my 87 build.

[rwdanthony]

hey guys! I'm coming from the lexus community; my past cars were a sc300 w/ gt3071r, then a sc400.

now onto the supra... well i just bought my dads supra which has been in the family since it was on the lot back in '88. my car is a '87 8E3 7mge auto MKIII. one weird thing i thought about it is it has the sport package of ABS and the LSD. but it wasn't equipped with the TEMS. anyways, it did have a BHG at ~50k miles, pulled it out and swapped another 7mge in it. the chassis now has 59k miles while the original block is being built. as you already know the block has 50k on it. my build?

mechanically and electronically, 7mgte na-t, using the same head, and block with na pistons.

work/part list:
bearing clearances check
main king bearings
rod king bearings
honed cylinders
lapped valves
valve stem seals
full gasket and oil seal replacement
NPR 1st, 2nd, and oil rings
NGK copper 2330 plugs gapped at .30"
NGK blue silicon wireset
HKS 1.2 MHG
arp studs @ 95 FT LBS
failsafe thermostat 160*
7mgte mt harness
7mgte mt ecu
7mgte cluster
7mgte cams
7mgte upper intake manifold
7mgte full oem intercooler system
7mgte tb
7mgte tps
7mgte iacv
7mgte cps
7mgte 3000 pipe
7mgte cam covers
7mgte turbo manifold
7mgte intake system
7mgte 440s
7mgte Igniter
7mgte Coil Packs
7mgte oil filter bracket
7mgte oil cooler
7mgte oil cooler return fitting
7mgte power-steering reservoir and bracket
rebuilt ct26
r154 with driveshaft
stage 3 pp with 6puck clutch

my r154 hasnt been able to shift so i cracked it open and checked things out. ended up replacing them along with new seals and a few MC parts.

some electronics

got the r154 back together, shifts really smoothly now.
same day i got my clutch kit from the mail:
stage 3 heavy duty pressure plate (seems to be from toyota?)
"miba" 6 puck copper ceramic, sprung
nachi bearing.

oil return bung welded, water outlet welded, oil fittings and lines made, fitted.

welded up my mounts. im cheap.

shortened shifter by 1"-1.5", clutch master, slave, and ss braided clutch line.
clutch disk, pressure plate, r154... installed

got lots of work done today, figured out the vacuum lines, hoses, gte dipstick, turbo mounted, oil feed and return lines installed. tranny mount installed, etc, etc.

i then realized my oil return bung was siting right above the full oil level, just to be safe i moved it up, only downfall is that i have to rotate my mount if i want to remove the oil return line on the bottom.

 

[xzeror]

so much win *_*. Great build so far!

 

[ask92]

Looks awesome!! Any shots of the car? What kind of downpipe is that? Also what brand/kit of gaskets and seals are you gonna be using?

 

[Chambers]

Very nice, the welds look great.

 

[rwdanthony]

thanks! other than the hks hg, the rest are mixed with toyota, eristic, and felpro. the build is practically 99% done, ready to be dropped in, just been holding it off due to school. theres nothing special about the car right now though.

but i did get this in.

 

[mecevans]

Issues I see...

Thermostat. NO.
Is that transmission FIPG for your pan?
Not a fan of king bearings
Block,head, and timing cover decked smooth enough for MHG?
N/a pistons + 1.2 HG and possible machined engine will have really high comp!
Fram. Eww. Wouldent even use it to break in the engine.

 

[rwdanthony]

what do you mean no on thermostat?
its actually red rtv, i did it on my na-t sc300 and it held fine.
yes it was decked smooth enough for a mhg.
high compression yes, im not looking to pass 10-12 psi on this.
fram... i thought the same thing! ended up changing it with a supertech filter.

if you see any other issues, please tell me! constructive criticism is always allowed.

 

[Poodles]

T-stat temp is too low.
King bearings aren't the best (I'm being nice).
High compression on stock pistons isn't a good idea. Especially since you don't have oil squirters.
95ft/lbs on the ARP studs is overtorquing them (unless you didn't use the supplied lube).
That looks to be a chinese DDP. Does it have the divider plate sticking out for the flange? If not, it won't work.
Ditch the stock oil cooler circuit and go with a t-stat based full flow cooler circuit.

 

[mecevans]

the ECM need the coolant temp to be around 195F to funtion properly. A colder thermostat does not equate to cooler combustion temps so no performance is gained. the engine needs to be that temp for best combustion/ efficiency. extra heat can be dealt with by upgrading the radiator or going with a full flow cooler.

iirc my arp studs with thier lube was 82 ft/ib

I dont have squirters either but my engine was planned out to compensate for this. i have an upgraded cooling and oiling system and plan on methanol down the road. Devin Leblanc is using ethanol on his Na-t to combat detonation. you definitely should think about dyno time anything past stock boost to make sure your ok.

another thing to consider...

when you start stiffing up components,that road shock has to get transmitted elsewhere. this with either go into the chassis and cause premature failure/cracks or into 20 year old bushings, ball joints, shocks, springs,etc and kill them in no time.

 

[Devin LeBlanc]

Looks decently good overall however Im betting you with have some detonation with the block and head being decked and using a thiner than stock head gasket on high comp pistons.. With the stock N/A pistons I am running with a Stock 1.37mm thick head gasket, head was decked not block at 10 Psi with the timing at stock its detonating bad.. And when I mean bad it sounds like 100's of marbles being dropped on a concrete floor. Im not saying it cant be overcome Im just saying watch out for it because it takes a trained ear to catch it.. If you retard the timing slightly it will help but it however will cause some timing issues under WOT.

