no knock sensor!

[Godspeed]

is it possible to run without a ks? cuz my wifes old 87 na auto when i started parting it out the ks wire had been cut and it still ran good. but it unfortunatly broke a rod. but is it possible to run with out one? i know its not a very good idea im just asking.

 

[Nick M]

is it possible to run without a ks?

the ks wire had been cut and it still ran good

I did a simple search and found the answer.

 

[Godspeed]

i tried searching for it and couldnt come up with it. maybe i just dont know how to use search right!!lol i'll figure it out

 

[davidtt87]

lol he took that from ur post lamo

 

[Godspeed]

lol i knew that but i thought he was being serious haha.

 

[davidtt87]

lol yes u can run actually quite well without knock sensors and sometimes better than before. if it runs better that means something is wrong and that ur car is pulling timing when it isnt suppose to be. the whole trick to having knock sensors is too run like they're not even there while still having them remain active.

 

[jetjock]

Good grief....and I thought the same thread in the turbo section was sorry. At least in that one there's some valid info. Shaeff seems to be one of the few with a clue.

 

[davidtt87]

i love how u bash all our posts and actually if im so wrong than why not post the real way a knock sensor is suppose to work. since obviously saying that when it detects detonation it pulls timing is wrong.

 

[supramacist]

Ya!

 

[SupraDerk]

Yeah I wouldn't recommend it especially since we have high compression engines. I don't know about you but I run 93 octane in my car which burns slower than anything less which means more of a chance of detonation. The point in the knock sensor is to detect the knock caused by detonation and then retard timing low enough to get rid of the knock. The knock sensor finds the tiny waves caused by the explosion (detonation) or burning of the gas (what should happen) and turns them into a signal and then either retarding timing or doing nothing based on what it detects. So if you have no knock sensor detecing detonation I'd say you're just setting yourself up for spending a couple hundred bucks farther down the line.

 

[davidtt87]

i agree with supraderk the only time i got rid of knocksensors was when i didnt care about the motor and just wanted to kill the car so we cud send it to the junkyard. and im soooooooooooo sick of people bashing other people cause of low post count. this is like the 4th or 5th sports car i've either built, modded, or worked heavily with.

 

[SupraDerk]

^Yeah the NA section has had this BAD, but I think as our section grows and NA tech thinking progresses we'll have less problems.

-Derek

 

[Godspeed]

post count doesnt mean anything i have near 1000 and still dont know it all or even half.

 

[jetjock]

93 octane in my car which burns slower than anything less which means more of a chance of detonation.

Now that's exactly the kind of complete nonsense and misinformation I'm talking about.

David: If you're going to come here and disseminate similair misinformation you're going to get called on it. I "obviously" never said timing wan't retarded when knock is detected. Of course it is.You're just wrong about everything else. The question concerned what steps the ecu's diagnostic routine takes when the sensor faults and not what steps the ecu takes if knock is detected during normal operation.

Am I supposed to spell out how it all works again? Wasn't several times by Shaeff and myself enough? In other words piss off. I've forgotten more about this stuff than you'll ever know. How's that for some more love?

 

[SupraDerk]

I'm sorry, the higher the octane number the slower the gas DOES burn, but the second part of my statement is incorrect, the higher the octane number the more resistance to detonation you should have.

Jetjock: There's no need to be a dick about anything, a simple counter-response to what I had to say would have been fine. You caused me to look it up again and find the answer, but you don't have to be an ass.

 

[jetjock]

Not being a dick, only using your post as an example of the misinformation that happens here. You should check your facts or state you're not sure....those less informed depend on the forum for accurate information. And yes, I was referring to your statement that higher octane leads to an increased chance of detonation. Nothing could be further from the truth. Octane is (by definition) a measure of resistance to detonation.

At least you learned something. Here's hoping david takes the same opportunity.

 

[Yellow 13]

my wifes old 87 na auto when i started parting it out the ks wire had been cut and it still ran good. but it unfortunatly broke a rod.

I think you may have gotten the broken rod from not having a knock sensor.

You can run without one, I did on both of my supras but youll have a high chance of causing damage to your engine without it.

 

[jetjock]

The point many seem to not understand is a knock sensor fault does more than set code 52. When the knock sensor(s) is disconnected or otherwise faulted the ecu will retard timing. It retards timing in a different way than if the sensor was connected and sensing knock but retard timing it does.

The bottom line is anytime you're running around with a code 52 your engine timing is being retarded, not because of knock but because the sensor input faulted. Since the ecu knows knock protection has failed it takes measures to prevent knock from happening in the first place. One of those measures is to retard ignition timing. At the same moment other things also happen in the EFI system, all in an attempt to prevent detonation from occuring in an engine which has lost the ability to detect it. This information comes straight from Toyota.

Do not confuse what the diagnostic software of the ecu does versus what the "normal" software does. Code 52 is diagnostic only and is *not* set if knock occurs. It *is* set if a sensor fault occurs. The point is timing is effected in either case.

I can't make it any clearer than that.

 

[IJ.]

<mod hat on> Lets keep it civil guys <mod hat off>

 

[jetjock]

Civil smivil. I'm not gonna let some wet behind ears snot nosed "smaat noob" tell me how the thing works when he obviously doesn't have a clue and can't even form a sentence. You can always ban my ass. Ever seen the ending to the film Platoon? Just do it . Good thing I'm on my way to Chernobyl. I need a break from this place...