AutoX Set up

[JtWo]

I posted on SF but yeah, not much response. Since it's starting to get rainy, and my engine is kinda in pieces, should I take this chance to get ready for autox next year? I wanna work with ssuspension adn stuff in that nature. this is what I plan on running

Megan Tracks
ST Sways
OEM Rotors
Hawk Brake pads
EBay Strut Bars

What tires should I get? What size wheels? Also, what uhm, camber/toe(i don't know the name of the terms) should I run in the back and in the front?

My current mods right now are the following:

K&N Intake
Ported Turbo Elbow
3" down pipe
2.5" in exhaust
ARPs
OEM Head Gasket components.

 

[ToySup88]

I auto-x'd my 88 turbo for many years. Here's the formula I used (from stock) quite successfully (many trophies in my street prepared class):

Handling (Overall goal - lower, lighten, and stiffen the car):
Eibach springs/Tokico
ST sway bars and f/r strut tower bars
RX-7 lightweight 16" wheels with 245/45/16 all around
- Get Kuhmo or Hoosier for R compound
- Get Falken Azenus for street/track tire
Suspension settings: 1/8 toe-out in front, 1/8 toe-in in rear
-1 degree camber all around

HP mods (Overall goal - throttle response, quick spooling turbo, low-end torque):
Full 3" exhaust with no cats
Free flowing air filter
Eliminate restrictive stock IC piping
Sparco IC

Braking mods (Overall goal - need good bite from cold start):
Porterfield R4S pads
SS brake lines
Brembo slotted rotors in front

Another recommended mod is either a 4.10 or 4.30 rear end. Gives you more torque to pull out of a tight corner quicker.

Heat is not your enemy so don't worry about cooling mods.

Jim

I posted on SF but yeah, not much response. Since it's starting to get rainy, and my engine is kinda in pieces, should I take this chance to get ready for autox next year? I wanna work with ssuspension adn stuff in that nature. this is what I plan on running

Megan Tracks
ST Sways
OEM Rotors
Hawk Brake pads
EBay Strut Bars

What tires should I get? What size wheels? Also, what uhm, camber/toe(i don't know the name of the terms) should I run in the back and in the front?

My current mods right now are the following:

K&N Intake
Ported Turbo Elbow
3" down pipe
2.5" in exhaust
ARPs
OEM Head Gasket components.

 

[relax]

wow this is just the info i am looking for i too plan to do some auto x in my area thanks. this gives me a build list to save up for

 

[prsrcokr]

I have a similar setup to what ToySup mentioned but with a few more power mods. (ecu, injectors and Lex meter)
With the mods you list you'll be eligible for an SP class (if you're talking about Scca classing) keep in mind you can now run boost control in this class as well. I don't use R' comps and have had old, crappy tires until recently. I really learned alot driving on crappy tires and have switched to good street tires (not the Azenis yet) I can't hang with the local hotshues in my class that are on R's and wouldn't expect to (we've got a few national level folks)

One thing I plan to change is the Eibach/Tokico suspension. I believe it's too soft for auto-x and don't like it being a progressive rate. Most of the spring rate is less than the rate of stock springs. I run -1.0 front camber/-1.5 rear (-1.0 is max for my car, would like a little more)
Practice and seat time is the best value you'll find starting out. Tires are probably the biggest improvement beyond that but again they're only as good as the 'loose nut behind the wheel.'
Brian

 

[themadhatter]

when you talk about Tokico shocks are you talking about the blues or adjustables ?

 

[prsrcokr]

I've got the adjustables. They a good stock improvement IMO (a little stiffer than stock) but not made to be used with non-stock (ie: shorter) springs. They offer a soft ride on "normal" and tighten up a little on "sport" but I don't feel they're suited for competition use.

 

[TurboStreetCar]

Im also looking for better handeling/Grip in turns for my beast. i drag and i turn, so im thinkin something like a 255 or 265 would be better on say a 9 inch wheel for the front, and the widest DR's i could fit in the back. its a more of a street performer so im not going to be running slicks or anything nasty like that.

would a tire that wide fit on the front? i always see thread on it but theres never a real answer. its always speculation. someone always *thinks* it will or wont fit.

 

[c2m]

AutoX setup...hmmmm

there is a lot you can do... it really just depends on your budget...
put your money into tires, or at least save money for tires...
and have some $ for practice days...

nothing will get you better at the track than seat time and talking and walking course with the good guys...

then you can start throwing money at suspension... but honestly speaking, even as much of a boat as the supra can be... especially on stock suspension... learning its quirks and tricks can only be beneficial to you...

i know it is almost impossible to not tinker with the supra in one form or another... but seriously... set aside a tire budget and entrance budget... beacuse you will go through several sets of tires and start buying things that can make the experience more comfortable...

oh yeah, a waterbottle would be good to cool off you tires on practice days..

tire chalk is also nice to see how far tires are rolling over and help you to decide where to set your camber

a great big hat, a chair, drinks, and a canopy along with a group of friends to chill the day away with are what really make the experience social...that way you have people you can joke around with and compare times too...

and after a few seasons... step up to some big race rubber...

 

[Cabroncito]

Im glad to have found this thread. I have been looking for a good rwd to autox and take to MSR here in dallas for their driver school. Most of everything i've seen here is for the drag strip which really doesnt interst me. I got a bit of experience in miata's and an old BMW 2002. I've just been looking for my own car and I'm a big fan of toyota.

Do you guys know of any other supra autox/road racing sites where I can get more info? I'm new to the supra scene and ive found the pickings to be slim.

