Transmission Problems

[1988ma70supra]

First off, i have an 88 turbo with the R-154, it has the stage 3 clutch with the 6 puck design. Now for the problem. When i engage first gear it slips out. This doesn't happen all the time. It has started to do it more and more often though. I called and asked a transmission place and they said they couldn't just fix first gear so they quoted me $600 to do an overhaul on the tranny with 6 months warranty. What do you guys think?

 

[str8_6]

call or email www.marlincrawler.com and get their opinion/price. they are one of the best at building r series transmission. they do heavy duty bearings along with some "secret" supposedly. i completely trust them though.

 

[1988ma70supra]

Marlin Crawler hasn't responded yet but I've looked online and the main problem that i have seen with the R-154 is that the thrust washer doesn't seem to hold up and the first gear seems to go out which explains my problem. Now here's a new question does the whole transmission have to be rebuilt for the thrust washer to be replaced?

 

[shiftysupra]

No, it does not, but since you'd have the transmission apart you might as well as rebuild it to avoid other future problems

 

[1988ma70supra]

No, it does not, but since you'd have the transmission apart you might as well as rebuild it to avoid other future problems

Good point do you happen to know if the $600 dollar quote they gave me with a 6 month warranty is a good deal?

 

[Poodles]

Marlin is going to be expensive, but it's upgraded and they usually replace the gears as well.

You'll have to break it in as well. People seem to think diffs and trannies don't need to be broken in, big misconseption...

 

[Scott 88-1JZ]

I figured I would chime in since I have my tranny at Marlin right now. These guys seem to be pretty good. The price I got quoted was about $1200 for a full rebuild which include new synchros, rings, bearings, and all the upgraded Marlin goodies and a 1 year unlimited mileage waranty. The only thing it does not include are the actual gears themselves. So far they have thoroughly inspected my tranny and reported back to me the condition of it before they continued the work. As it turns out due to drag racing abuse by the previous owner my main shaft was bent and the 1-2 hub and 1st gear were damaged. The guys were cool enough and found me a mainshaft and 1-2 hub that were laying around but I had to order 1st gear from toyota for $160. They can also trouble shoot your tranny and replace only what is needed for less. Supposedly with all this work it should be a stout tranny.

 

[Poodles]

They know what they're doing and they take pride in their work (they sign the transmission when it's done).

There is a simple rebuild, and a full blueprinted tranny, guess which one they do...

 

[str8_6]

does the $600 include taking the transmission out?
if so, thats not a bad deal at all. I would buy the upgraded bearings though and have them install that too if they are willing. some shops will only waranty the parts that THEY buy. It should not down the cost a little bit on their part being that you'll supply some parts.

I would definitely do some more calling though. Shops are getting desparate these days hassle with them.

 

[Poodles]

You get what you pay for...

 

[Scott 88-1JZ]

You get what you pay for...

I agree, Thats why I went to Marlin. I doubt the 600 would cover R+R if it does that is a hell of a deal if they do good work. From the sales guy at Marlin it sounds like he is blue printing my tranny. He also asked how tight I want it to shift so they can design in the feel of it to I guess.

 

[1988ma70supra]

does the $600 include taking the transmission out?
if so, thats not a bad deal at all. I would buy the upgraded bearings though and have them install that too if they are willing. some shops will only waranty the parts that THEY buy. It should not down the cost a little bit on their part being that you'll supply some parts.

I would definitely do some more calling though. Shops are getting desparate these days hassle with them.

yeah they told me the $600 would include everything. i was referenced to this guy from my dad. He has had some work done to 3 automatic transmissions for his company trucks and they have all come out really good. he priced him $600 for the automatics and i thought standards were supposed to be easier so that's why i though it was a bit high. im going to ask him if he can install the marlin bearings and the thrust washer for me and see what he says.

 

[black89t]

^well that $600 can go up real fast if when they take it apart and it looks something like this. it was $110 for new 1st gear from champion. and i had to get the 1-2 hub $90 from champion. let alone new syncros, snaprings, bearings, seals, ect... all being from toyota is going to run you a pretty penny i can tell you that. in the picture that is the side that goes against the 1-2 hub. they both got chewed to hell. so did that bearing. which then finally crushed the thrust washer. if you ask me the internal wear over time is going to happen no matter what the thrust washer is made of. instead of crushing the thrust washer it will keep tearing into the bearing, gear, and hub. there is no real cure to have it last forever. in my eyes the best you can do is build it to the standards it was built from the get go and it should go well over 100k.

 

[Poodles]

My theory is that because of the helical cut gears (to reduce noise), torque makes the gears walk a bit on the shafts.

Wear happens, and especially the front bearing cover flexes causing play in the assembly. This allows shock loads to the parts and the thrust washers. As the torque and gear reduction is worst for the lower gears that's the thrust washer that fails.

A good example is Duane where his tranny was rebuilt before he pumped tons of power through it and it held up fine.

Quality of the rebuild matters a lot as well, as just changing out the syncros and bearings won't put the parts back into spec, and the play still exists.

Having a tranny with partial straight cut gears (like 1st through 3rd) would fix the problem permanently I'd imagine, and still allow quiet operation on the highway...