Budget upgrades with a Canadian twist...

[Dan_Gyoba]

Okay, I'm going to more or less clone the "How do I get to 350 RWHP" thread, but looking from my perspective.

The same: Similar goals.

The difference: My stock turbo is in good shape, and I don't want to yank it out to send it for an upgrade.

The "twist": Shipping a CT26 over the US/Canada border is spendy. The best shipping cost I could find on fleaBay was over $55 (Not the best metric, but accurate enough.) Add in the crap that the couriers charge, and it gets downright stupid. I could easily blow half my budget on a turbo upgrade in shipping charges if I buy a "core" CT26 and get it upgraded.

Otherwise that looks like my best bet. Anyone have suggestions as to how this could be done without lining the courier's pockets?

Current Mods: If I don't list it, assume that it's stock.

• ARP head studs (Not really a mod, but it'll hold the head on.) w/ head gasket job.
• All new gaskets and seals. Fresh overhaul this summer
• Lexus AFM
• PTE 550cc injectors
• 80mm / 3" exhaust from the turbo back (Am installing Saturday)
• Cone filter (woo hoo!)
• Koyo radiator
• Driftmotion Spearco replica IC (To be installed)
• 2.5" Al IC piping (To be installed)
• HKS SSQV w/ recirculation fitting (To be installed)
• Walbro 255lph fuel pump (To be installed)
• MBC (Set to 9 lbs for stock CT26 and lack of other installed mods)

Intended upgrades:

• Turbo Upgrade. Something that will spool quick and flow HARD without blowing up my motor. This is what I'd like the most advise on. I'm considering a 57 trim upgrade vs the BOSS turbocharger, or another "bolt in" sub for the CT26.
• APEX'i AVC-R. I don't know if this is "more than I need" but it certainly seems to have the options to go as far as I may want to. For now, the MBC that I have will do the trick, but when it's time to go for more, this is what I PLAN on. Again, if there's a unit that isn't $500+ that will take care of what I want to do, I'd like to hear opinions.

So the BOSS turbo, with the install stuff that I'd need, is looking to be around the $1600 mark, near $2000 if the dual ceramic ball bearing CHRA is worth it (Faster spool is definitely more attractive) and I can then most likely go beyond the 57 trim level. But it's spendy, and I'm not sure that it'd be money well spent, or if I should spend it on other things. I should be able to recoup a couple hundred for my CT26, as it's still in really good condition.

OTOH, a CT26 rebuild is cheap, and a 57 trim wheel sure looks attractive in possibility. If not for the stupidity of shipping charges, I'd go this way hands down.

I figure that I'm looking at $100 for a core turbo to rebuild, unless I can find something cheaper, but that seems to be about the going rate for something that CAN be rebuilt. Practically all of the ones I can find are in the states. Ship it here, and it's at least $150, possibly $175, given that couriers like to add on brokerage charges. Call it $150.

Now I have to send it to be rebuilt and upgraded. Another $50 in courier fees, and, say, $550 to have it rebuilt. $750 so far. Now it's gotta be shipped here, and this time there will be brokerage charges FOR SURE. Call that $75. I'm now at $825 for an upgraded CT26, and that's being optimistic. I can easily break $1000 with other fees, if there's something really wrong with the core turbo that I get, or any number of intermediate issues arise. Add in the fact that from what I hear, it'd be dicey if I started the process NOW that it would be ready for spring. I REALLY don't want to be adjusting to a bigger turbo when the winter hits.

So... I know it's a wall 'o text, but any suggestions are appreciated.

 

[supramike7m]

with your current mods id say get an afpr, wb, and safc, and stick with a 57t ct26 and you will meet your 350 rwhp goal easily.

 

[ms07s]

You want a way to bypass some of those shipping charges? Just have the ct26 you buy shipped directly to MDC for the rebuild! That way its only two shipping charges and only one import/export fee.:naughty:

 

[2543arvin]

You want a way to bypass some of those shipping charges? Just have the ct26 you buy shipped directly to MDC for the rebuild! That way its only two shipping charges and only one import/export fee.:naughty:

MDC does not do rebuilds anymore.....go to driftmotion!

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

Great idea in theory, but harder to do in practice. What I (think I) need is someone in the States who is willing to be a middleman for me. Someone who can receive the core turbo, look it over and ensure that seems suited for upgrade, then send it in, with a return address to get it to me. Again, given the lead times on these things, I think I'd need to get it going soon in order to be ready by April/May.

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

with your current mods id say get an afpr, wb, and safc, and stick with a 57t ct26 and you will meet your 350 rwhp goal easily.

I'm not sure I know what I need the WB for I figure that a WB is good for tuning on a dyno, but for driving isn't it just a pretty gauge for the passenger to watch? I would plan to have the car checked, if not tuned on a dyno. Once dialled in, do I really need a WB from that point on?

