? about Rods and Pistons
- Thread starter Supra60-1
- Start date
I hadn't seen you post in a while, some of us are getting together at Walker's this Saturday. You should come by. http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35133
I believe many people still run the stock rods and make 500-600hp without a problem. You may want to have them shot-peened for peace of mind though. Unless your raising the rev limit, I don't think forged rods are necessary.
I believe many people still run the stock rods and make 500-600hp without a problem. You may want to have them shot-peened for peace of mind though. Unless your raising the rev limit, I don't think forged rods are necessary.
At the least have them stress relieved and shot peened along with a good polishing and balancing.
The stock rods are fine for the mid-400 HP range...after that, you are starting to push your stress limit on the rods. Some have been able to take 500-600 HP without failure...others have thrown a rod in the low 500 HP range. The problem is you don't know...leaving a margin for error is always a good idea when building up a motor. Get them re-sized, shot peened, and balanced with your pistons.
^^^^^^^ WRONG...... who says the rods are only good for 400hp, why do people always set imaginary limits?.... i am running roughly 600hp on shot peened stock rods and if you search you will find many doing the same. duane was running high 600's with stock rods... didn't have a problem, tony in vegas built a car making 700's on stock rods, its been 2 years, still havent heard of any problems. 2j guys make 1000 hp on stock rods. I do not hear of the rods themselves breaking it is the stock bolts that break, and a good set of arps can be had for 40$
who says that there is a limit, with GOOD tuning i would say shoot for the sky..... IT IS NOT POWER THAT BREAKS PARTS it is detonation, poor tuning/maintanance and a plain lack of competence
who says that there is a limit, with GOOD tuning i would say shoot for the sky..... IT IS NOT POWER THAT BREAKS PARTS it is detonation, poor tuning/maintanance and a plain lack of competence
And Mike Malloy threw a stock rod at 540 HP with ARP rod bolts 
And there have been others...and it wasn't because of a bad tune either or "lack of competence".
Didn't say they couldn't do 600 HP man...I said you are cutting down your margin for error. The stock rods were never designed for 600 HP and the 7M rod is not the same as a 2JZ rod. You're kinda looking at this like it's a black/white thing...it's not. The Toyota rods are good, but no where near as good as billet rods. When I want a motor to do 500 HP, I build it for 750 HP. Why risk all the expensive parts to build up a motor because you went cheap on the rods. Just my 2 cents.
And there have been others...and it wasn't because of a bad tune either or "lack of competence".
Didn't say they couldn't do 600 HP man...I said you are cutting down your margin for error. The stock rods were never designed for 600 HP and the 7M rod is not the same as a 2JZ rod. You're kinda looking at this like it's a black/white thing...it's not. The Toyota rods are good, but no where near as good as billet rods. When I want a motor to do 500 HP, I build it for 750 HP. Why risk all the expensive parts to build up a motor because you went cheap on the rods. Just my 2 cents.
Stock rod bolts are the key here folks.
Also, shot peening and stress "proofing" will do nothing if you don't get the rods x rayed for cracks.
Also, shot peening and stress "proofing" will do nothing if you don't get the rods x rayed for cracks.
There are several companys such as AlamoAutoSports, CNC-motorsports etc. that sell eagle rods with either JE or Wiesco pistons for right around $1000 on ebay. And it is probally the only things to buy off of ebay.
Red7m said:
I found those places and should be giving them a call soon. Probably gonna call Alamo, theyre in Texas and the closest.
The whole reason I wasnt gonna get rods was the cost, I thought I was gonna have to spend $2500 on pistons and rods. But hell, if I can get it all for around $1000 I'm goin all out.
Im not sure if I'll make it to the dyno Pat. The last time I came up there, I didnt have a car to dyno and I just felt far too left out.:cry: But who knows? It would give me a little motivation if I see some other supras running.
Thanks for the responses everybody.
QWIKSTRIKE
475rwhp459torq an climbin
jdub said:
I bet this was because of piss poor tuning in 90% of all cases also. The jury is out with Mikes case unless he ran the playback of the datalogging software we will never know. I know a guy that was tuned properly with good A/F's across the board, and blew his motor running a VPC and piggy back. A MAFT PRO is still just a very tuneable piggy back. Also it takes a trained eye to see a rippple in a rod if they arent' checked properly and you install a bad rod BOOOOOM. Seb AU went to 730+ rwhp on the stock bottom end. Doing what JDub says will give good results if properly tuned. Don't even assemble that motor without having each rod resized to spec! I think with all the heating and cooling over the years that those rods are seasoned enough (stressed relieved)to get 600 plus if properly tuned using a standalone only IMHO, and the rods are not fractured, or molested in any way. I have always found detonation to be the cause of a bad rod period! I myself have put a ripple in a rod because of poor tuning when I first started modding my car with the lex afm and 550 injector upgrade. Ask the peson what they was using when the incident ocurred, and it was always some piggy back or bare basic tuning! I have so far abused my car at the 500rwhp level and have no issues what so ever. This Spring when those cams come in I am going into the deep 600RWHP level on the stockers. I will however be running a full standalone Wolf V500 to help
The safest way to avoid blown rods is going stronger if you can afford it. However; I have found from personal experince with my friends, and my car that up to 500-600RWHP there has never been any issues wih the stock rods. Do the best that you can with what you can. Good luck!
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QWIKSTRIKE
475rwhp459torq an climbin
Supra60-1 said:
Supra Rich will take care of you for a good price right here in the misc vendors section. I bet he'd give you a good deal with great service that you can trust. I have used his service and have found him to be a great guy!:biglaugh:
QWIKSTRIKE
475rwhp459torq an climbin
Supra60-1 said:
Would I lie. He has great prices on Eagle rods and Wiseco pistons. He qouted me a great price on Wiseco pistons delivered!:icon_bigg
620 on my OEM rods which have been shot peened. (I also had them checked for cracks before doing this) Mulitiple passes and TONS of miles on them. I have had them in the car since I bought my Supra in 2000
This time around though, I decided to upgrade since my power goals are much higher.
Duane
This time around though, I decided to upgrade since my power goals are much higher.
Duane
upgradedsupra said:620 on my OEM rods which have been shot peened. (I also had them checked for cracks before doing this) Mulitiple passes and TONS of miles on them. I have had them in the car since I bought my Supra in 2000
This time around though, I decided to upgrade since my power goals are much higher.
Duane
Thats impressive, but I have already been into my engine three times and the internals have over 230,000miles on them. This time is gonna be the last time I rebuild this engine.:1zhelp: :biglaugh:
I know of a tad over 800 on stock shot peened rods. I'm sure the car was driven like it was stolen at that level. The owner took a set of rods to a local F1 "laboratory". They told him to throw everything he could at those as they are extremely beefy pieces. He did 800+ and 8k rpms on that set.
I've NEVER heard of someone breaking a rod due to power. It's always detonation or a piston coming apart that kills the motor. If it were me, I'd push as much power as possible on those stock rods. I'd want to find the weak point.
I've NEVER heard of someone breaking a rod due to power. It's always detonation or a piston coming apart that kills the motor. If it were me, I'd push as much power as possible on those stock rods. I'd want to find the weak point.
well it looks like the verdict is in....... the weak point to the rods is either the bolts or the builder of the engine, not power