 

[prsrcokr]

Good explanation C2m and I think you're right on with that last comment, "after a while step up to big, race rubber." I haven't been autox-ing all that long but have noticed many people step up to race tires from the start. Yes this will make you faster by allowing the car to be thrown around harder and allowing it to stick where it wouldn't with 'normal' tires. However, I really believe you will have a much harder time learning to maximize the setup as these tires are more masking for lack of experience. I still am not using R' comps and have recently just gone from 6 y/o, hard street tires to a set of 'good' street tires. I ran an entire season on these low grip, old tires and stuck with them to make sure I could get every bit of traction available from them. My times couldn't compete with top drivers in the class in their class winning cars (ESP) but could compete w/ good drivers in class leading cars. I had a couple of the National entry hot shoes drive my car to compare times and they were both within .2 sec of my time so I think this technique helped. I'm sure they would beat me by a greater margin with the new tires as I am not using most of their potential but I'll stick with them and try to get to that same level on the better tire. Seat time is the most important improvement, be sure to make the most of it and then upgrade along the way.

 

[whenmunkysfly]

oh yeah, a waterbottle would be good to cool off you tires on practice days..

This is NEVER a good idea. Do not cool your tires super fast this will only remove the chemicals in the rubber that make them soft. You might not notice the diffrence but i drive formula cars quite a bit and if anything you want to wrap your tires in a blanket so that they stay warm, this will keep them at temp for the next heat. Ask any hardcore superbike rider and they will tell you the same as they rely on tire grip even more then a car.

 

[Cabroncito]

Have any of you who have an autox setup ever been on a road course? As I understand (and I could very well be wrong) in road racing it is more important to make power across your rpm instead of power mostly on the lower end (such as having a taller final drive ratio) since the course would be longer and there would be more room for your car to get up to speed.

I like the points made by prscokr and c2m. I had been contemplating leaving the car stock and just getting a second set of tires and wheels just for the track. I do read a lot about kumos (friend just bought a set of ecstas) and falkens (dont know much about them) but what experience do some of you have with Yokohamas? I have Avid V4s on my car and my wife runs AVS db2 (i think thats right). Granted these are both all season tires but we have been very satisfied with them.

 

[prsrcokr]

As far as the water spray goes, this will depend on the tire and it's not only a performance technique but also a longevity one. Many folks don't have funds to constantly replace tires as in pro racing levels. For auto-x you want a tire that will heat quickly as you have a short time to run and long delays between runs. If it's hot out and you have this sort of tire, you need to cool it to bring the temp back into the max operating range. For a track tire you want something that can build up heat and tolerate high temp without coming apart (as has been the case for some folks using an auto-x tire on a roadcourse)

Cabro, I'm just getting my feet wet in roadcourse driving and I'd say to stick with a performance street tire while starting out in roadcourse schools. You don't want a tire that's best for auto-x by heating quickly (ie: Azenis) on a heavy car on track as it likes being cooler and can get greasy. I used Bridgestone S-03's at my last DE which don't heat very quickly at auto-x. They did however hold up great on track to the much higher temps and never became greasy.

 

[Cabroncito]

prsrcokr...What are some of the basic difference you have experienced while in your road racing DE's? I understand that the suspension and power set ups might have to be set up different. But as far as approaching the road course compared to the autocross course what have you noticed personally. (ie the line you take in the turns, the amount of trail braking used if any, is as big a factor or more so?) I'm sorry to ask so much stuff, and I see how your car is not necessarily stock, but I am wanting to buy a mkiii for the purposes of autox and road racing. Not necessarily to be very competetive with others, more with myself.

 

[89Turbo]

I auto-x'd my 88 turbo for many years. Here's the formula I used (from stock) quite successfully (many trophies in my street prepared class):

Handling (Overall goal - lower, lighten, and stiffen the car):
Eibach springs/Tokico
ST sway bars and f/r strut tower bars
RX-7 lightweight 16" wheels with 245/45/16 all around
- Get Kuhmo or Hoosier for R compound
- Get Falken Azenus for street/track tire
Suspension settings: 1/8 toe-out in front, 1/8 toe-in in rear
-1 degree camber all around

HP mods (Overall goal - throttle response, quick spooling turbo, low-end torque):
Full 3" exhaust with no cats
Free flowing air filter
Eliminate restrictive stock IC piping
Sparco IC

Braking mods (Overall goal - need good bite from cold start):
Porterfield R4S pads
SS brake lines
Brembo slotted rotors in front

Another recommended mod is either a 4.10 or 4.30 rear end. Gives you more torque to pull out of a tight corner quicker.

Heat is not your enemy so don't worry about cooling mods.

Jim

did you just say heat is not your enemy?

 

[ToySup88]

did you just say heat is not your enemy?

Yes, a properly functioning stock cooling setup is sufficient for auto-x use. You will not be working the car that long to worry about overheating.

 

[supraguru05]

since your just starting autocross springs struts and decent street tires like azenis would be ok for a year or two while you learn the car. our cars in street prepared form at in ESP a class dominated by v-8s. if you want to be compeitive in that class you need a minimum of 295 race rubber all the way around and coil overs as well as power mods putting you around 300hp. remember you have ulimited boost allowed and timing and fuel adjustment, you just cant change your injectors. but really the biggest and best investment in autocrossing is seat time period.

 

[flight doc89]

Suspension settings: 1/8 toe-out in front, 1/8 toe-in in rear
-1 degree camber all around

toe-in in the rear? my car understeers bad enough already......

 

[prsrcokr]

What's understeer? I have fought with oversteer for a long time, very tailhappy when I first put the bushings in. I've finally gotten it to where she'll push a little and power oversteer is still easily brought on.

Btw, fuel injection is unrestricted in SP classes, so you can run larger injectors:
"Induction allowances are as follows:
1. Carburetors, fuel injection, and intake manifolds are unrestricted."

I run -1 front camber (max. avail. for me), -1.5 rear, stock toe settings.