questions, advice regarding hg replacement, tips, tricks, etc

[queenskid926]

well as with any mkiii owner career its time to change the headgasket.

I know its possible to do it with the motor in the car and easier to do while its out so is it worth it to take the extra time to pull the motor out to change the headgasket? (only because i just put this motor in, yes i kno i shoulda checked or change the hg be4 i put it in silly me)


how long does it take to change the headgasket with the motor in the car?

Best way to remove the old gasket off the block and head?

any genral tips?

Thanks in advance
Ron

 

[mdr40z]

Please take the motor back out and do it right, re-surface the block to the best finish the shop can put on it (usually where you can't catch the mill marks with your fingernail or better)
You'll be better off in the long run (make sure to leave the timing cover on)
Have them check the head for straightness while you're at it, just carefully remove old gasket with a putty knife or gasket scraper

 

[Muzy]

This should help http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2029 :icon_bigg muzy

 

[mdr40z]

This should help http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2029 :icon_bigg muzy

nah, that takes longer. If you're going to leave it in the car pull the mani's with the head..... way faster

 

[KicknAsphlt]

It really depends on what gasket you're putting on -- if you're going to go full MHG, then you're better off pulling the motor like was mentioned. If you're just replacing with a Fel-Pro or other graphite/composite gasket, then I'd do it on the car. The fastest way by far to pull the gasket material off the block surface (I hate scrapers, never gets it all) is to use a drill and as fine of a wire wheel that you can get. You could also do the head surface with this, but you want to press with practically no pressure at all. While you're in there, you can also clean the piston tops as well. I know some will balk and mention that this is the "wrong" way to clean the gasket off, but I've never had any issues on iron or aluminum surfaces doing it that way. Keep in mind though, this is ONLY if you're going to run a stock-type head gasket for your replacement...there, I've said my disclaimer now...LOL!

My cousin also told me he has this cool little gizmo that I guess is like a flapper wheel or scotchbrite-like wheel and takes the gasket right off of the surface...I'll see if I can get a pic sometime this weekend.

 

[CyFi6]

I dont think i would ever use one of those on the aluminum, but that is me. I think the biggest problem with recommending that is the person will read it and totally disregard or not understand what no pressure means and end up digging into stuff.

 

[suprarx7nut]

Lol, you've been around here long enough to know to change the HG on a used motor...

Take the motor out, get both the head and block resurfaced, insert MHG.

Read up on adjuster's post about reinstalling the head as well. Great info there. http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38956&highlight=head

 

[KicknAsphlt]

I dont think i would ever use one of those on the aluminum, but that is me. I think the biggest problem with recommending that is the person will read it and totally disregard or not understand what no pressure means and end up digging into stuff.

Well, with the fine wheel, you have a little bit of leeway with pressure -- I've actually pressed fairly hard cleaning the intake manifold on my truck, and it barely touched it. That's the great thing with the graphite gaskets though, you do have a bit of room to play with, because the soft material will conform and fill in the imperfections. If he's on a time table, leave the motor in the car, pull head, clean with wheel, reinsert stock-ish gasket, bolt it all back up. I mean hell, if he wants to go MHG, then pull the motor...but then you've got to disassemble the block, and hell...while you're in there....LOL!

 

[CyFi6]

^Thats what sucks... While youre in there...just spend another $10,000 and do it right... lol.

 

[KicknAsphlt]

Ed Zachary! I got lucky and had to replace shit anyway....some jackhole put the wrong bearing on the #5 Main on my replacement block....D'OH! So, it kind of made my decision for me....another MHG (and properly this time, damn PO) since the block had to come apart anyway...LOL!

 

[queenskid926]

ight guys thanks for the info, its just a stock replacement hg with arp bolts for now.

I'm all about doing stuff the most efficient way and i know that pulling the motor and doing it is easier and is required when going with a mhg but like i said its just a stock and wanted to weigh pulling the motor to make changing the headgasket easier or busting up a couple knuckles with the motor still being in the car.

And finding some shortcuts from ppl ith exsperience doing this before, For example like leaving the exhaust and intake lower runner attached to the head when pulling instead of taking those off, just lil tips and tricks.

so about how many hrs of labor is a hg job?

 

[queenskid926]

Lol, you've been around here long enough to know to change the HG on a used motor...

Take the motor out, get both the head and block resurfaced, insert MHG.

Read up on adjuster's post about reinstalling the head as well. Great info there. http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38956&highlight=head

lol yea bro im just tryna get some new tips, techniques. learn some things that can make the job easier.

 

[KicknAsphlt]

ight guys thanks for the info, its just a stock replacement hg with arp bolts for now.

