Anyone know the spring rates for these?
- Thread starter Ma70.Ent
- Start date
* Stock MKIII
* Front: 461 lb/in
* Rear: 215 lb/in
* Drop: 0
* Stock MKIV
* Front: 430 lb/in
* Rear: 219 lb/in
* Drop: 0
* Suspension Techniques
* Front: 442 lb/in
* Rear: 147-175 lb/in
* Drop: 1.3"
* Eibach
* Front: 343-628 lb/in
* Rear: 126-257 lb/in
* Drop: 1.3" - 1.0"
* Tokico
* Front: 395 lb/in
* Rear: 198 lb/in
* Drop: 1"
* Intrax
* Front: 700 lb/in max
* Rear: 220 lb/in
* Drop: 1.6" - 1.3"
* H&R
* Front: 575 lb/in max
* Rear: 285 lb/in
* Drop: 2"
* R*SR Sport
* Front: 503 lb/in
* Rear: 262 lb/in
* Drop: 1.2" - 0.8"
* R*SR Race
* Front: 677 lb/in
* Rear: 335 lb/in
* Drop: 1.4" - 0.8"
* Whiteline
* Front: ?? lb/in
* Rear: ?? lb/in
* Drop: 1.0
* B+G Suspension
* Front: ?? lb/in
* Rear: ?? lb/in
* Drop: 1.3"
* Front: 461 lb/in
* Rear: 215 lb/in
* Drop: 0
* Stock MKIV
* Front: 430 lb/in
* Rear: 219 lb/in
* Drop: 0
* Suspension Techniques
* Front: 442 lb/in
* Rear: 147-175 lb/in
* Drop: 1.3"
* Eibach
* Front: 343-628 lb/in
* Rear: 126-257 lb/in
* Drop: 1.3" - 1.0"
* Tokico
* Front: 395 lb/in
* Rear: 198 lb/in
* Drop: 1"
* Intrax
* Front: 700 lb/in max
* Rear: 220 lb/in
* Drop: 1.6" - 1.3"
* H&R
* Front: 575 lb/in max
* Rear: 285 lb/in
* Drop: 2"
* R*SR Sport
* Front: 503 lb/in
* Rear: 262 lb/in
* Drop: 1.2" - 0.8"
* R*SR Race
* Front: 677 lb/in
* Rear: 335 lb/in
* Drop: 1.4" - 0.8"
* Whiteline
* Front: ?? lb/in
* Rear: ?? lb/in
* Drop: 1.0
* B+G Suspension
* Front: ?? lb/in
* Rear: ?? lb/in
* Drop: 1.3"
Looking at those intrax, does anybody have problems with them? They are so soft in the rear, yet they go pretty low. Do you guys with Intrax Springs ever bottom out your exhaust or anything when you go over bumps quickly (like on the highway)? Also, how's the handling on them?
Also, anyone have rates on the Whiteline Springs and B+G?
EDIT: I'll post these questions in the General Forum as well.
Also, anyone have rates on the Whiteline Springs and B+G?
EDIT: I'll post these questions in the General Forum as well.
Intrax pairs well with bilstein.
The thing is Intrax won't release spring rates, or at least they would not when I asked. Those #s for Intrax are estimates.
If someone wants to call them and try to squeeze the rates out, let us know.
The thing is Intrax won't release spring rates, or at least they would not when I asked. Those #s for Intrax are estimates.
If someone wants to call them and try to squeeze the rates out, let us know.
logan;982525 said:
I'm having a hard time believing the stock front springs are 461lb/in. This is not the first place I've seen this number.
Does anyone know where it came from? Has anyone actually tested a stock spring?
The way I've tested (or watched being tested) springs is with a tape measure, a press, and a corner scale. You compress the spring 1", zero the scale, then go another inch. If you're brave, another inch of compression can be useful for verification and a linearity check. I'd offer to do this test, but the one thing I'm missing is a scale that can take 1400lb.
No offense, but I've seen so much misinformation floating about that gets repeated regularly like it's gospel it makes my eyes cross.
Asterix
The stock figures listed on my website came from a Japanese site I found back in 2000. I don't remember the site, or if the rates were accurate.
Asterix;987498 said:
Why are you having so much trouble believing that the stock springs are around 460lb/in?
