Air to Water Intercooler?

[tErbo b00st]

You are such a douche nozzel!

The res tank can be mounted in the trunk of the car which can have ac blowing on it...the intercooler can be mounted in the engine bay or in the passenger seat if you like...the heat exchanger/radiator an be mounted behind the from bumper....w2a systems have water pumps and hoses to move the water and keep it circulating threw it's ic,rad,res tank...it's not just a bowl of water!

So now your going to run A/C to cool the charge and sap more power from the engine? Y do I care if the IC is in the passenger seat? That seems very inconvienant. I understand how a W2A system works. You asked me y air cooled engines overheat when standing still...I answered with a logical response.

W2a has it's place...a2a has it's place also....at just under 400hp IJ has data logged that the w2a was a much better system for him but it started to choke off at higher power...he has his proof of this and I can't see why he would make up such stories as he currently runs a2a as a water system takes up much space for his power goals!

Now to tackle your other dumbass comments...

An a2a ic is a heat exchanger...as hot air passes threw it cooler air will cool the charge....now the ic will also work the other way!!! An ic can heat air inside it just as easy as it can cool it....imagine it's 97deg F outside, your stuck in slow moving traffic, the pavement is 220deg f and your ic is about 7" from this pavement!!! That ic also is metal which is now hoarding in heat from the road and heating your air charge! You may not think this is a big deal but to people who run standalone ecu's this can really throw the cars tune off! Factory ecu has it already tuned in for this situation within reason. The water to air systems have a fan to cool it's own personal radiator and it works well but a fan on an a2a really doesn't work well as they don't move enough air for such a large system...

I understand how heat transfer works, so thanks on that lesson. Do you also not understand that the same principle works on W2A. So imagine you have been driving aggressively down the highway and your water temps are now above your turbo outlet temp...now your W2A is heating the intake charge. The nice thing with A2A is the cooling air temperature will never get above ambient (when moving) which is always lower than your intake charge temps.

So the general agreement is if you want to make power on a street/circuit car use A2A. If you drag race or want the lowest AIT when sitting in traffic run W2A?

 

[IwantMKIII]

Tid bit of info: An early M series actually came with a W2A IC system STOCK, IIRC it was the 5M, possibly 6, not sure which vehicle it was on either, just remember reading about it in one of the News Feeds on the site.

 

[jdub]

I'm pretty sure it was the '88-'89 Celica GT-Four (ST165) with the 3S-GTE engine. The later model GT-Four RC (ST185) also had a W2A IC.

 

[Moy]

W2A is fantastic...when you can continually refill it to keep the water temperatures down. As the car runs the water continues to heats up more and more (up to a point) and your IATs rise with it.

I suppose if you want the coolest possible IAT's while idling (pointless) W2A might be the way to go. But I would really like to see an A2A with a fan compared to a W2A

You could always hook up an electric fan to the back side of an A2A intercooler, wired with an on/off switch inside the cabin for when you're sitting in traffic/at idle to help keep the IAT's down... that's always an option

 

[jdub]

You could always hook up an electric fan to the back side of an A2A intercooler, wired with an on/off switch inside the cabin for when you're sitting in traffic/at idle to help keep the IAT's down... that's always an option

I believe IJ is doing exactly that on his current build, except he is having the Motec control the fans. And, the fans (obviously) blow vs suck

 

[IwantMKIII]

I'm pretty sure it was the '88-'89 Celica GT-Four (ST165) with the 3S-GTE engine. The later model GT-Four RC (ST185) also had a W2A IC.

I believe they did. I'm referring to the M series specifically.

And it was the M-TE actually used 1983-1985. Japanese models only of course.

 

[jdub]

And it was the M-TE actually used 1983-1985. Japanese models only of course.

Ahhhh...a really early M series motor. Didn't know about that one...learn something new every day

 

[IJ.]

But now your limiting your "peak power" by having hotter IAT by running a W2A. I use quotes around peak power, because at the end of the day you are trying to make power. And to lose 20-30 whp because you want your tuning 100% and not 99% through traffic seems illogical.

Or are you trying to say w2a on a daily driver or circuit car creates more power than an a2a?

Again you haven't actually read anything I've written have you?

With the limited space available in the front of a Mk3 the biggest W2A hardware I could fit topped out in flow and capacity around the 500rwhp mark, they make W2A systems that are good to 1000rwhp but the components are HUGE good luck fitting them anywhere in a Mk3 chassis.

By comparison an A2A to support 1000rwhp can be fit in with a little work and imagination.

W2A is fantastic...when you can continually refill it to keep the water temperatures down. As the car runs the water continues to heats up more and more (up to a point) and your IATs rise with it.

I suppose if you want the coolest possible IAT's while idling (pointless) W2A might be the way to go. But I would really like to see an A2A with a fan compared to a W2A

Again the W2A system is active so it is able to cool itself, why do you think it has to be "refilled" you're thinking of a Drag System using ICE water.

I've ran both back to back and trust me Fans didn't have a chance of equalling the W2A in everyday stop start on/off boost situations, ie: quick trip across town in peak hour traffic threading the needle and using boost to get into gaps.

A word of advice Dude if you post crap like was deleted again your stay here will be very short, as I've said I don't pull this stuff out of my ass I have 100's of detailed data logs and have tested the parts discussed in the real world and only posted so people can have facts and not what someone believes to be true based on an incomplete understanding of the systems being discussed.

I don't "know it all" I'm still learning daily I hope you can.

You could always hook up an electric fan to the back side of an A2A intercooler, wired with an on/off switch inside the cabin for when you're sitting in traffic/at idle to help keep the IAT's down... that's always an option

see above

I believe IJ is doing exactly that on his current build, except he is having the Motec control the fans. And, the fans (obviously) blow vs suck

Thanks John!

 

[7thousandpiecesMGTE]

Ian will you leave the fans running or have the option to when the engine is off (gas station scenario) to prevent the heat soaking? Or is that overkill?

 

[IJ.]

Haven't in the past but this time I'll enable the option in the MoTeC to run accessories after the Ign is off as I need to run the Turbo Scavenge pump on shutdown Andrew.

Not sure how much difference it will make but it's worth a shot

 

[dusthead]

i <3 this thread. awesome idea's and knowledge on the differences and uses.

thinking i may want to go for that clocking idea...