I'm all about doing stuff the most efficient way and i know that pulling the motor and doing it is easier and is required when going with a mhg but like i said its just a stock and wanted to weigh pulling the motor to make changing the headgasket easier or busting up a couple knuckles with the motor still being in the car.

And finding some shortcuts from ppl ith exsperience doing this before, For example like leaving the exhaust and intake lower runner attached to the head when pulling instead of taking those off, just lil tips and tricks.

so about how many hrs of labor is a hg job?

I would think you could have the head pulled in about an hour, and maybe two to put it back on....*shrug* But, also keep in mind...since you're pulling the head, you might as well get it checked for straightness.

 

[JDMMA70]

ight guys thanks for the info, its just a stock replacement hg with arp bolts for now.

I'm all about doing stuff the most efficient way and i know that pulling the motor and doing it is easier and is required when going with a mhg but like i said its just a stock and wanted to weigh pulling the motor to make changing the headgasket easier or busting up a couple knuckles with the motor still being in the car.

And finding some shortcuts from ppl ith exsperience doing this before, For example like leaving the exhaust and intake lower runner attached to the head when pulling instead of taking those off, just lil tips and tricks.

so about how many hrs of labor is a hg job?

When i pulled my head i didnt have a engine hoist and live in an apartment so i had no choice. I had a friend (Bluechulappa) help me out with it, took 3 hours or so mainly because i was fighting with the oil feed pipe on the block, and the manifold nuts. Fastest ive done it is in an hour and a half on a N/A. I just moved the lower Intake Manifold to the side and left the exhaust manifold bolted on for turbo and unbolted it on the N/A.

It took me a day and a half putting everything back because i didnt want to mess up anything im very tedius about it. However i wouldve liked to have pulled the motor for a MHG but im rebuilding the spare motor i have anyway and the stock OEM HG done right like having the head machined will last quite a bit.

 

[black89t]

^Thats what sucks... While youre in there...just spend another $10,000 and do it right... lol.

:werd:

its endless as far as the "right way" being that its just some dudes opinion and he isn't the one paying for it.

i don't get where people think that a mhg it the only option for a 7m. actually i find it funny how some will swear by it yet they have never even ran a new stocker or they do and it magically blows. LOL!!!!!!! i did mine about a year ago with a felpro hg. works fine and i dd my car. it took me maybe 2 hours to get the head off. most of that was going to sears to get the 1/2" 12 point socket for the suprise arp bolts because the 13mm 12 point was just too loose. i think its easier to just unbolt the whole intake mani and just set it to the side. my car doesn't have ac though so that might make it easier and i'm pretty dam good with a wobbler. anyway this is what it looks like if you want to get the head off as fast and as simple possible.


oh and i just clean it up with a scrapper. you don't have to get all crazy on it. just make sure things aren't too warped and you'll have a solid seal.

 

[shaeff]

I'd pull the motor to do it, personally. Then again, pulling the motor is so easy, that I do it even just to change my oil.








:sarcasm:

 

[Satan]

Unless I was going to change the front and rear seals, I wouldn't pull the engine. I disconnect the knock sensors and other wiring going below the head, disconnect the harness at the ECU, then remove the head with the manifolds/harness still on (only taking things apart that would keep the head from coming off).

Did it once to buy time, but knew that I'd be taking the head to the machine shop the next time. I had overheated it a couple of times and knew I'd have some warpage to deal with.

Did it 2 other times when I knew the head was fine. Of course, these were on 2 of my other MKIIIs.

Just use a couple of new razorblades to scrape the gasket material off. Try to scrape away from the cylinders and oil/coolant ports. Just run water for a day and then flush/fill with coolant when you know there's no leak to deal with. Same with the oil (run cheap stuff for a day and replace with your favorite).

Oh... also, removing the head and attached pieces allows you to put it on a bench and strip it down for the machine shop, without leaning over the car and wearing your back out.

 

[queenskid926]

I'd pull the motor to do it, personally. Then again, pulling the motor is so easy, that I do it even just to change my oil.








:sarcasm:

this is what i ended up doing, i realized that i had to change the oil pressure sender so now the motor is out its so much easier to do while its out the car. will post the carnage in my build thread.

 

[easternguy2005]

I did mine about a month ago. Having the rachetting box wrench helps alot. I also used a battery powered drill with a socket adapter.

Did the Napa replacement for the center valve cover which made things easier later.

Take pictures too before disassembly.

 

[SC Rydah]

Yeah queens i was thinking about doing mine with the motor in, bcuz I don't have a hoist yet. But...I was also thinking of getting another motor and doing the hg on THAT one and a hoist and replace it. My back was hurting putting my HID's in so i can imagine what a hg job can do to it!! But when your back is to the wall, make it hurt n do what u gotta do to replace your hg!