The AFPR is something that I understand, in that it will control fuel pressures with the big fuel pump and injectors. I don't have as good a grip as I might on the limits of the stock FPR, but I didn't think that I'd be having problems wtih running lean.

I also don't understand what the SAFC is going to do for me. Isn't this used to control extra fuel? I didn't think that running lean was going to be an issue with the stock TCCS system, so more fuel isn't something that I thought would be an issue.

I was pretty much hoping that I didn't really need much more in the way of electronics to handle the TCCS. I am also considering the idea of the Techtom ECU upgrade that Reg Reimer offers, which (as I understand) should be the whole electronics package to handle the fuel system at that point.

 

[2543arvin]

I'm not sure I know what I need the WB for I figure that a WB is good for tuning on a dyno, but for driving isn't it just a pretty gauge for the passenger to watch? I would plan to have the car checked, if not tuned on a dyno. Once dialled in, do I really need a WB from that point on?

The AFPR is something that I understand, in that it will control fuel pressures with the big fuel pump and injectors. I don't have as good a grip as I might on the limits of the stock FPR, but I didn't think that I'd be having problems wtih running lean.

I also don't understand what the SAFC is going to do for me. Isn't this used to control extra fuel? I didn't think that running lean was going to be an issue with the stock TCCS system, so more fuel isn't something that I thought would be an issue.

I was pretty much hoping that I didn't really need much more in the way of electronics to handle the TCCS. I am also considering the idea of the Techtom ECU upgrade that Reg Reimer offers, which (as I understand) should be the whole electronics package to handle the fuel system at that point.

If you dont get a wideband with data logging there really is no way to accurately tune the car unless you go to the dyno. And then you would have to have a dyno with a wideband that can log a run.

With the SAFC, you more than likely wont be adding fuel but removing it, because with the 550cc injectors you will probably be running too rich.....which was the case on my setup, so having a piggyback to be able to tune with will help you benefit from all the mods you have. Without anything to tune with you will going to the dyno just to lay down a number and not be able to gain any horsepower on the dyno, which makes it a waste of money IMO. With my SAFC, I was able to make another 60rwhp on the dyno by removing fuel.....but in the end its your call and your wallet.



Also, if you say that the BOSS turbo will be around $2000 and the 57 trim upgraded CT26 will be around $825, I still dont see how its not worth to end up saving ~$1200 by going with the upgraded CT.....especially for your power goals.

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

Okay, so the SAFC allows less fuel too. That I didn't know.

And the BOSS turbo is $2000 with the ceramic ball bearings, and all the bells and whistles. With that, I'd hope to put down more than 450 RWHP, and have room to spare. $1600 gets the version without the extra goodies, though still what should be a better turbo than the CT upgrade.

The $825 estimate is also as low as it might possibly go. A less optimistic estimate that I'd done ran as high as $1200 (Though I understand that I can just buy an already upgraded CT26 from suprastore.com for $1000)

 

[2543arvin]

Okay, so the SAFC allows less fuel too. That I didn't know.

And the BOSS turbo is $2000 with the ceramic ball bearings, and all the bells and whistles. With that, I'd hope to put down more than 450 RWHP, and have room to spare. $1600 gets the version without the extra goodies, though still what should be a better turbo than the CT upgrade.

The $825 estimate is also as low as it might possibly go. A less optimistic estimate that I'd done ran as high as $1200 (Though I understand that I can just buy an already upgraded CT26 from suprastore.com for $1000)

Again, its your wallet and not mine, but you said you wanted 350hp and if you want 450hp now, then I wouldve suggested that you went with an aftermarket turbo setup. 100hp is a big difference when deciding what parts to buy, especially since in that range I would opt for forged internals and a rebuild.

 

[supramike7m]

If you dont get a wideband with data logging there really is no way to accurately tune the car unless you go to the dyno. And then you would have to have a dyno with a wideband that can log a run.

With the SAFC, you more than likely wont be adding fuel but removing it, because with the 550cc injectors you will probably be running too rich.....which was the case on my setup, so having a piggyback to be able to tune with will help you benefit from all the mods you have. Without anything to tune with you will going to the dyno just to lay down a number and not be able to gain any horsepower on the dyno, which makes it a waste of money IMO. With my SAFC, I was able to make another 60rwhp on the dyno by removing fuel.....but in the end its your call and your wallet.



Also, if you say that the BOSS turbo will be around $2000 and the 57 trim upgraded CT26 will be around $825, I still dont see how its not worth to end up saving ~$1200 by going with the upgraded CT.....especially for your power goals.

excellent answer not sure what to add to that. boss turbo would be way over kill for you, and a waste of money, considering a 57t ct26 will easily do 350rwhp. and aaron does the upgrade for $510. afpr cost maybe $275 shippped, and wb is $275, and pick up a used safc2 here for like $200 there you go, $1260 for all those parts, puts you in the 350- 400 rwhp range, fast spool and for a damn good price. cheaper for all that than the damn boss turbo.