Wiisass;988790 said:
It is quite possible they are. It just doesn't seem right. I've not dealt with the stock springs for many years, so I certainly could be misremembering how they seemed off the car compared to the TRD springs.
I have measurements for the TRD springs at 443lb/in. My notes also say the TRD springs are "stock +40%". Then, there are Tokiko's springs, measured at 415lb/in. My notes mention that they are "stock +25%". Those numbers put the stock springs between 316 and 332lb/in. The % numbers are most likely from advertising info from the two companies.
That's why I'm questioning that number. If someone has a stock front spring and is willing to lend it to me, I'd be happy to find someone with a scale to measure it. (Mine are long lost.)
One other thing I just remembered: I do distinctly recall that the response time to bumps was slower with the stock springs than with the TRD springs. If the stock springs are stiffer than the TRD springs, that wouldn't be the case.
Asterix
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Where the springs measured correctly? I'm not doubting you, I'm just curious. Because the way the OE springs are shaped and mounted, you have to account for the dead ends at each end of the spring. The way I would test would to have the springs mounted on a stock damper. And then do the test you spoke of.
I have never measured the stock spring, I never felt the need to. And the numbers never looked weird. With the rates that I posted above, natural frequencies look right, wheel rates look about right, balance looks right. None of the numbers looked out of place.
I was hoping I could find that rates listed in the TSRM, but I couldn't seem to find them in there. I thought I found them in something else that looked more official than some dudes website, but I have had them written down for a while now and don't remember the original source.
But either way, the stock rates don't really matter. If you know what you're looking for out of the car, everything can be done from scratch. The only time I ever use the stock rates for anything is to look at how bad the balance is with those springs. Other than that, if you know you weights and geometry info, you shouldn't need stock spring rates for anything.
And the response time, was that on the same shocks in the same condition? That will greatly affect response time.
Tim
I have never measured the stock spring, I never felt the need to. And the numbers never looked weird. With the rates that I posted above, natural frequencies look right, wheel rates look about right, balance looks right. None of the numbers looked out of place.
I was hoping I could find that rates listed in the TSRM, but I couldn't seem to find them in there. I thought I found them in something else that looked more official than some dudes website, but I have had them written down for a while now and don't remember the original source.
But either way, the stock rates don't really matter. If you know what you're looking for out of the car, everything can be done from scratch. The only time I ever use the stock rates for anything is to look at how bad the balance is with those springs. Other than that, if you know you weights and geometry info, you shouldn't need stock spring rates for anything.
And the response time, was that on the same shocks in the same condition? That will greatly affect response time.
Tim
No, the actual rate of the stock springs doesn't matter much. I was just curious for accuracy's sake where those numbers came from. I'm quite happy with 415lb/in front (Tokiko) and 225 in the rear (Hyperco). Given the rough roads 'round my parts, and nicely valved Koni's, the car rides nicely and handles well. I'll never understand those people who want 800lb/in in the front on the street...
I do believe my natural frequency comparison (by feel) was on the same shocks in pretty much the same condition.
As for my measuring technique, sure it's not perfect, but when Tokiko (and I called and asked) says their springs are 415lb/in and I measure 412, at least that one data point is good. That's why I compressed the spring 1" from free before starting the measurement. No, it wasn't mounted on the shock, but I did get pretty close. My measurement surely wasn't off by 100lb/in.
Then again, it's always possible the spring rate varied by year... Maybe the last year's turbo model got 460lb/in springs and my lowly '88 NA with the sport package only got 325lb/in springs... When I get a chance I'll see if the cygnus part listing shows different springs for different years.
Asterix
I do believe my natural frequency comparison (by feel) was on the same shocks in pretty much the same condition.
As for my measuring technique, sure it's not perfect, but when Tokiko (and I called and asked) says their springs are 415lb/in and I measure 412, at least that one data point is good. That's why I compressed the spring 1" from free before starting the measurement. No, it wasn't mounted on the shock, but I did get pretty close. My measurement surely wasn't off by 100lb/in.
Then again, it's always possible the spring rate varied by year... Maybe the last year's turbo model got 460lb/in springs and my lowly '88 NA with the sport package only got 325lb/in springs... When I get a chance I'll see if the cygnus part listing shows different springs for different years.
Asterix