The easiest way around this is get rid of the stock ECU so you have full timing control via a table in the ECU, or run higher octane gas, and last meth injection. Choose one of those and you will be good, otherwise you'll probably end up melting a piston at higher than stock (6-7Psi boost)

Otherwise looks good, I wouldn't even start that motor up with the fram filter. OEM Toyota's are 6.00 from driftmotion, I'd go with that

Good Luck, keep it updated!

Mecevans: Forgot the N

 

[mecevans]

where?

 

[Devin LeBlanc]

Okay, you fixed it no fair..

Back on topic, There's no point in using the HKS PFC and the Apexi Neo, Ditch the HKS Fcon and just use the Neo for tuning, using a wide band of course

 

[rwdanthony]

T-stat temp is too low.
King bearings aren't the best (I'm being nice).
High compression on stock pistons isn't a good idea. Especially since you don't have oil squirters.
95ft/lbs on the ARP studs is overtorquing them (unless you didn't use the supplied lube).
That looks to be a chinese DDP. Does it have the divider plate sticking out for the flange? If not, it won't work.
Ditch the stock oil cooler circuit and go with a t-stat based full flow cooler circuit.

yeah king bearings are from what i heard are like base quality.
it is a generic ddp, and i had to weld the divider in myself.
i was thinking about doing the t-stat from like the fc rx7s, but this build is kinda low budget, so please keep in mind im not trying to go all out.
i already know this build wont last me long. for the arp head studs, i used the supplied lube and i actually searched up on other methods on which is best for torquing them down, i found an answer either on here or on SF. even the guy said it was overkill, but he never had any issues with it.

---------- Post added at 01:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:51 AM ----------

the ECM need the coolant temp to be around 195F to funtion properly. A colder thermostat does not equate to cooler combustion temps so no performance is gained. the engine needs to be that temp for best combustion/ efficiency. extra heat can be dealt with by upgrading the radiator or going with a full flow cooler.

iirc my arp studs with thier lube was 82 ft/ib

I dont have squirters either but my engine was planned out to compensate for this. i have an upgraded cooling and oiling system and plan on methanol down the road. Devin Leblanc is using ethanol on his Na-t to combat detonation. you definitely should think about dyno time anything past stock boost to make sure your ok.

another thing to consider...

when you start stiffing up components,that road shock has to get transmitted elsewhere. this with either go into the chassis and cause premature failure/cracks or into 20 year old bushings, ball joints, shocks, springs,etc and kill them in no time.

about the ECM @195F i was unaware about this. and thank you for teaching me this. i will be swapping this out now. i was thinking exactly that, but i guess i didnt know that much yet. i guess i should focus on having the engine at normal operating temperatures, and just alter the cooling systems like the radiator, and fmic.

i already took consideration about the stiffening. i bought some battle version links, and i may replace the bushings on the control arms once theyre toast with polyurethane bushings or possibly make more delrin bushings like i did with my sc300. car is going on a full one-off coilover suspension, etc.

---------- Post added at 02:04 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:57 AM ----------

Looks decently good overall however Im betting you with have some detonation with the block and head being decked and using a thiner than stock head gasket on high comp pistons.. With the stock N/A pistons I am running with a Stock 1.37mm thick head gasket, head was decked not block at 10 Psi with the timing at stock its detonating bad.. And when I mean bad it sounds like 100's of marbles being dropped on a concrete floor. Im not saying it cant be overcome Im just saying watch out for it because it takes a trained ear to catch it.. If you retard the timing slightly it will help but it however will cause some timing issues under WOT.

The easiest way around this is get rid of the stock ECU so you have full timing control via a table in the ECU, or run higher octane gas, and last meth injection. Choose one of those and you will be good, otherwise you'll probably end up melting a piston at higher than stock (6-7Psi boost)

Otherwise looks good, I wouldn't even start that motor up with the fram filter. OEM Toyota's are 6.00 from driftmotion, I'd go with that

Good Luck, keep it updated!

Mecevans: Forgot the N

stock hgs are at 1.37mm? i thought they were at 1.2mm... i feel now that i should replace the 1.2mhg for a possibly a 2.0 stopper.
fram filter was already taken out last week, but anyways you later mentioned to just take out the hks pfc, i was thinking about just using this when i break in the motor, and then finer tune it with the afc neo. would it still just be pointless? ive read your build thread on your ge-t, devin and honestly made me pull the trigger on this. so i guess in the end, with a higher compression turbo, youre going to want to up the octane and or fuel correct?

 

[airhead04]

My arp is torqued to 100ft lbs. and I know quite a few others who have done the same and its holding fine.

 

[Poodles]

Good way to damage the head. There is a reason the studs come with a torque spec.

 

[laotionracer101]

LOL @ king bearings ( DO NOT USE ) try the ninth rebuild Due to rod knock. MMMkay?!? acl or clevite C:

 

[Devin LeBlanc]

King are not that bad, our 700HP LS2 Powered 240Sx Formula drift car has King rod and main bearings..

 

[Poodles]

Different motor, so not comparable.

 

[rwdanthony]

well maybe its a hit or miss, hopefully itll be alright. im still looking for a 7mgte egr valve. after that i can swap it in already.

anyone know where i can find wiring diagrams for the afc neo? all i can find are safc2...

 

[Devin LeBlanc]

www.apexi-usa.com They are right in plain sight..

I have a EGR valve 80.00 shipped

Let me know