7m-gte Swap

[Party_Car]

Okay, so basically, I'm going to be dropping a rebuilt 7m and an r154 into my 95 240sx... First off, I'd like to say that I've searched an adequate amount of google, as well as 240sx and Supra forums, and I have yet to find a thread about someone actually swapping one into their 240. I've seen a couple pictures of the engine in the car, and there are a whole 2 videos of this swap on Youtube, so I still haven't found out all of the details, but I think I'm off to a good start. My main questions for you guys are as follows...

1. The engine is from a 91 Turbo, which means that a 1jz mounting kit should work, correct?

2. I've also read that I will need the oil pan from a Cressida due to sump location or something (I'm really not too mechanically inclined haha), is someone able to verify this?

This one may be geared more towards 240sx guys, but I'll ask it anyways:

3. Assuming a 1jz swap kit will work, will I need to modify/change the crossmember? There is a $1500 kit including everything (engine + tranny mounts/driveshaft/crossmember/shifter extender), but there is also just a mounting kit for $350, and the manufacturer says that no crossmember modification is necessary... But since it's a 7m going in, and not the intended jz, would it still work?

Like I said, I'm not too mechanically inclined, but I DO have help with the swap, I just need to source all the parts necessary. Any input is appreciated.

 

[unkillablepaseo]

"2. I've also read that I will need the oil pan from a Cressida due to sump location or something (I'm really not too mechanically inclined haha), is someone able to verify this?"

This questions depends on how the engine is going to sit in the bay. On Supra's the oil pan is in toward the firewall so the crossmember sits in front of the hump. I dont know how the engine will sit, take measurements. I think the Cressida pan is different though so be careful,

 

[Another MkIII]

2. I've also read that I will need the oil pan from a Cressida due to sump location or something (I'm really not too mechanically inclined haha), is someone able to verify this?

This could get interesting. :opcorn::

I'll be completely honest, an engine swap, especially with a 7M, is not for somebody who is not mechanically inclined. I would strongly consider starting off with a smaller project and working your way up from there. This engine can really become a money pit if you don't know what you are doing. Good luck with whatever you decide, and always feel free to ask for help.
-AM3

 

[AbsoluteSpeed]

1- A quick search tells me both 1J and 89+ 7M motor mounts are the same.
2- Might depend on the kit but you'll likely need the Cressida front sump pan.
All the 1J swapped 240's I looked up were front sump.

Links to the two kits might help.

 

[jdmfreak]

Interesting..... Will be watching this one

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

 

[Party_Car]

This could get interesting. :opcorn::

I'll be completely honest, an engine swap, especially with a 7M, is not for somebody who is not mechanically inclined. I would strongly consider starting off with a smaller project and working your way up from there. This engine can really become a money pit if you don't know what you are doing. Good luck with whatever you decide, and always feel free to ask for help.
-AM3

I realize this, which is why I'm definitely not going it alone, haha. I'm going to be doing this with the help of another member on the forums, who knows a lot more about this motor than I do. I'm basically going to be following in his footsteps as far as the rebuild goes (machine finish the block, MHG, ARP studs, port and polish the head). The both of us also know a few mechanics/machinists that can help us as well.

1- A quick search tells me both 1J and 89+ 7M motor mounts are the same.
2- Might depend on the kit but you'll likely need the Cressida front sump pan.
All the 1J swapped 240's I looked up were front sump.

Links to the two kits might help.

I did know that the 89+ mounts were the same as 1j, but I was wondering if the dimensions of the engines were significantly different enough to make the 1j mounts not work.

Links: Full Kit /// Engine/Tranny Mounts

Interesting..... Will be watching this one

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

Still in the earrrrly developmental stages, haha. I'm still planning everything out, but the engine rebuild will be commencing (sort of) this weekend, starting with the porting and polishing of the head. The 240 has the stock ka24de in it atm, and will be staying that way until I have every bit of the swap ready to go.

 

[AbsoluteSpeed]

My guess is that the second kit is going to place the motor really close to the firewall. That would be why the full kit extends the shifter housing.
Might be able to fix that with a BFH, but it's your money and your risk.

Edit: or you're expected to extend the housing yourself.

 

[unkillablepaseo]

1- A quick search tells me both 1J and 89+ 7M motor mounts are the same.
2- Might depend on the kit but you'll likely need the Cressida front sump pan.
All the 1J swapped 240's I looked up were front sump.

Links to the two kits might help.

Ok this comfirms my front sump theory on a 240sx!

 

[IJ.]

You'll also need a GTE Oil Pump with a custom pickup as the Cressida one is smaller volume and the pickup is cast into the Pump Cover from memory.

 

[Party_Car]

You'll also need a GTE Oil Pump with a custom pickup as the Cressida one is smaller volume and the pickup is cast into the Pump Cover from memory.

