go OMG whoooooooooohoooooooooo

i do have ppl who know about cars. my dad and my brothers know so much about them. i just want to know some things without always asking them for help. my dad built (from ground up) a 67 dart. i have the money thats not a problem. the only thing i've ever drove besides my normal cars is a mustang that was a friend in schools he had completly redone and had so much money put into it. as for the handling part oh ya i can handle it.

 

[HommerSimpson]

i do have ppl who know about cars. my dad and my brothers know so much about them. i just want to know some things without always asking them for help. my dad built (from ground up) a 67 dart. i have the money thats not a problem. the only thing i've ever drove besides my normal cars is a mustang that was a friend in schools he had completly redone and had so much money put into it. as for the handling part oh ya i can handle it.

then try to get one turn key thats had what needs to be done .. done and done right.. you will be much happyer..

If you want a preticular car and want to do something with engine.. and you have money to do it right .. then 2j is the most reliable and highest hp hands down...

 

[Taco]

Yamaha has had a hand in virtually all the performance Toyota engines. They certainly helped with the 7M. Just like Lotus has had a few fingers in the Supra's suspension, too.

Funny you mention Lotus, i just now read their new model is using a toyota engine and they were saying that toyota makes the most reliable engines. Hell yeah(if you ignore the 7m)

 

[Taco]

If you have money save it and buy a mkiv supra. I love mine but if i wasnt a shit poor college student i would buy a mkiv in a heartbeat. Plus that extra 500 cc's sounds alot better.:thumbup: