I'm Building a supra 7mgte I'm in the process of buying pistons and making some work on the block to put piston .02 or .04.... But some people told me that wisseco are better than probe pistons others tell me probe are reliable... what piston will be better for a project...
What piston is better Probe or Wisseco?
- Thread starter peter551984
- Start date
peter551984;1475902 said:
it all depends on your budget ,probe has very reliable pistons for hell of a price cheaper than wisseco and je and theyl hold all the power you can throw at them
IMO, damn near anything is better than Probe.........
I have seen too many refferences to piss poor machine work.
I have been using Wiseco for years & years.
But have seen JE & CP pistons, and they are nice pieces.
Arias is a good piston also, and like Wiseco have been around since biblical times.
I have seen too many refferences to piss poor machine work.
I have been using Wiseco for years & years.
But have seen JE & CP pistons, and they are nice pieces.
Arias is a good piston also, and like Wiseco have been around since biblical times.
Do any pistons other and Wiseco have an equilvilent to "ArmorGlide"? And does it make much of a difference?
peter551984;1475902 said:
Im using the cp pistons.
Very happy with them. Ive found various stories about piston slap with both je and wiseco when researching my purchase. Cp had the tighther tolerance spec to them I believe, and claims to have less thermal expansion.
So far, not a decibel of piston slap and whatever rings they came with coupled with the machine work I got done have not caused a tiny bit of smoke or oil to burn upon start up or break in....
I'm kind of in a middle of a project so I really need some pistons but I don't want to spoil my money in Pistons that are expensive while cheaper pistons can do the same... basically my goal is from 500 to 600 hp
Why are people making recommendations when they haven't used the product?
I'm dumbfounded by this, you're all in the TECH SECTION if you don't know for sure STFU, there are very few people here that are running the 7M probes anywhere near 600rwhp, those that are by all means jump in and give your input.
There is a good knowledge base of the other brands that people can somewhat generalise but I'd still discourage this unless you have first hand experience to share.
he said she said my neighbours bosses cousin used them doesn't cut it, ditto on "experience" an any non 7M piston from a company as it means jack shit in this context.
Personally I've used Stock, ACL Cast, Ross forged and JE Forged, out of those I'd only suggest the Ross and JE's and to keep in mind they're each a very different piston, if you can't be 100% sure of a good tune then I'd go Ross, they're heavy as lead but have enogh mass and a nice ring set that stands up to abuse.
The JE's are great but being as light as they are will require a perfect tune to live and have a thin fluttery ring set.
I'm dumbfounded by this, you're all in the TECH SECTION if you don't know for sure STFU, there are very few people here that are running the 7M probes anywhere near 600rwhp, those that are by all means jump in and give your input.
There is a good knowledge base of the other brands that people can somewhat generalise but I'd still discourage this unless you have first hand experience to share.
he said she said my neighbours bosses cousin used them doesn't cut it, ditto on "experience" an any non 7M piston from a company as it means jack shit in this context.
Personally I've used Stock, ACL Cast, Ross forged and JE Forged, out of those I'd only suggest the Ross and JE's and to keep in mind they're each a very different piston, if you can't be 100% sure of a good tune then I'd go Ross, they're heavy as lead but have enogh mass and a nice ring set that stands up to abuse.
The JE's are great but being as light as they are will require a perfect tune to live and have a thin fluttery ring set.
A stock 2uzfe has piston slap from the factory and its very noticable. I have wiseco's in my 7M, compared to my old Tundra you can very barely hear piston slap in the 7M. Once warmed up you cant hear it at all. During cold start ups like I said you wouldnt even notice it.
Now the 2uzfe you can hear for sure on cold start ups. Almost sounds like a diesel. BUT when doing oil analysis comments are always good on the 2uz and very little particals are found in the oil that would cause premature wear. Matter of fact always get good comments and how the engine should last a long time and how I could go 10k oil changes with it.
The 7M had a good report too. My experience lies with wiseco and JE's. Both very good pistons imho. I'm sure others work well and you'll read more about them.
Now the 2uzfe you can hear for sure on cold start ups. Almost sounds like a diesel. BUT when doing oil analysis comments are always good on the 2uz and very little particals are found in the oil that would cause premature wear. Matter of fact always get good comments and how the engine should last a long time and how I could go 10k oil changes with it.
The 7M had a good report too. My experience lies with wiseco and JE's. Both very good pistons imho. I'm sure others work well and you'll read more about them.
dumbo;1475981 said:
i used the coated skirt and uncoated skirt wiseco's they both sound the same. Wiseco runs a dedicated forging for 7m so there is much less cnc work unlike the Je. However both their stock is purchased at the same place. In short it will come down to the tune, as you will not break either based on power alone.
I'll prefer just to put some Probe if it a low budget and looking more for power not name... basically PROBE, wisseco they look good and have some credits on their work but for now PROBE... I plan to put some probe on a 7MGE to make it turbo and basically take about 700HP to the wheels, since it will be use on a drag and some times as daily driving....
i heard probes are machined in china...you get what you pay for buddy has a set of CP's for his 7mgte they are beautiful however have no experience with either.