Okay, I shall keep this in mind for when the time comes.

UPDATE: So I just sent the head of the 7m out this weekend for a hot tank, decking, and port and polish, as well as port matching the manifolds. I guess the project has officially started! I'll be starting a complete swap thread later on, when I actually start fiddling with the chassis. I'm sure there are plenty of threads on engine rebuilds, so I'm not gonna go too in depth with that phase.

Anywho, I've done some searching, and will continue to do so, but I still haven't found a thread with all the information I need. If you guys happen to do any searching for me naughty, or come across ANYTHING that pertains to this swap, other than what has been covered thus far, don't hesitate to share! I've still got a bit of info to gather and a long ways to go, so every bit helps. In the meantime, though, I'm just going to be busy rebuilding the engine and sourcing all the parts needed for the swap (which has proven to be a slow process with school and only a part time job...), so don't expect to hear much about swap progress. Instead, expect to hear a lot more questions from this guy :icon_bigg .

Cheers guys.

Tyler.

 

[AbsoluteSpeed]

Goodluck with the swap. Hope to hear more about it as it comes together.

 

[Party_Car]

Hey guys, just a question about the head gasket situation...

I'm confused. For the head gasket in THIS KIT, would I have to get my block surface machined? It doesn't give a choice of head gasket thickness, so one would assume that it is different from Cometic's regular MLS head gaskets.

Secondly, if I don't need to machine the block for this, what kind of power/boost would the HG in this kit (along with ARP studs and proper torque) be able to withstand?

The engine I'm dealing with had a BHG, so I will be getting the block checked over when the time comes. I'd like to avoid any extensive work on the block if it isn't needed, as I'm only making so much money, and I'm a liiiittle bit anxious to get started on the swap. My power goals (initially) won't be too high, as this engine is going into a lighter car, and I haven't dealt with this kind of power/RWD combo before. I realize that the MHG route is the best way to go, but I'm just wondering how much this kit will be able to handle.

Thanks

Tyler

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

That's a MLS gasket, so yes. You need to have both block and head machined.

If the engine has had a BHG and it wasn't taken care of immediately, you'll want to have the block torn down and replace bearings anyway.

For power, I had a stock Toyota head gasket and ARP studs in my 7M, since I 'couldn't afford' to have the block torn down. The head gasket is fine, after running 18 PSI boost on a 60-1 turbo. (No dyno, don't know what that was in horsepower.) The car is now down for rod knock, and I'm building an engine from the block up.

 

[Party_Car]

Alright, I just found it strange because it didn't give an option of thickness.

How well do you think a new OEM replacement gasket and ARP head studs (torqued properly) would hold up on a stock turbo running around 10-12 PSI boost? Also, I had the head decked, so if I did run this setup and it DID end up blowing the HG, what are the chances that the surface on the head would be acceptable for a MHG afterwards? From what I gather, my initial power goals are very modest for this engine, and even then I'm not gonna be going balls-to-the-wall all the time.

 

[RazoE]

It all depends, I hit 12 psi without a boost controller/cats with just a 3" downpipe, 3" exhaust, and 2.5in IC piping. 300 hp is very do-able. It all depends on how bad the head is warped. If the temp spiked just once you could probably get away without any machining, but if the car severely over heated, then it might just be better to get a new head all together. 7MGE/GTE heads are the same, minus the intake cam.

 

[Grandavi]

http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?154954-my-s13-coupe-soon-to-be-2jz

Interesting thread, the OP may have info for you...

regarding the headgasket.. if you use ARP headstuds (installed EXACTLY as they instruct) and a metal headgasket... AND the head and block are prepped correctly, there is no reason for you to ever suffer from a bad headgasket. (providing you dont do something silly like run without fluids...)

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

I ran 18 PSI from a 60-1 turbo on my 7M-GTE. OEM head gasket, ARP studs torqued to 90 ft-lbs. The head gasket didn't give me problems, it was the rod knock that got me.

That said the "I did this and it worked" is probably the worst evidence that anyone can give. I'll supplement that with saying that the research and evidence that I found supported that the stock gasket should be able to take that without issue provided that I kept my AFRs in the safe zone (Running stock TCCS with Lexus/550 mod, so basically pig rich. Most likely that while in boost, AFRs were <10:1.) If the AFRs had gone lean, and I'd had any problems with detonation, the head gasket would likely not survived, but then again, the pistons wouldn't have survived for much longer.

I used a stock head gasket because at the time, I felt that I did not have the budget to have the block machined. Of course in retrospect, not doing it then has turned out to be far more expensive.

Edit: And it doesn't give an option for thickness, it's 0.051", which is about 1.3mm, so that's what it is.