 

[2543arvin]

excellent answer not sure what to add to that. boss turbo would be way over kill for you, and a waste of money, considering a 57t ct26 will easily do 350rwhp. and aaron does the upgrade for $510. afpr cost maybe $275 shippped, and wb is $275, and pick up a used safc2 here for like $200 there you go, $1260 for all those parts, puts you in the 350- 400 rwhp range, fast spool and for a damn good price. cheaper for all that than the damn boss turbo.

Nope, read his next post. Now he is mentioning 450hp, totally different setup IMO.

 

[supramike7m]

Nope, read his next post. Now he is mentioning 450hp, totally different setup IMO.

what? so you basically dont even know what you want. if you want 350 rwhp and budget like you originally said, then youll be fine with what i said, and for damn good price too. if you want 450rwhp, thats a huge change. sp61 with the same, afpr, wb,and safc would do.

 

[supramike7m]

what? so you basically dont even know what you want. if you want 350 rwhp and budget like you originally said, then youll be fine with what i said, and for damn good price too. if you want 450rwhp, thats a huge change. sp61 with the same afpr, wb, and safc would do.

 

[GrimJack]

He's talking about 350 with a CT or 450 with a Boss.

I'd suggest looking into a Turbonetics like mine - still direct bolt on, but the cost is considerably lower. JTamulis on here carries those.

I'd pass on the techtom idea, for that kind of money you can buy a MAFT Pro, and all of it's additional toys, and it kicks the snot out of the old TT tech.

In your position, I would pick up a better turbo, whether you go CT 57 / Turbonetics / Boss, get that on, hit the dyno, and see what the dyno guy says is your next limiting factor. You could end up needing more fuel, more fuel control, or something else, and there's no good way to find out without a dyno.

I wouldn't be surprised to see you hit that 350 number, though.

 

[TurboStreetCar]

Get a Bigger turbo, Ct upgrades don't have a good track record for reliability. Not to mention after that first rush of more power you WILL want more. Too much turbo is better then not enough.

If you have too big of a turbo it will be more forgiving to tuning because it will be making your power level at low boost levels. If you under turbo and squeeze every last HP out of it it can get dangerous especially with Pump gas and a non perfect tune at 19-20psi

If you over turbo and keep the boost down to your first 350HP goal, if you want more its just a twist of a knob and tune away. Where the upgraded CT would be at 19-20psi making maybe 400, the boos would be at 14-15psi making 400.

You need to decide if that 350 will be enough for a while. The last thing you want is to put it on and within a week feel like its not enough and want to upgrade again.

350 is just outside the limits of a stock CT, an upgrade will defiantly no doubt get you there.

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

I'd suggest looking into a Turbonetics like mine - still direct bolt on, but the cost is considerably lower. JTamulis on here carries those.

Now this is an interesting possibility.

I am looking for ~350rwhp, maybe up to 400, and an upgraded CT can do that, but it does seem that spending a bit more now can make a higher goal LATER possible.

I try to upgrade things under the principle that the cost of cheap equipment is the cost of the cheap equipment plus the cost of the expensive equipment later to replace it.

The turbonetics option is interesting to me. I'd forgotten about that option since it's been a long time since I started looking at this kind of thing. (I started looking into a GTE swap over 10 years ago, but only actually got it done this summer.) Anyway, taking a look at turbonetics website, I realise that I don't even really understand the catalog, but if it's possible to get something that will bolt in for under the $1000 mark, then that seems like the way to go for me.

Edit: What nosechunks says makes a lot of sense to me. I'd rather make my power at a lower boost pressure than a higher one. I figure that higher flow at lower pressure has got to be easier on the intercooler, as well as the rest of the engine. I want my car to be as reliable as possible.

I've been down the road of "more power! MORE POWER!" before. I do honestly expect that 350rwhp will get me what I want from this car for at least a couple of years, but I want to do it where there's definitely more on-tap, only a bit more tuning away. The idea of a "scramble boost" setting to have more on occasional demand is the kind of thing that I like to have.

 

[GrimJack]

Here is a link for you - several vendors actually carry this unit, but HPF is the only place I could find it online.

http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/price/Toyota/Supra_86-92/Turbonetics/Turbos/Turbo_Kits

This used to be under $1000, I see the price has gone up a bit. This is the unit that I have on my car right now.

 

[garagefujimoto]

Dan.......

Just find a bolt on new turbocharger, have it sent to the border, I could go get it on my next parts run.

Then just have to get it from me to you. No brokerage when you go yourself..