Actually, no, it's not *all* in the tune. That's only half of the equation.
The tune will affect premature failure due to two things - combustion temps too high, causing melted or burned pistons, and detonation, causing smashed or cracked pistons.
The piston design will affect longevity as well, but due to different factors. Quench, ring design and placement, and several other factors. Piston design failures could cause the block to wear unevenly, the face of the piston to burn due to hot spots during combustion, etc.
I'm not saying that the Probe design is bad. That's a call to be made by others with more knowledge than I. What I *am* saying is that they are an unknown. Until there are several examples of 500hp engines, built properly and run hard for years, then torn down and the results posted, they will continue to be unknown. This kind of feedback is unlikely to appear soon, for a number of reasons. The number of 500hp builds just isn't that high. The number of 500hp builds that are finished is even smaller. The number of 500hp builds that are finished and run for at least a few years, without getting parted out or wrapped around a pole, then are torn down to check how the internals are holding up... well, I suspect you'll be able to count those using just your thumbs, if you're willing to wait another couple years.
The tune will affect premature failure due to two things - combustion temps too high, causing melted or burned pistons, and detonation, causing smashed or cracked pistons.
The piston design will affect longevity as well, but due to different factors. Quench, ring design and placement, and several other factors. Piston design failures could cause the block to wear unevenly, the face of the piston to burn due to hot spots during combustion, etc.
I'm not saying that the Probe design is bad. That's a call to be made by others with more knowledge than I. What I *am* saying is that they are an unknown. Until there are several examples of 500hp engines, built properly and run hard for years, then torn down and the results posted, they will continue to be unknown. This kind of feedback is unlikely to appear soon, for a number of reasons. The number of 500hp builds just isn't that high. The number of 500hp builds that are finished is even smaller. The number of 500hp builds that are finished and run for at least a few years, without getting parted out or wrapped around a pole, then are torn down to check how the internals are holding up... well, I suspect you'll be able to count those using just your thumbs, if you're willing to wait another couple years.
I know that most of the power is from a good tunner and good combinations, but, let's see what is the product cost effect, what piston will be better.... they told me that Probe are use on other kind of cars that are making ton of power... If I buy JE it will be playing safe but, it will be more expensive so their will not be cost effect... More expensive for more power jummmm makes sense but If I can make Not so expensive for more power it will be perfect...
there's a guy on this board that has made 700 some odd to the wheels using complete stock internals. did i last long? no idea but i will say as long as you do research, properly machine your block and be exact about the tune you do. then you should be just fine.
also i prefer wisecos as that is the only piston ive used on subaru engines. makes em sound like a diesle but they are damn strong pistons
also i prefer wisecos as that is the only piston ive used on subaru engines. makes em sound like a diesle but they are damn strong pistons
The noise issue particularly has a lot to do with piston material. There are two basic aluminum alloys used in piston manufacturing, 2618 and 4032. Both of them have their advantages. 2618 is normally just used for race cars, mainly because the higher silicon content increases the expansion rate and elasticity of the matrerial which requires more piston-to-wall clearence. Thats why these pistons tend to have a slight "slap" at cold temps. This material is not meant for long service life, as the material becomes annealed and ruins the effective sealing of the piston.
4032 pistons have a lower silicon content, which reduces the thermal expansion of the material, resulting in a tightetr piston to wall clearence. These pistons are normally used for street cars, and road racing applications. The disadvantage is the resistance to "faulty tunes". They are very sensitive to detonation.
As far as manufacturer, i am very partial to MAHLE. By far the best I have ever used on any application. Ive given off the shelf Probes two chances, and they have dissapointed me on both occasions. There machining process gives the piston a horrible looking skirt wear pattern after use. Just seems like they are the "quantity over quality" type of manufacturer, just my opinion.
4032 pistons have a lower silicon content, which reduces the thermal expansion of the material, resulting in a tightetr piston to wall clearence. These pistons are normally used for street cars, and road racing applications. The disadvantage is the resistance to "faulty tunes". They are very sensitive to detonation.
As far as manufacturer, i am very partial to MAHLE. By far the best I have ever used on any application. Ive given off the shelf Probes two chances, and they have dissapointed me on both occasions. There machining process gives the piston a horrible looking skirt wear pattern after use. Just seems like they are the "quantity over quality" type of manufacturer, just my opinion.
I have ran
stock
ross
je's molly and thermo coated
I must say ross can take a bloody beating je's not so much
probs I dis like the vavle cuts and the spaceing of them is rather poor and is the week link if they fixed that then I whould not have an issue
but tell that is fix I will never run them or recomend them
the next piston I might run next is the titain street pistons or wiseco's
stock
ross
je's molly and thermo coated
I must say ross can take a bloody beating je's not so much
probs I dis like the vavle cuts and the spaceing of them is rather poor and is the week link if they fixed that then I whould not have an issue
but tell that is fix I will never run them or recomend them
the next piston I might run next is the titain street pistons or wiseco's